How to get the union on property!

[netjetwife]

Dissatisfied pilots wanting to improve their working conditions/pay and those in 1108 who are willing to advise them. We know that groups are working within Options and Flex. I haven't heard the same of CS--have you?

Please don't read more into my posts than is there.
Thanks,
NJW

 

[Necromonger]

Which focus is this and from whom?

Toolshed,

If you have to ask....

It looks like you have some reading to catch up on.

 

[Guitar rocker]

Hello all. I’ve been reading along for awhile, but this is my first post. I felt compelled to put in my two cents.
I’m not trying to spark a debate with a planted Union Rep or anyone like that because, regardless of who’s right or wrong, you can’t win. I find it frustrating when someone posts an honest question or comment, only to be massacred and drowned out with union jargon and personal “you’re so ignorant” attacks. I can only speak from my experience which is more than some and less than others. I’ve been flying for CS for a while now and, honestly, it’s a great place to work. That’s the bottom line. If you read through the posts, most of the people who actually work here say something similar. I’m happy with the pay, the benefits and I truly enjoy the professionals I work with - both on the flightline and in the office. I’m happy with how fast I was promoted and yes, I even like my Supervisor. I’ve flown for others and I feel there’s value in enjoying where you work and feeling like being part of a big team. For me, that makes up for the $1-2K more a year that another company might offer – and I don’t even know that they do.
It’s true we are very busy, but that’s because we are good. I see busy as a good thing - I love to fly, it’s why I became a pilot. Contrary to what some have said, I’m not just a number here. I feel that what some refer to as the “Good ole Boys Club” others would consider the “Being Recognized for Doing a Good Job Club”. Personally, that’s the club I want to be in. Personally, I don’t need the Union to negotiate my pay - for a fee. Or protect me - for a fee. Or stand between me and my Supervisor – for a fee. Or to negotiate anything “on my behalf” (for a fee) by making my company and offer they can’t refuse. This isn’t 1930. If someone sexually harasses me, I have options. If I am unfairly passed up for promotion or fired unjustly, I have options. It’s 2006 – I’ll sue em. If my complaint is legitimate, I retire!
I guess my long-winded point is… I like it here at CitationShares as it is and don’t want or need any Union representation.

Oh boy, here we go again. I wanna be in the "being recognized for doing a good job club"..........yah, dont we all.....tell me this is a joke. If such a club even exists, do you truly think that kinda club is going to last there when you grow??? C'mon man, get back to reality. As you get bigger, nobody is going to know you if they stepped on you and nobody is going to care one way or another about how good a job you did...but rather, they WILL care about how bad a job you did. "I'll sue em"..........so, is that your insurance incase you have been wronged in some way??? I'm glad your happy at CS but dont let them drag that wool over your eyes.

 

[miles otoole]

Toolshed,

If you have to ask....

It looks like you have some reading to catch up on.

Just trying to learn. I am reading as fast as I can. Bear with moi.

 

[Necromonger]

Just trying to learn. I am reading as fast as I can. Bear with moi.

LOL

So, you DO have a sense of humor.

 

[Hawkered]

Navy to Civvy

Sadly it's your honorable background here as a distinguished serviceman that America is cashing in on.

"Death Before Dishonor", might be a battle cry of the Marines, but it applies to all branches of the US Military.

Somehow though you have not made the connection that your raises at Citation Shares were made to try and mirror our raises at Netjets after a well fought battle on the part of our union.

Many of your fellow airmen would ask us, "When are you guys getting your big contract, I really could use a raise?"

Some of us even found this inflammatory, but at least most CS/Flops and Flexjet already knew what we did, it was going to happen.

So how about doing some of the heavy lifting yourself there sailor?

 

[Humphreybogart]

f U D

What does this mean?? Secret code I guess.

 

[Humphreybogart]

Oh boy, here we go again. I wanna be in the "being recognized for doing a good job club"..........yah, dont we all.....tell me this is a joke. If such a club even exists, do you truly think that kinda club is going to last there when you grow??? C'mon man, get back to reality. As you get bigger, nobody is going to know you if they stepped on you and nobody is going to care one way or another about how good a job you did...but rather, they WILL care about how bad a job you did. "I'll sue em"..........so, is that your insurance incase you have been wronged in some way??? I'm glad your happy at CS but dont let them drag that wool over your eyes.

