Extraneous useless radio phrases

[Boris Badenov]

I do it so that the vein in your forehead will bulge. Then, later, I'll get your job when you have a coronary over what other people say on the radio.

I find a lot of the same things irritating, but I've come to the understanding that no one really cares what I think. They don't care what you think, either. Let it go. You must have something better to do with your time.

 

[say again]

They don't care what you think, either. Let it go. You must have something better to do with your time.

Sad thing is they dont!!!!

 

[ozpilot]

In fairness, ATC uses unnecessary verbiage at times too ..

My favorite is "Cleared present position ..." What other position would I be in?

I also like "Climb and maintain ". "Fly planned route" and "assume own navigation". Unless you tell me otherwise I take these as a given.

 

[Booker]

"Cleared present position ..."..."Climb and maintain ". "Fly planned route" and "assume own navigation".

Are those terms not in the 7110.65? (I ask that as a serious question.)

 

[atl pilot]

Its...."resume own navigation."

 

[50988]

Doing aerial survey, I get to spend several hours at a time with the same approach facilities and MAN have I heard some doozies...

"Attention Cleveland approach! This is Bonanza november one-two-one whiskey alpha...umm...I'm going to cross through your sector...ummmmm.....ADVISE!"

Then there's always the guys who need to do creative interpretations of ATC instructions...

"Squak 4212, ident."
"Forty-Two Twelve in the hotbox, with a FLASH!"

"Turn left heading 210, climb and maintain 7,000"
"Swingin' her ta two-ten, pushin up ta seventy."

Heard a guy bust a restricted area after about 15 minutes of ATC warning him and him refusing vectors and getting annoyed saying he knew where it was and wouldn't enter it.

Keeps ya entertained I guess.

 

[Lrjtcaptain]

In fairness, ATC uses unnecessary verbiage at times too ..

My favorite is "Cleared present position ..." What other position would I be in?

I also like "Climb and maintain ". "Fly planned route" and "assume own navigation". Unless you tell me otherwise I take these as a given.

um....we don't just say stuff to sound cool. We say them the way they are written in the 7110.65....Its not recomended phraseology.

 

[zonker]

Wgas.

 

[runwayjockey]

I thought that "Climb and Maintain" and "Descend and Maintain" were a direct result of the Flying Tigers CFIT many years ago.

 

[Booker]

"ON THE METER"??!!! ON THE METER???!!

I seem to remember learning that multiple exclamation points and question marks are considered extraneous and useless. Of course, that would have been in grade school, and my memory is getting a little fuzzy.

 

[murfdawg998]

'shortcuts'

I hear ya on the rides stuff, the importance of knowing it and all but I feel the 'ride report' transmissions take up a lot of time on the freq.

However, why do guys ask for shortcuts? I try not to do it myself unless i'm trying to avoid weather. Do they really help you when you're 'runnin a little late today' by saving you a minute or two? Most of the time it's the airlines making these requests which blows my mind even more because they fly the same routes between the same destinations all the time; you would think the pilots would know when a shortcut (which really doesn't help that much most of the time) might be available. I'm guessing that ATC will give you a shortcut when traffic, military airspace, and other factors permit them to issue such shortcut. The quicker they can hand you off to the next guy, the happier they'll be.

 

[DrewBlows]

I hear ya on the rides stuff, the importance of knowing it and all but I feel the 'ride report' transmissions take up a lot of time on the freq.

However, why do guys ask for shortcuts? I try not to do it myself unless i'm trying to avoid weather. Do they really help you when you're 'runnin a little late today' by saving you a minute or two? Most of the time it's the airlines making these requests which blows my mind even more because they fly the same routes between the same destinations all the time; you would think the pilots would know when a shortcut (which really doesn't help that much most of the time) might be available. I'm guessing that ATC will give you a shortcut when traffic, military airspace, and other factors permit them to issue such shortcut. The quicker they can hand you off to the next guy, the happier they'll be.

