SWAPA looking to capture more Capt seats

[FlyinGuy]

Actually, you are all wrong!

The only clear way to solve the issues at hand is to come to FI and whine and gripe about all your problems.

Oh, did any of you notice that the world is falling apart around us? Now back to pilot griping....

 

[Britpilot]

Welcome my new Airtran brothers ( and sisters)! For now let's agree that neither pilot group wanted the two companies to join ( at least true for one half of us). There has been some talk at how dishonest the SWA mgt team was in selling the 717 and how it would have been better had you have known about it sooner. I can not agree more! Had SWAPA known about the plan to divest 67% of AT's assets I think they may have pushed harder for an even worse deal for the AT pilots since A-M/B-M apparently only applies if purchasing over 50% of assets. Test the boundries of the law, so to speak. My point is things could have been potentially worse and I see how you feel about the deal you received with some gains and some losses. At this point arguing about it on the internet is like competing at the special olympics. Even if you win you are still retarded. Welcome aboard and let's try to put this behind us.

When did a leased fleet become an asset?

 

[Lear70]

The fact that SWA still owns the leases and only SUB-leased the aircraft to another air carrier is still acquisition of the asset.

And, for the record, I'm completely against SWAPA representation at this time. If SWAPA were to take over representation, they could pretty much refuse to file any of our grievances at will. Of course, they'd get sued to eternity and beyond for a DFR violation, which is why they clearly don't WANT representation at this point, but that would cost us a lot of money to fight.

As such, I don't want SWAPA anywhere near this process yet until all the issues relating to the SIA are done and behind us and, for now, they aren't.

 

[Beechdriver32]

Hey Lear-
What 'issues'? I thought the SLI was pretty much set?
Thanks in advance.
BD32

 

[Lear70]

Hey Lear-
What 'issues'? I thought the SLI was pretty much set?
Thanks in advance.
BD32

We've talked about it before, not only are there several transitional items that are NOT waivable with the departure of the 717's which SWA needs relief on, but other issues that go beyond that which are still actively being discussed and negotiated with SWA management.

Until those are done, I don't want someone else representing us who could decide to just drop the grievances and not pursue them should it come to the grievance route.

 

[scoreboardII]

The fact that SWA still owns the leases and only SUB-leased the aircraft to another air carrier is still acquisition of the asset.

And, for the record, I'm completely against SWAPA representation at this time. If SWAPA were to take over representation, they could pretty much refuse to file any of our grievances at will. Of course, they'd get sued to eternity and beyond for a DFR violation, which is why they clearly don't WANT representation at this point, but that would cost us a lot of money to fight.

As such, I don't want SWAPA anywhere near this process yet until all the issues relating to the SIA are done and behind us and, for now, they aren't.

We are now confused, you want SWAPA to help your side and say to SWA "yeah, whatever AT wants", yet you claim you don't want them anywhere near the process.

 

[Lear70]

We are now confused, you want SWAPA to help your side and say to SWA "yeah, whatever AT wants", yet you claim you don't want them anywhere near the process.

No, you're deliberately confusing two different statements in order to discredit and distract.

1. I want SWAPA to stop passively acting against us by discontinuing their opposition to any increases in pay rates or other compensatory actions for the loss of the 717. In essence, quit saying "If they get something (AAI), WE get something (SWA) because it wasn't in the Agreement", even though the 717 loss wasn't in the agreement. It's disingenuous and divisive.

2. I don't want SWAPA to take over AAI representation until issues like this and others are completely finished working their way through the negotiation process.

YOU guys are the ones suggesting (erroneously) that SWAPA representation fixes our problems. It doesn't, but someone might WANT that so we have no more access to continue our fight for improvements on our side of the partition the next 2-3 years.

 

[FlyinGuy]

Lear you must also remember that we are in a section 6. SWAPA is not going to let SWA give you money (short term) that will disappear. Why, because it is "pilot" money that will be used against us (all of us because it will be your future contract) to stop our gains. This is not to spite you guys, but to improve all SWA pilots for years to come.

 

[scoreboardII]

Copy Lear, you want the cake, you want to eat it, and you want to eat ours, got it.

All we have given you is one way to skin the cat, pay seems to be the issue you argue most about, want it fixed? Become SWAPA. Compensation because the 717's depart? Not a chance, remember, this airline is run by lawyers, anything else other than the SLI is probably not going to happen.

However I am rooting for you, because I hope you make GK realize what a ********************ing idiotic idea it was to buy another airline, so that he never does it again. Thats not a slam against the pilots or people, just a slam against GK for pitting each side against each other.

 

[RLAblows]

Lear you must also remember that we are in a section 6. SWAPA is not going to let SWA give you money (short term) that will disappear. Why, because it is "pilot" money that will be used against us (all of us because it will be your future contract) to stop our gains. This is not to spite you guys, but to improve all SWA pilots for years to come.

How does having a "b" scale alter ego help during your section 6? As long as Airtran is still there operating at 30% less and making profits, it destroys any leverage you have at the table.

Plus, why does SWAPA care if we get the pay now? We are getting it Jan 1 2015 anyway. What does it matter if we get it early? How does it affect them? Hell, half the SWA pilots I've met thought AT was already getting the pay anyway.