avantair.......union? Is it time.....again?

[oneeye_169]

if FI gave up the names of the people on this sight, they would probably be subject to a bunch of legal problems from the identified. hence, the reason why you can't post names. and if they are pilots, why would they want to F*ck over other pilots in favor of mgmt.

 

[gunfyter]

The way the company can force FI to reveal the names is file a frivilous lawsuit.

The names must be revealed. Article in WIRED magazine explained the whole process years ago and this has been done. After the names revealed employees were fired and lawsuit dropped.

 

[oneeye_169]

you still have to have a reason for the frivilous lawsuit. i would like to read that article. Not to mention, if they are fired for union recruiting or organizing, then there are laws that protect from that as well. don't forget this is a publicly traded company now. its not as easy as it once was to hide shady business practices...if that is what people think is happening. i'm not aware of any. besides, if the company thinks they are doing a good job in managing the pilots then they have nothing to worry about.
like i said. growing company, with more pilots to come. job protection (which means long term financial stabilty for you and your family) should be priority. the union would help provide that, along with other benefits. right now there are no guarantees. its all at the companies discretion. the pilots should get a legitimate say. and i don't mean the worthless PA board.

 

[fs77]

New slogan for avantair: "IT'S TIME"

Well, I've been with a union with a prior employer. All I have to say is it was a very good thing to have. Like someone said, it's not about the money, ok, sometimes it is, but job security. These two guys got hosed big time. Unbiased system board? Yeah, ok, sure.
They were told resign or be fired "after all facts were considered"?? The NTSB report isn't out. So, it seems to me all the facts were NOT considered!

IT'S TIME! Vote YES!

 

[johnsonrod]

Either improve life by bringing on union representation (and not be subjected to arbitrary management whims) or vote with your feet - Netjets has a union and it is hiring... Choice is yours.

 

[hyper]

Actually, as quiet as that plane is; you'd hear something obvious on the CVR to indicate a landing hard enough to collapse the gear......

"I hear the train a comin´
it´s rolling round the bend....."

 

[gunfyter]

you still have to have a reason for the frivilous lawsuit. i would like to read that article. .

Knock yourself out:

http://www.wired.com/techbiz/media/news/2000/05/36338

"A lot of companies are monitoring these message boards all the time. When they see something they don't like, they instantly file a lawsuit," said Rob Lytle, a trade-secret attorney for Howrey Simon Arnold & White in Houston.
"There are dozens and dozens of these cases," agreed Chris Hansen, an attorney with the ACLU.
Problem is, say critics, many of the cases are bogus -- the suing company is filing the case solely to unmask its online enemies.
To do that, it issues subpoenas to the online company that hosts the message board or chat room, asking for the identity of the alleged defamers. Many Net companies, including the biggest message board hosters like Yahoo, will ultimately hand over a user's name in response to subpoena. "Once the company knows who you are, they can fire you if you're an employee, or they can intimidate you with their big corporate lawyers," said Megan Gray, an attorney for Baker & Hostetler in Los Angeles.
​

 

[oneeye_169]

that article is seven years old.

 

[Noodles]

I think you'll find, like the last two times that a union drive was started, that there are too many people apathetic. Some have just had too much kool-aid, and will never be convinced otherwise.

Watch out, though. During the last union drive, two out of the three that were behind it got fired.

 

[oneeye_169]

www.eff.org/privacy/anonymity/blog-anonymously.php

look at blog without getting fired, number 2

people should be able to post on here without worry. noone is giving away vital company information. i don't want the company to go away, i want them to be successful. i just think the pilots need a way to protect themselves from mgmt or future mgmt that may make harsh decisions based off emotions or worried reactions. losing a job isn't easy, and it shouldn't be taken lightly. i feel horrible for those guys who had to go up for Disciplinary action. i hope no one else has to go down that road. i also think if the company tried to get user id's in order to fire people, it would probably end up hurting their cause.

For all curious pilots...avantair is not a bad place to work. i just think given some recent events and the fact that we will begin to have a larger group of pilots....a union could help in protecting our interests.

 

[SharkBait]

Yea, I know, I don't like unions either.

I'm just wary of them because I came from a place that had the phrase "to the extent possible" all over the contract. That translated into "Let's (mgmt) do whatever we want." When the pilots grieved the violation, it took several months to get to arbitration and many times the grievences were negotiated away to supposedly prevent future violations.

My point being if my interests/needs (family, QOL and such) are best met with direct communication I would prefer that. If I need a middleman to help protect my interests I will gladly pay/help for that service.

 

[Corona]

For all curious pilots...avantair is not a bad place to work.

U kidding? Two pilots thrown on the altar to please shareholders (allegedly)? The writing is on the wall; noone wants to work at a place where their career can be threatened. You are correct, though, you do need a union.

C

 

[Bruno06]

Avantair is run by lawyers.
All pilots had to sign new contracts this year basically stating they don't need a reason to fire anyone. If you don't sign, you don't have a job.
Avantair gave these pilots the choice to resign or be fired all before the NTSB or FAA reports were complete.
It's no surprise Avantair's priority is to butter up the sharholders, feed them with BS, tell them they fired the pilots responsible. Pilot error.....always the reason for an accident right??? Couldn't possibly be a maintenance issue!!!! We need a union, we need one now. Avantair's growth has made us more dispensible, we're just numbers, easily replaceable and you could be fired tomorrow for being in the wrong place at the wrong time. It's a shame these guys had to take the fall.

 

[myrealnameis]

Couldn't possibly be a maintenance issue!!!!

More like a design issue, or lack there of. Everyone that flies these things knows the brakes have always been an issue and I bet were contributing factors in the accident.

 

[brewerdog]

the breaks should be antilock, and directional control can get squirlly if used to much, we need to get a statement from ops to let pilots know what happened

 

[Mr. Pebbles]

More like a design issue, or lack there of. Everyone that flies these things knows the brakes have always been an issue and I bet were contributing factors in the accident.

I'm not trying to flame here, but what do brakes have to do with a gear collapse?

 

[fs77]

locked brakes shouldn't have anthing to do with a gear folding unless the design is flawed, imho.

 

[myrealnameis]

If the brakes locked up and the plane got a little out of shape, ie. sideways causing an extreme sideload that could easily exceed the intended design limits of the main gear.
By the way this airplane is suposed to have an antiskid system.

 

[brewerdog]

not really a break problem, I ment to say the reverse (beta) range can throw some crazy air across the rudder if used too much

 

[oneeye_169]

i would like to speculate on the brakes and figure out what happened just like mgmt, but until the proper reports come out... WHICH THEY HAVEN'T, then the only thing i care about is why these guys got ousted for nothing. i also want to know why they didn't have any support from the guys in the room who are supposed to be a voice for them. no more promises or attempted buttering up for me. the list of reasons for a union just keep on growing. its time for a union, and i hope proper progress is being made to get to vote one in.