Gas. It's important to find a smooth ride for the passengers, but it's also important to burn the least amount of fuel possible on a given flight, which usually means going higher, but we don't want to go higher if it means a poor ride. I find the ride reports to get annoying as well, but fuel savings are a fact of life at any airline these days. Same thing for "shortcuts". Just today I was able to get a shortcut which turned a crosswind into an almost direct tail wind, which allowed us to slow down as well. I don't know how much fuel this saves, but if a company can save 1% or 2% over the course of a year by flying higher and getting shortcuts they are doing very well (at least in that regard).

 

[DrewBlows]

My favorite extraneous radio phrase goes something like this...

Center: "Airline X descend and maintain flight level two three zero."

Airline X: "Descend and maintain flight level two three zero Airline X...here we go."

This is my favorite not because it is any more extraneous than anything else but because it's usually said in a tone which would be more appropriate for someone preparing to enter a burning building to save a bunch of orphans. In reality the flying pilot pushed a button while the guy on the radio goes back to day dreaming about the LBB overnight.

 

[dickburns]

Are those terms not in the 7110.65? (I ask that as a serious question.)

yes they are. OZPilot doesn't appear to know what he's talking about.

 

[ozpilot]

yes they are. OZPilot doesn't appear to know what he's talking about.

Hey Dick

It may be in the controllers manual but I'm a pilot not a controller, so its not required reading for me.

In this thread pilots are being bagged for unnecessary verbiage. I was just pointing out controllers do it too. I still don't see the necessity of phrases such as "Cleared present position.. " regardless of what your precious manual says.

 

[floatflyer99]

I have a theory about the origins of the phrase "with you".

I think it started out like this:

A controller is working multiple frequencies and asks you--"bananastand 101 switch to my frequency 1xx.xx" and then you don't reply but just switch frequencies and then call on the new one right away (still talking to the same controller) and say "bananastand 101 with you on xx.xx". In this instance it makes sense and, while extraneous, is a somewhat understandable and logical thing to add.

Then people hear the phrase "with you" being used and think that they should start saying that too because the other guy sounded soo cool using it.

That's my theory about how the phrase might have started creeping in to everyday use by some people.

 

[j41driver]

...if you're up in pca

PCA, huh? It only changed like 15 years ago.

 

[dickburns]

OZpilot, my point is, how can something be excessive when it is required?

we're all pilots, let's use a pilot analogy...you're flying ifr, so bringing 45 minutes of extra fuel is required....but you're ete is only 20 minutes, so that's way more extra fuel, right. some might argue that is excessive, you or I would say it's just what's required.

rules are there. people try to stick with them. it's nothing complicated...

 

[dickburns]

PCA, huh? It only changed like 15 years ago.

yes. pca. it's aka class A, but considering areas of positive control exist globally, yet "class A" as we know it is only domestically, it is still a valid definition.

hairs = split.

 

[Booker]

Well, I've suffered through all of Mach80's annual posts on this, and here's my utterly useless take:

I learned all of my poor radio habits on OE at my first airline. I still remember the lecture I received from the good old boy I was paired with: "Now, ya hear how I talk on the radio. It doesn't need ta be complicated; ya just gotta get the point across. Ya gotta read back the numbers [sic]." He was the type who would contact departure with, "Departure Airliner forty three twenty one one four for four." So I figured that's how real pilots talked, since I heard everyone else doing it, too. And so it began and perpetuated.

Then a couple of years ago I became a big fan of Don Brown and began reading all of his articles on AVweb. Slowly I tried using more standard phraseology as set forth in the AIM, and now it's just second nature for me. More than anything else, I do it just for the sense of personal satisfaction and professional pride that comes from doing a job properly, which is one of the main reasons I got into this line of work. But I admit, I'm easily amused. Personally, if other folks want to be sloppy on the air, it doesn't matter much to me, unless it puts lives in danger. They can roll their eyes all they want when I report leaving an assigned altitude...I don't care.

Carry on.