New SkyWest pay proposal....anyone?

[Bluto]

It seems kind of weird that you realize that you have absolutely no leverage and yet the majority of your pilot group doesn't want any kind of representation because they don't want to pay 2% out of their pay.

If that seems weird it's only because you don't understand our situation. Of course it's weird. It's the fundamental problem with SkyWest airlines pilot representation. Now, this may shock you, since you seem totally clueless as to what happens at SkyWest, but we are in the midst of a union drive. So nobody knows yet if "the majority of your pilot group doesn't want any kind of representation". We're going through the process.

Why go through all the effort to post on something like this when you clearly don't understand the first thing about the situation? Best case scenario, people ignore you. Worst case, some newhire reads your tripe and wrongly assumes you know something about us. This board is better off when the blatantly uninformed stay silent. I'm done educating people outside our company about how badly our position sucks. We know it, we're doing what we can to fix it, monday morning quarterbacking doesn't help anybody in this case. The only reason I post here about these issues is because some of our pilots who frequent this board don't understand the issues either.

 

[www.]

It does have an amendable date.

So. An amendable date means nothing at Skywest because you have no binding contract/agreement. How will you enforce this amendable date? The same way you were able to handle the 70 pay rates for 18 months?

 

[www.]

1. Can you say, "I have no idea what I'm talking about!" You really think our management, with absolutely no leverage applied to them, would offer rates that would make us less competetive? How stupid do you think they are?
2. If you had any idea how "negotiations" at SkyWest work, you'd know there is no possible way for our pilots to get an unsustainably high raise. (There are those that will argue that there is no way we can get even a reasonable raise, either, but that's the other side of that coin.)
3. We have zero threat to management, they hold all the cards, but somehow, in your fantasy world, we're going to pull a fast one that makes the company insolvent. Brilliant.

1. Do you think JA is putting these rates out because he's a nice guy? No, he is doing it because of a union drive. Why didn't he do this after the 18 months were over on the 70 seat talks? Sir, you have no idea what your talking about.

2. Do you? Have you sat across the table from your management? I didn't think so because the people that are, SAPA, were put there by the management.

3. No, the threat that you have is the union drive. JA is just doing the same thing DAL does every time the FAs and the mechanics at DAL start a drive.

And your justification for no raises for the Brasilia guys is pathetic. Every hear of "All For One and One For All"?

 

[dogman50]

I will vote it in and vote in alpa, for asa's sake. Remember, it is ONLY TIME flown in the aircraft. So for a stand-up, you are ONLY getting a raise on the time flown, not the entire block pay. Spread the word. More smoke and mirrors. Way less than the 7 percent it looks like on paper.

 

[CFIT]

So. An amendable date means nothing at Skywest because you have no binding contract/agreement. How will you enforce this amendable date? The same way you were able to handle the 70 pay rates for 18 months?

BFD tool. How has the end date on the contract at ASA protected them? When's the 5th year party going to happen?

 

[dogman50]

Brilliant on the part of managment. The seinor guy's/gal's a lot of whom bid standups, and are paid the most will reap the least. Sad.

 

[www.]

BFD tool. How has the end date on the contract at ASA protected them? When's the 5th year party going to happen?

There is a process. In your situation there will be no process for handling this issue.

And it's Mr. Tool to you junior.

 

[BoilerUP]

Its a friggin' shame the that one of (if not THE) best-managed regional in the country isn't willing to pay its first-year pilots more than $20/hr.

 

[SSDD]

You guys jump on a theme and beat it to death when it makes no sense.

Why would Skywest want to pay newhires any more????

They are not having any trouble filling classes! Including many from other regionals like ASA!

Forget about it being the "right thing" to do. Nobody pays out anymore than they have to.

 

[Bluto]

And your justification for no raises for the Brasilia guys is pathetic. Every hear of "All For One and One For All"?

I never offered any justification for the Brasilia debacle. I quoted SAPA's response. That's what these little thingys mean -----> "..." As a Brasilia pilot myself, don't you think I'd prefer to see the rates improved? I'd also like to see retro pay, across the board raises adjusted for cost of living, $23/hour for new-hires, long-call reserve and free pony rides for everyone!

However, I know these things aren't going to happen either. Regardless of how we vote. (on the pay package at least, the ALPA vote may be another matter.) I can respect the people who will vote no to fall on their swords as a gesture of principle. But anyone who votes no expecting a better offer truly misunderstands the mindset of SkyWest management and the reality of our situation. "All for one and one for all" has never, ever been an overriding theme at unionized carriers. The description I hear most offen is "eating their young." Ever heard that one? I'm not defending it, but to suggest that this pay proposal is less equitable than most unionized carrier's contracts is a bit closed-minded.

 

[www.]

