Southwest Airlines Expands Atlanta Service With Two New Nonstop Destinations

[Music]

If SWA perceives that the Air Tran thing isn't going to work as they had hoped they most definitely, based on their history, can (and will?) amend their original plan, possibly in ways that the Air Tran folks won't be happy with.

Question:

Why is it so important for you guys to threaten (or convey threats of the GO)? Is it that you're truly concerned for our well being? Or is it just to mock? I honestly can't figure out what purpose it serves.

I fully understand that when I get to vote that it will not be a vote on the SL,I but a vote on whether to stay employed. SW pilots, on the other hand will be voting on the solely on the merits of the SLI.

Big difference.

Hence the first question.

 

[madjack]

MUSIC,

My understanding is that SWA mgmt talked "straight" with your MC when they presented the last SL (Mike VDV specifically)...is that threat or cold hard realities in tough economic times...?

 

[redflyer65]

Question:

Why is it so important for you guys to threaten (or convey threats of the GO)? Is it that you're truly concerned for our well being? Or is it just to mock?.

Music,

You do understand the reality of what's ahead, right? Put your head in the sand if you like. No fear mongering when the facts are the facts.

And I'm not even sure Laker works for SW.

 

[Music]

MUSIC,

My understanding is that SWA mgmt talked "straight" with your MC when they presented the last SL (Mike VDV specifically)...is that threat or cold hard realities in tough economic times...?

I can't answer that with any certainty. What I can say is that this whole process has been difficult to understand.

How you ask?

First we negotiate a Process Agreement Yet it's clear that this was just done placate our union. The reality is that there was never any intent to follow it to its ultimate outcome (if that would have been necessary). Furthermore, this was to have been a "Labor" negotiation between two unions, NOT Labor and Management, which has been the case.

Now, the reality is what it is. It doesn't change the fact that I will be voting on an agreement to be employed and you will be voting on an agreement that effects your seniority position. Economics or not, our voting positions are by far, disparate.

Make no mistake, I will put this behind me (in fact I already have) because there is only one way for me to vote. I live my life as an optimist and will look forward to the future, no matter what that entails.

 

[Music]

Music,

You do understand the reality of what's ahead, right? Put your head in the sand if you like. No fear mongering when the facts are the facts.

And I'm not even sure Laker works for SW.

Red,

Why do you keep hitting me with the ostrich comment?

I don't believe I have stated any sort of opinion, other than that I am FULLY aware of the situation. If anything, I'm only trying to find out why there is this need for some on your side to consistently bring up this threat (economic reality, truth, inevitability, or whatever else you want to call it, etc.). It's still a valid question because, because it points to overall "character" of those making the statement.

BTW, I don't know if Laker works for SW or not. IMHO, it's irrelevant to the two questions I asked. If I implied that, I did so in error.

 

[Sacha]

I think Music gets it along with more and more rank and file. I know my blunt opinions were directed more at two other groups. PCL, Ty and a few other Airtran guys whom most of us at SWA know their identities and Trolls from other airlines who for various reasons hate SWA. Both groups are playing fast and loose with careers that are paying salaries between 100 and 300 grand. One group is hateful. The other is stupid. This is reality plain and simple.

I have dealt with two management groups in my career. First, Frank Lorenzo,Phil Bakes and Joe Leonard. Second, Herb Kelleher, Colleen Barrett and Gary Kelly. I like Herb,Colleen and Gary more, but I also fear pissing them off much,much more....they are infinitely smarter than the first three jerks. Take it for what it's worth....

 

[laker4284]

Question:

Why is it so important for you guys to threaten (or convey threats of the GO)? Is it that you're truly concerned for our well being? Or is it just to mock? I honestly can't figure out what purpose it serves.

I fully understand that when I get to vote that it will not be a vote on the SL,I but a vote on whether to stay employed. SW pilots, on the other hand will be voting on the solely on the merits of the SLI.

Big difference.

Hence the first question.

Not mocking. No threats. I don't have a dog in the hunt. I was just pointing out that SWA is a fearsome competitor and if people think LUV means they're all touchy and feely, they are misreading history. How it shakes out for Air Tran or SWAPA remains to be seen.

Many of us have found, to our everlasting chagrin, that even the much-loved Kelleher can be one helluva guy to jerk around. He's all business first and foremost. The Wild Turkey is a side show.

All I'm saying is, one has to deal with him as he really is not how he is portrayed in the legend or the media. That's not a threat. Just a reality. Those who have blown off SWA as a lightweight or laughed at Kelleher's antics have lived to regret it.

 

[maru657]

Never. The definition of scabbing is specific.

Not that specific, but who cares, you can rationalize anything. In any event there is a sort of widespread belief that the arrogance and sense of entitlement displayed by SWAPA is above and beyond. Your 11 year co-pilots are determined to get ahead no matter who they step on in the process and it's no accident that SWAPA has probably blown the opportunity to merge twice in a row. I can see why Herb and Kelly are getting a little desperate. No merger, no growth and the entire business plan depends upon growth. That's the downside of the de-regulation business model.