How do you know what is going to happen in OUR future here at Shares? Are you a fortune teller? Why don't you accept the fact that we have a great thing at Shares, and our management will do all they can to keep it that way? I know it must be frustrating to the NJ guys who have to fight for what they got, pay union dues, and hope not to strike so they can keep making money, to see a company like CS take care of their people without us having to fight for it. I think this really bugs you guys. Yes, it is that good at CS.

 

[netjetwife]

Hello all. I’ve been reading along for awhile, but this is my first post. I felt compelled to put in my two cents.
I’m not trying to spark a debate with a planted Union Rep or anyone like that because, regardless of who’s right or wrong, you can’t win. I find it frustrating when someone posts an honest question or comment, only to be massacred and drowned out with union jargon and personal “you’re so ignorant” attacks. I can only speak from my experience which is more than some and less than others. I’ve been flying for CS for a while now and, honestly, it’s a great place to work. That’s the bottom line. If you read through the posts, most of the people who actually work here say something similar. I’m happy with the pay, the benefits and I truly enjoy the professionals I work with - both on the flightline and in the office. I’m happy with how fast I was promoted and yes, I even like my Supervisor. I’ve flown for others and I feel there’s value in enjoying where you work and feeling like being part of a big team. For me, that makes up for the $1-2K more a year that another company might offer – and I don’t even know that they do.
It’s true we are very busy, but that’s because we are good. I see busy as a good thing - I love to fly, it’s why I became a pilot. Contrary to what some have said, I’m not just a number here. I feel that what some refer to as the “Good ole Boys Club” others would consider the “Being Recognized for Doing a Good Job Club”. Personally, that’s the club I want to be in. Personally, I don’t need the Union to negotiate my pay - for a fee. Or protect me - for a fee. Or stand between me and my Supervisor – for a fee. Or to negotiate anything “on my behalf” (for a fee) by making my company and offer they can’t refuse. This isn’t 1930. If someone sexually harasses me, I have options. If I am unfairly passed up for promotion or fired unjustly, I have options. It’s 2006 – I’ll sue em. If my complaint is legitimate, I retire!
I guess my long-winded point is… I like it here at CitationShares as it is and don’t want or need any Union representation.

For someone who professes to enjoy being part of a team, your post is awfully ego-centric, NtC. I do understand that you are happy with conditions at CS, but what about the pilots that don't have it that good? You say that you have options. What about those pilots who feel that they do not? It seems to me that those who have the most could afford to be generous with their encouragement and cheer on the pilots who have the guts to stand up for themselves. Can you not understand that raising standards across the industry shores up everyone's position? If I can't appeal to your generous nature, how about your selfish streak?

Hawkered, he's been to sea. Let's have NtC swap the deck--starting with his own post... We all know how badly red Kool-aid stains...lol

 

[Guitar rocker]

How do you know what is going to happen in OUR future here at Shares? Are you a fortune teller? Why don't you accept the fact that we have a great thing at Shares, and our management will do all they can to keep it that way? I know it must be frustrating to the NJ guys who have to fight for what they got, pay union dues, and hope not to strike so they can keep making money, to see a company like CS take care of their people without us having to fight for it. I think this really bugs you guys. Yes, it is that good at CS.

Bogart, I wish that I had that crystal ball which could make me that fortune teller. But, after having seen a small company grow a few times over, things really change. It's nice when everyone knows everyone, but when it gets bigger, nobody is gonna be on the phone after you land saying,"great job today!".......and that "I want to be recognized for a good job" club will be long gone! (That was truly funny....you gotta admit that Bogart) Nobody will care, but they will be the first to call you when something goes wrong though. That personal touch of it all gets thrown out the window as you grow. You continually refer to us as being frustrated with how great CS is as you say. I'm glad that "things are great at Shares". But it doesnt affect me one way or another. I could ask you why you have so bagged on our union??? I could also ask you why you and Trash imply that we are a "sweat shop" operation. You wont touch either one of these two questions and you run away from them like it's the end of the world.