1. "All for one and one for all" has never, ever been an overriding theme at unionized carriers. The description I hear most offen is "eating their young." Ever heard that one?
2. I'm not defending it, but to suggest that this pay proposal is less equitable than most unionized carrier's contracts is a bit closed-minded.

1. Have you worked for an airline that was unionized? Don't stereotype every airline that has a union. A specific union at a specific airline is what there pilots make of it.

2. I never said that did I. Unionized carriers have the ablilty to view what has been offered to your group and see the problems with it. They have played this game many more times than you have. Sir, you are the one with the "closed mind". Look around and you will see that JA plays you like a fiddle. And Sir, I would suggest that you support your other pilots at Skywest because you may need their support some day. It's a small world.

 

[bmpilot2003]

So. An amendable date means nothing at Skywest because you have no binding contract/agreement. How will you enforce this amendable date? The same way you were able to handle the 70 pay rates for 18 months?

Thats what no one seems to understand at this F#$%%^ company! Nothing on this proposal can be enforced. There has already been talk about raising new hire pay to more than the amount proposed in this DUMB thing becuase the company cant fill classes. Guess what its going to happen at a moments notice too, no voting, yet people that have been here for 10+ years on the BRO get nothing for their years of service. Whats even worse is there are people that fly the damn thing and thier OK with that!? For god sakes HOJET gets 2.5% COLA with their new contract. I dont think HOJET is making 40 mill a quater either.

 

[bmpilot2003]

But anyone who votes no expecting a better offer truly misunderstands the mindset of SkyWest management and the reality of our situation.

The road we are currently going down obviously leads to no where i.e. 18 month TA, intial 1.2%, and now sacraficing brasilia pilots for higher 70 seat pay. 3 strikes and your out!

 

[JoeMerchant]

So. An amendable date means nothing at Skywest because you have no binding contract/agreement. How will you enforce this amendable date? The same way you were able to handle the 70 pay rates for 18 months?

www.

Here at ASA, our amendable date was over 4 years ago, and we have a contract and ALPA. An amendable date doesn't mean much either way to be fair.....

 

[JoeMerchant]

1. Do you think JA is putting these rates out because he's a nice guy? No, he is doing it because of a union drive. Why didn't he do this after the 18 months were over on the 70 seat talks? Sir, you have no idea what your talking about.

2. Do you? Have you sat across the table from your management? I didn't think so because the people that are, SAPA, were put there by the management.

3. No, the threat that you have is the union drive. JA is just doing the same thing DAL does every time the FAs and the mechanics at DAL start a drive.

And your justification for no raises for the Brasilia guys is pathetic. Every hear of "All For One and One For All"?

It's working for them isn't it. Let's face it, the reason us ALPA people are pissed about it is because ALPA is failing us, and they are doing fine at Skywest without ALPA. Jerry is trumping ALPA, and the ALPA true believers are pissed.

As far as your comment about ever hearing "all for one and one for all?", the question should be has ALPA ever heard of that! ALPA isn't exactly the poster child for "all for one and one for all".

 

[Stifler's Mom]

www.

Here at ASA, our amendable date was over 4 years ago, and we have a contract and ALPA. An amendable date doesn't mean much either way to be fair.....

...no but we are able to resist the company's efforts to force us into a concessionary contract. Granted like you said, 4 years later we are still fighting for a contract, but atleast we're in the fight.

 

[JoeMerchant]

There is a process. In your situation there will be no process for handling this issue.

And it's Mr. Tool to you junior.

How is that "process" working? Even according to you it isn't working that well.....

 

[JoeMerchant]

...no but we are able to resist the company's efforts to force us into a concessionary contract. Granted like you said, 4 years later we are still fighting for a contract, but atleast we're in the fight.

Neither the last offer from ASA management, nor the offer to the Skywest pilots is "concessionary". Fighting for the sake of fighting is not a reason to support ALPA.....

 

[Stifler's Mom]

Neither the last offer from ASA management, nor the offer to the Skywest pilots is "concessionary". Fighting for the sake of fighting is not a reason to support ALPA.....

The last one from the company may not have been, but how about their opening offer? 13% pay decrease for me as a 700 F/O, seems "concessionary" to the tune of approximately $5,000 per year.

Why wasn't ASA able to "force" that on me?

 

[SSDD]

The last one from the company may not have been, but how about their opening offer? 13% pay decrease for me as a 700 F/O, seems "concessionary" to the tune of approximately $5,000 per year.

Why wasn't ASA able to "force" that on me?

They are! They're taking the 700's away! The next one comes off the ASA certificate next week.

Nobody wins in a situation like this. You can have a great rate, but if you don't have anything bigger than a 200, then who came out ahead?

I hope something gets resolved in the next couple of weeks.