Travis Barker - 4 killed, 2 hurt as rock star's jet crashes

[LJ45]

Feds determined FOD blew Right side Mains.. Then the Left Mains went about 2000 feet into the attempted stop. None of the Plugs blew... all the tires blew out the side wall. The initial Right side when it blew, dropped the wheel assembly onto the rwy.. and shattered.. No Brakes.. No Wheels... " D.O. Kept asking us.. the Acc. Stop..Acc.GO shows 4,300ft why did it take you 10,600 to stop..Duh.. No brakes or wheels.. No Directional Control..!!"

WOW !! glad you had the extra runway.

 

[momalley81]

Exactly, but I think he was going in the other direction of your statement. Because of that raw power, and make no mistake, the 60 has its fair share, if you come to fly without your "A" game and one rolls back on you (before V1 or Just After), you will in fact have your hands full; a 60 can get away from you with minimal ease.

Within the same situation, some people get in trouble with the auto re-light; the plane snaps to the L or R, the pilot stuffs the appropriate rudder input, and about the time the pilot gets it headed back twards the centerline, the auto-relight lights off the engine that rolled back (Power levers are still in the T/O detent so power will come right back), and now that rudder input you have in, just snapped you back past the centerline, and here we go again.

Granted that's not the norm, but in the 60, you'll see that in the sim more often than you'd think because it is so overpowered.

I remember climbing at Vmo/Mmo well into the 30s could be done with no effort at all; Only time I have ever climbed @ 12K FPM (lasted less than 20 seconds) was in a 60; only time I have ever gotten an overspeed warning on 1 engine in the sim on a hot/high day was in the 60; only time I've ever seen a sim partner Vmc an airplane in the sim was in the 60, and the only time I've ever really scared the SH!!T out of myself, was as a new captain (from DA50s) in the 60. Power Power Power

All good points, I've got my share of time in the beast, both AMS-850 and UNS birds. It will be interesting to find out what happened here, since it looks like they went off the end close to centerline at a very high rate of speed, and may have been on fire before the final impact (one of the first responders claims to have seen a "fireball streak across the road") And since it was a fairly new, low time bird.

And nothing like setting off TA's on airliners 8000' above you coming out of TEB, or doing 2600fpm out of FL360 with the overspeed horn going off...

 

[momalley81]

Can any airplane really be overpowered?

If the LR60 is known to be overpowered, wouldn't the proper description be under-winged?

Its not overpowered; the engineers just figured the solution to the tiny wheels and crap brakes and short wing was put big freakin motors out there...

 

[LJ45]

pure speculation at this point... but they could have hit something (animal etc.) or had a tire come apart that caused failure of the squat switch. This could put the plane in the "air mode" which would cause normal brakes to lock out and TR's to be inop, then you are on emergency brakes only. This happen when the Dallas Cowboys LR60 hit a dear and this looks like a similar crash.

 

[AviateYou]

Very unfortunate. My condolences.

From those numbers it looks as though we have Balanced field length and then some for the Lear 60 if it was configured correctly and 8500 feet of runway for RWY 11. FYI Phase 1A 3 Caliper brakes for the 60 and 55 do work okay from personal experience. But if some of the tires blew - forget it. Look at the photos does it seem as if the flaps were retracted? Hard to tell.

 

[AviateYou]

"And nothing like setting off TA's on airliners 8000' above you coming out of TEB, or doing 2600fpm out of FL360 with the overspeed horn going off..."

Thousand feet per minute in RVSM airspace is normally recommended and required.

 

[BE90flyer]

Thousand feet per minute in RVSM airspace is normally recommended and required.

So what is it? Recommended or required?

 

[AviateYou]

Required when not recommended & Recommended when not required. Beavis.

 

[filejw]

I lost the link but the crew told atc tires blown and aborting.

 

[LRvsH25B]

"And nothing like setting off TA's on airliners 8000' above you coming out of TEB, or doing 2600fpm out of FL360 with the overspeed horn going off..."

Thousand feet per minute in RVSM airspace is normally recommended and required.

That's an old wives tale/aviation myth. 1000 FPM is reccommened during the last 1000 feet of level off and/or in the vicinity of other aircraft. This is simply to reduce the TA/RA alerts.

It is by no means required under any FAR or guidance that you have seen. IT may or may not be required in your RVMS manual; it is only because whoever wrote the manual put it in there and the FEDs signed off on it. Delete that statement and the manual would still get approved.