It's not that I am sitting here and cant accept how "good things are at Shares." But rather, I am telling you to enjoy it while it lasts, because realistically it will change for the worse with the hiring you plan on doing. And when that happens, it's nice to have things in writing, and that is the point people are trying to get across to you here.

 

[Guitar rocker]

Navy to Civvy

Sadly it's your honorable background here as a distinguished serviceman that America is cashing in on.

"Death Before Dishonor", might be a battle cry of the Marines, but it applies to all branches of the US Military.

Somehow though you have not made the connection that your raises at Citation Shares were made to try and mirror our raises at Netjets after a well fought battle on the part of our union.

Many of your fellow airmen would ask us, "When are you guys getting your big contract, I really could use a raise?"

Some of us even found this inflammatory, but at least most CS/Flops and Flexjet already knew what we did, it was going to happen.

So how about doing some of the heavy lifting yourself there sailor?

Good post! I found it inflammatory when CS guys would ask when we were going to get our contract so they could get a raise too. But more disgusting than that is when the CS guys here turn that question around of theirs into "we got our raise because mgmt really likes us and we do a good job. We were going to get it regardless of your contract." Oh how quickly they forget! Lest we forget that Bogart also said,"I will never say thanks to an NJA pilot for my raise." They have traded in the word thankful and taken on ego instead.

 

[taloft]

[SIZE=-1]FUD is an abbreviation for Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt, a sales or marketing strategy of disseminating negative but vague or inaccurate information on a competitor's product. The term originated to describe misinformation tactics in the computer software industry and has since been used more broadly. [/SIZE]

 

[Humphreybogart]

[SIZE=-1]FUD is an abbreviation for Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt, a sales or marketing strategy of disseminating negative but vague or inaccurate information on a competitor's product. The term originated to describe misinformation tactics in the computer software industry and has since been used more broadly. [/SIZE]

Thanks, TA. I learned something. I knew I was missing out on something!

 

[Humphreybogart]

You continually refer to us as being frustrated with how great CS is as you say. I'm glad that "things are great at Shares". But it doesnt affect me one way or another. I could ask you why you have so bagged on our union??? I could also ask you why you and Trash imply that we are a "sweat shop" operation. You wont touch either one of these two questions and you run away from them like it's the end of the world.

Rocker, maybe the word "frustruated" is not a good word to use. I think you see us as "riding on NJ's coat tails" since our raise and I don't see it that way. Making it more clearly, the whole raise/union thing. What came first, the chicken or the egg scenario. I'm tired of talking about it as I am sure you are too. The whole fact of the matter is, we both received a nice raise, weather it was due to the union or not. Now can we debate something else?

I have been involved in different unions throughout the course of my life. It seemed the employment I had while being part of that union was always a battle for something. I am a very easy going person who doesn't need that type of added dramatics in my life. Being in a non-union environment is a breath of fresh air to me. So, I am not "bagging" on you're union, I am referring to all unions. Remember, it's just my opinion.

I can't speak for Trash, but I think the "sweatshop" term came from NJ's pre TA days and postings. I remember seeing that mentioned by what is assumed to be a NJ pilot.

 

[Humphreybogart]

For someone who professes to enjoy being part of a team, your post is awfully ego-centric, NtC. I do understand that you are happy with conditions at CS, but what about the pilots that don't have it that good? You say that you have options. What about those pilots who feel that they do not? It seems to me that those who have the most could afford to be generous with their encouragement and cheer on the pilots who have the guts to stand up for themselves. Can you not understand that raising standards across the industry shores up everyone's position? If I can't appeal to your generous nature, how about your selfish streak?

Hawkered, he's been to sea. Let's have NtC swap the deck--starting with his own post... We all know how badly red Kool-aid stains...lol

Navy has a great point, so why are you ragging on him? If you feel that you don't have it so good or you're not being treated fairly, it's simple...LEAVE. There are other jobs out there that you may be happier at. I don't think that Navy is being "ego-centric" at all.

This whole cool-aid thing is a big joke, you people don't know what it's like to work at a company that takes care of its people without us fighting for it. We are thought of as people at CS, not numbers. Hey Wife, maybe you should spend more time in the kitchen cleaning up after your husbands' messes, is the mop dry yet from wiping up all the crybaby tears. At CS, we have a very clean kitchen.