 

[Wesb737fo]

A failure to fully understand the terrain upon which you are fighting will ultimately end in one's demise.

 

[shootr]

Not that specific, but who cares...

SWAPA has probably blown the opportunity to merge twice in a row.

Scab - One who flies legally struck work by crossing a line, refusing to strike, or while flying for another carrier.

I challenge you to show me another definition that applies to pilots.

You have how many hours and don't know what a scab is? Don't throw around that word like it's a regular insult. Call us d***heads or a**holes if you wish. Reserve SCAB for when it's appropriate. SWA has a few...AT has a few more. NOTHING to do with this SLI stuff.

shootr

PS SWAPA blew it? Are you insane?

 

[Music]

Both groups are playing fast and loose with careers that are paying salaries between 100 and 300 grand. One group is hateful. The other is stupid. This is reality plain and simple.

I agree there are those (on both sides) that believe that this is a game that don't have much to lose (or otherwise fail to see it). That is what frustrates me. I have done what is necessary to protect myself and family going forward (at least what little I can do). But I have a responsibility to them to make sure that I am employed and will provide now and in the future. Make no mistake however, I am deeply disappointed with the way the GO has handled this whole integration. Not because of the resultant SLI, but the lack of "clarity" with regard to their true objectives. These events have been a reality check as to the way the GO conducts business and I will be weary of them for some time. That being said, I have turned the page personally and am eager to get to know my new colleagues, but I (and I suspect others) will be very cautious of what is said in the future. But without employment what difference does it make.

I stated a few weeks ago that I was against the first SLA and would have voted that way had I been given a chance. It has now been made very clear that I should never been looking at the agreement, in and of itself, but to vote as an indication of continued employment. That, is where "clarity" would have been helpful.

I have dealt with two management groups in my career. First, Frank Lorenzo,Phil Bakes and Joe Leonard. Second, Herb Kelleher, Colleen Barrett and Gary Kelly. I like Herb,Colleen and Gary more, but I also fear pissing them off much,much more....they are infinitely smarter than the first three jerks. Take it for what it's worth....

Well, at least we have one name in common. My sincerest hope is that I can come to feel the same way you do regarding the last three.

 

[Fubijaakr]

Nor does cattle car seating, no F, no clubs, and no international destinations to use miles.

I do wonder how successful SWA Hawaii flying will be given their seat pitch/service model.

Somebody better tell Fubi that someone hacked his account and made a pro Southwest comment!

Hey, I give credit where credit is due. SWA is emplanes the most passengers in DEN. And they did it in an amazingly short time. Bet UAL is still wondering what hit them.

 

[madjack]

"Your 11 year co-pilots are determined to get ahead no matter who they step on in the process"

I am an 11 year SWA FO (not by choice)

I would have voted yes to having AAI CPS who upgraded within 6 months, keep their seats (AIP 1)...how is that stepping on shoes?

AAI MEC voted AIP down

We do not know what is in the SWA SL proposal, but I had nothing to do with its creation.

Why do you and FUBI hate SWA FOs?? We were hired at SWA and have gained SWA longevity.

 

[Fubijaakr]

Why do you and FUBI hate SWA FOs?? We were hired at SWA and have gained SWA longevity.

Again, an opinion contrary to SWA groupthink automatically qualifies as "hate speech."

And AAI guys were hired at AAI and have gained AAI longevity. Then, the companies merged.

Why is SWA longevity superior to AAI longevity?

 

[b747dogg]

Why is SWA longevity superior to AAI longevity?

Because when I was hired at Airtran, I was not qualified to work at SWA. 2500TT, O Jet PIC, No Type, no degree. When I was Hired at SWA I had 7000TT, 2000 PIC, 737 Type, college degree. Yet my Airtran classmates will be senior to me because I decided to better my situation. Just saying!!!

 

[General Lee]

Because when I was hired at Airtran, I was not qualified to work at SWA. 2500TT, O Jet PIC, No Type, no degree. When I was Hired at SWA I had 7000TT, 2000 PIC, 737 Type, college degree. Yet my Airtran classmates will be senior to me because I decided to better my situation. Just saying!!!

You rolled the dice, and you may lose out. You don't now take it out on your fellow Airtran classmates. Maybe they didn't want to leave ATL, or live in OAK. It was your opinion that SWA was better for you, when the others may have liked their current situation. That's the way it goes. If it goes to arbitration, see if you can go in front of the 3 judges and tell them that story, and maybe they'll shed a tear and put you as #1 on the total list!



Bye Bye----General Lee

 

[redflyer65]

I'm glad Genital Lee finally set the record straight on how this industry works. I'll be able to sleep better now.

Here's a clue Gen, Airtran got BOUGHT, and that's the way it goes.

Godspeed.

RF

 

[GogglesPisano]

, Airtran got BOUGHT, and that's the way it goes.

Godspeed.

RF

No dog in this fight, but ... I don't think that will factor into an arbitrator's decision -- if that's the road that's taken. It didn't with NW/DL.

 

[jetflier]

Pass the peanuts, this is gonna be good!

 

[redflyer65]

I agree! The next few months are going to be interesting for sure.