SWAPA has a transition agreement

[jonjuan]

A cowboy, a priest and a hooker walked into a bar.................

Does the priest like little boys?

 

[PapaWoody]

Bobby,

Every recent arbitration award disagrees with you. Now, I know you don't fly for either airline (just like me), and you are entitled to your opinion. Maybe you should sign up to be an arbitrator. I know one side that would do anything to give you a shot at it.


Bye Bye--General Lee

I'm not saying that a staple would be fair or equitable, but I will point out that you always seem to conveniently "forget" about the Chautaqua/Shuttle America arbitrated award, GL. Was recent, was a lot more similar to our situation than NW/DL, was arbitrated according to Allegheney/Mohawk, pay and benefit disparity was an issue, and the final result wasn't even close to relative seniority. But keep only including examples that support your assertion that "relative seniority is the law". And we'll keep disregarding every vitriolic thing you say. Deal? Deal. Good talk.

Fraternally,
PapaWoody

 

[gt1900]

I'm not saying that a staple would be fair or equitable, but I will point out that you always seem to conveniently "forget" about the Chautaqua/Shuttle America arbitrated award, GL. Was recent, was a lot more similar to our situation than NW/DL, was arbitrated according to Allegheney/Mohawk, pay and benefit disparity was an issue, and the final result wasn't even close to relative seniority. But keep only including examples that support your assertion that "relative seniority is the law". And we'll keep disregarding every vitriolic thing you say. Deal? Deal. Good talk.

Fraternally,
PapaWoody

Im an AAI guy, and to be perfectly honest, I would not mind if this entire thing went away. Im a pretty senior FO and this merger is going to hose my upgrade. As it stands now, I get whatever time off I need, get any vacation I need, and my quality of life is amazing. I averaged 17 days off last year and live very comfortbaly with my AAI pay... What do I want out of the merger? I want to keep my quality of life about the same. Relative seniority would do that. However, I also understand that we will be getting a pay raise, so we need to give somewhere. You need to remember that AAI was still growing, uprgrading, and hiring. Our career expectations were much faster then the guys at SWA. I think most AAI guys would be willing to give up "some" relative seniority. That would boost the seniority of EVER SWA pilot on property. Not only that, SWA is now growing, hiring, and taking AAI airplanes. All of those things help the SWA pilot group. Its not like you aren't gaining anything out of this merger. YOUR ARE. However, your contract isn't good enough for SWA pilots to get a windfall with seniority. SWA 8 year pay is $10/hr less then AAI's, and 9 year pay is $13/hr less then AAI. IVe said it before, if everyone comes to the table with a level head, this will work great, but if any one pilot group comes looking for a windfall, its going to get ugly. What your union is telling you about wages is very misleading. Yes, your average FO rate is probably $40 grand a year more then the average AAI FO, but the average SWA FO has also been at SWA a much longer then AAI. If you compare years of service, then that amount is much less, and in some cases, SWA is behind AAI.

 

[N1kawotg]

gt1900, what is the guarantee monthly hours at AT vs SWA. I think it 87 trips for pay at SWA while most say they do well over that. what's it at AT? If you are capped to say 70-75 hours isn't there a huge disparity paywise when you look beyond just the pay rate?

 

[airlinepilot]

Please post the rates of pay at AAI and the monthly guarantee? My buds at AAI tell me that we at SWA are paid a good deal more? Sooooo.....I am having a hard time understanding what they tell me vs. what you are posting??? I also understand our Med/dental insurance is much cheaper than yours. How much do you pay for a family of 4? We are self insured and our rates (I am told my the company/swapa) are some of the lowest.

Im an AAI guy, and to be perfectly honest, I would not mind if this entire thing went away. Im a pretty senior FO and this merger is going to hose my upgrade. As it stands now, I get whatever time off I need, get any vacation I need, and my quality of life is amazing. I averaged 17 days off last year and live very comfortbaly with my AAI pay... What do I want out of the merger? I want to keep my quality of life about the same. Relative seniority would do that. However, I also understand that we will be getting a pay raise, so we need to give somewhere. You need to remember that AAI was still growing, uprgrading, and hiring. Our career expectations were much faster then the guys at SWA. I think most AAI guys would be willing to give up "some" relative seniority. That would boost the seniority of EVER SWA pilot on property. Not only that, SWA is now growing, hiring, and taking AAI airplanes. All of those things help the SWA pilot group. Its not like you aren't gaining anything out of this merger. YOUR ARE. However, your contract isn't good enough for SWA pilots to get a windfall with seniority. SWA 8 year pay is $10/hr less then AAI's, and 9 year pay is $13/hr less then AAI. IVe said it before, if everyone comes to the table with a level head, this will work great, but if any one pilot group comes looking for a windfall, its going to get ugly. What your union is telling you about wages is very misleading. Yes, your average FO rate is probably $40 grand a year more then the average AAI FO, but the average SWA FO has also been at SWA a much longer then AAI. If you compare years of service, then that amount is much less, and in some cases, SWA is behind AAI.

 

[us1023]

SWA 8 year pay is $10/hr less then AAI's, and 9 year pay is $13/hr less then AAI.

According to APC, SWA 8 yr fo is 139 and AT is 95, SWA 9 yr fo is 140 and AT is 97. Where do you come up with SWA's is less than AT's? Oh, maybe you were talking about ca pay. Let's see, SWA 8 yr ca is 201 and AT is 149, SWA 9 yr ca is 203 and AT is 153. Where is this "AT's pay is 10 and 13 more than SWA come from"?

 

[Kharma Police]

gt1900, what is the guarantee monthly hours at AT vs SWA. I think it 87 trips for pay at SWA while most say they do well over that. what's it at AT? If you are capped to say 70-75 hours isn't there a huge disparity paywise when you look beyond just the pay rate?

AirTran doesn't have a cap on monthly flying like many other airlines.

 

[Bake]

It's not a cap Kharma, its a MINIMUM GUARANTEE. SWA does not have a cap. I will get credited for over 140 trips in March or about 18,000 dollars gross pay for the month. I'm an FO. We just trying to figure out where gt gets his numbers.

 

[redflyer65]

Guys I did the math awhile back, and even skewed it toward AAI and it wasn't even close.

 

[Bob Dylan]

Im an AAI guy, and to be perfectly honest, I would not mind if this entire thing went away.

I'm sure every single Southwest pilot feels the same way you do.