USAir East West NIC Award Resolution? Very soon!

[doh]

Remember how the process began?
East - DOH with c & r, plus we want to count our furloughs as employees so we can put those NONEMPLOYEES on the list ahead of actual employees. And even though we have absolutely no hope of surviving without this merger, we want all the advantage.
West - NO - will take our chance with arb - what have we got to lose - but we have much to gain - widebody, international and most of all instant attrition in a 5000 pilot combined list

That pretty much sums it up - don't you think?

Metrojet

Fixed it for you.

 

[Bringupthebird]

Remember how the process began?
East - DOH with c & r

That pretty much sums it up - don't you think?

Metrojet

If you were tasked with setting up a Longevity Integration, then, yeah, I'd probably agree with you. But in fact it's a seniority integration therefore folks who are next to each other on a combined list may not have anywhere near the same hire date or age, but they have the same seniority which is either senior or junior irrespective of anything else. I challenge any USAPA member to have a BPR rep describe seniority in any other terms in a public forum. They know this is the truth and are counting on you never holding them accountable to it.

No one forced any furloughed people to stick around. They chose to keep themselves on the bottom of a stagnant list versus starting over because only a furloughee can make a lateral move in this industry without losing anything. Bottom is bottom wherever you go.

 

[charlie2]

Hi SCAB!!!!! You're "math degree" is clearly as effective as your career choices!! If The Kirby Proposal was ratified....854 million. Jack Stephan testified that Kirby +8% was realistic...that's 922.32 million dollars in W2 income...then you guys took your ball and went home because you didn't like ....well....REALITY.

Factor in work rules, vacation, 401k increases....JUST TO GET YOU UP TO AMERICA WEST STANDARDS....and you're way above a BILLION dollars forever lost to your ridiculous illegal experiment known as USKABA. Well done.

Call your math college...tell them you need a refund...assuming you know how to calculate one. Which is in doubt.

I own a business and it is very clear to me that the amount of income has to be very close or more to the amount of expenses. In the past seven years US Scumways did not make enough profit to pay for Kirby's thoughtful offer...look it up it's a pubicly held company which means they have to publish the books. Tell me how they would have paid for the Kirby proposal?

 

[Turtle21]

If you were tasked with setting up a Longevity Integration, then, yeah, I'd probably agree with you. But in fact it's a seniority integration therefore folks who are next to each other on a combined list may not have anywhere near the same hire date or age, but they have the same seniority which is either senior or junior irrespective of anything else. I challenge any USAPA member to have a BPR rep describe seniority in any other terms in a public forum. They know this is the truth and are counting on you never holding them accountable to it.

No one forced any furloughed people to stick around. They chose to keep themselves on the bottom of a stagnant list versus starting over because only a furloughee can make a lateral move in this industry without losing anything. Bottom is bottom wherever you go.

There are less than 400 pilots left from the 1,800 plus furloughed list. Obviously many left and did other things long ago and are most likely doing far better than anyone who left and went to AWA.

 

[Sandhawk]

Remember how the process began?
East - DOH with c & r
West - NO - will take our chance with arb - what have we got to lose - but we have much to gain - widebody, international and most of all instant attrition in a 5000 pilot combined list

That pretty much sums it up - don't you think?

Metrojet

AWA started out as 1 to 1 with the first slot going to P1, then next the #1 east guy, then awa guy, then east guy, etc.

The failing, twice bankrupt acquiree, wanted straight DOH.

Arbitrator said that both sides needed to come down off of their positions as neither was fair and equitable. AWA came to a different slotting ratio closer to relative seniority for all active pilots and the east remained on a straight DOH stance.

Remember the condition of the old Usairways at the time they were acquired. One need only go read the arbitration transcripts to se what several independent 3rd parties testified to during the arbitration....

 

[doh]

AWA started out as 1 to 1 with the first slot going to P1, then next the #1 east guy, then awa guy, then east guy, etc.

The failing, twice bankrupt acquiree, wanted straight DOH.

Arbitrator said that both sides needed to come down off of their positions as neither was fair and equitable. AWA came to a different slotting ratio closer to relative seniority for all active pilots and the east remained on a straight DOH stance.

Remember the condition of the old Usairways at the time they were acquired. One need only go read the arbitration transcripts to se what several independent 3rd parties testified to during the arbitration....

That's why I fixed it for him...

 

[TWA Dude]

Remember how the process began?

Of course I do. After failing to reach a deal both sides agreed to let an arbitrator decide. You can't change history to match your distorted, self-entitled point of view.

I sincerely hope there's justice at the end of our dispute. We both know how that'll go. You probably lie to yourself even more than you lie behind the anonymity of message boards.

 

[Sandhawk]

That's why I fixed it for him...

You can't fix stupid...

 

[doh]

You can't fix stupid...

Plus one

 

[Turtle21]

...
Remember the condition of the old Usairways at the time they were acquired. .......

We can keep arguing about the viability of the merged companies and we can now see that past projections were incorrect. USAir has been hiring since last year and plans over 300 new pilots next year even though the former AWA pilots already fly 24 % of the USAir routes. AWA has shrunk, has pilots laid off, won't be hiring to replace retirees at least through all of next year, and doesn't even have enough profitable routes to even employ all the pilots they currently have, as Parker has repeatedly told everyone.

All that doesn't matter.

Folks can keep bitching that they don't agree with the majority or they can propose an alternative that is acceptable to the majority.

Democracy is what it is.

 

[JECKEL]

Democracy? Really?
How unamerican of you.

 

[TWA Dude]

We can keep arguing about the viability of the merged companies and we can now see that past projections were incorrect.

I know I'm stating the obvious but you need to hear it.
Since our two companies merged it's a new company. Past projections, such as they were, applied for each company as stand-alone entities. All that matters is this:

"This necessarily means that career expectations differed and that US Airways pilots had more to gain from the merger than their new colleagues."

The only one proven right since the merger has been George Nicolau.

 

[Superbird]

We can keep arguing about the viability of the merged companies and we can now see that past projections were incorrect. USAir has been hiring since last year and plans over 300 new pilots next year even though the former AWA pilots already fly 24 % of the USAir routes. AWA has shrunk, has pilots laid off, won't be hiring to replace retirees at least through all of next year, and doesn't even have enough profitable routes to even employ all the pilots they currently have, as Parker has repeatedly told everyone.

All that doesn't matter.

Folks can keep bitching that they don't agree with the majority or they can propose an alternative that is acceptable to the majority.

Democracy is what it is.

Isn't it Usapa's duty to fairly represent all Airways pilots ? Or just please the majority?

Usapa is a dictatorship. A useless one at that, but still a dictatorship where only those it was created to protect see any benefit. Hint: LOA93 isn't a benefit. Oh yeah, Dougweiser benefits too!

 

[Sandhawk]

We can keep arguing about the viability of the merged companies and we can now see that past projections were incorrect. USAir has been hiring since last year and plans over 300 new pilots next year even though the former AWA pilots already fly 24 % of the USAir routes. AWA has shrunk, has pilots laid off, won't be hiring to replace retirees at least through all of next year, and doesn't even have enough profitable routes to even employ all the pilots they currently have, as Parker has repeatedly told everyone.

All that doesn't matter.

Folks can keep bitching that they don't agree with the majority or they can propose an alternative that is acceptable to the majority.

Democracy is what it is.

I gues that the Bular Hogg show running the operation has Nothing to do with the west shrinking and the east growing, Riiiiiiiiigggghhhhttt???

BTW, usapa is a dicktastership, not a democracy....

 

[Metrojet]

Isn't it Usapa's duty to fairly represent all Airways pilots ? Or just please the majority?

Usapa is a dictatorship. A useless one at that, but still a dictatorship where only those it was created to protect see any benefit. Hint: LOA93 isn't a benefit. Oh yeah, Dougweiser benefits too!

Interesting that you bring up "majority" after election day - in that regard i would always choose to be smarter and in the minority rather than dumb but say i am in the majority = but for now I guess we in the East are both smarter and in the majority

Metrojet