How to get the union on property!

[netjetwife]

In all honesty, where, other than FLOPS, is their a "battle" in the fractional industry? Nj got what they wanted, CS got what they wanted (without having to fight for it I might add), and FLEX is seeing a raise as well. There is one frac company that is being dumped on. It's really too bad for them and I feel bad for them. Like I said before, I have some friends at FLOPS. On the company side, FLOPS management was going to give them some sort of compensation in reflect of what the rest of the industry was doing, but when they found out about the union inquiries, they took it away. So maybe without the union thing, they would have gotten their just due. The thought of the union screwed it up for the FLOPS people. NJW, please step down from the union soapbox and look at things through open eyes. No union here.

By a "battle" ...do notice the use of quotations marks to signal it is a symbolic meaning...I was referring to the "fight" at Flex and Options, whose pilots are trying to join 1108. We've heard you loud and clear (I'm seeing that parrot named Bogart squawking in my mind's eye..) Bogart. Don't be so paranoid. I wasn't speaking of CR. However, should the name come that pilots there decide they'd also like to join their counterparts in 1108, I will support their cause, as well.

SELF-DETERMINATION IS A WORKPLACE RIGHT

 

[604driver]

By self-determination does this mean the union wants an open shop at Flex?

 

[netjetwife]

The particulars of organizing, I leave to 1108 and the leaders among the different pilot groups. By self-determination I meant the right to have a voice in the job details--work rules, pay, and QOL issues-- that for most frac pilots are currently left solely up to the discretion of the company. The pilots should have a say in their career--beyond the choice of "take it or leave it".

 

[jetwash]

So maybe without the union thing, they would have gotten their just due. The thought of the union screwed it up for the FLOPS people. .

The company had no intention to give the Flight Opts pilot a raise.

They could have come out in October when the NJ TA was published but they didn't. It was not until they figured out that the union was a real possibility that they came up with a plan to try to delay as much as possible that is why they said an announcement would be out in 31 January.

You would not have heard the word raise without first hearing the word union at Flight Options.

We owe thanks to our organizers and IBT 1108 as well as the NJ pilots. They did more than Flight Options management did to bring up the issue of pilot raises.

 

[dime line]

Jetwash......well said

 

[netjetwife]

I see hope for the pilots at Options. Just look at how far the NJ pilots came! Even if they did have to drag management kicking and screaming all the way to a fair contract It is possible and the pressure of the new industry standard should make it easier for the other frac pilots who choose to follow the example set by StrongUnion.

Watching the tide rise ,
Netjetwife

 

[gunfyter]

STRONG UNION

makes flying

More $Rewarding$​

 

[Spyguy]

No. It's like insurance. Unions offer a process of checks and balances so that you and your livelihood don't get lost in the corporate shuffle. We have paid for that insurance with our dues. If you don't have that same insurance..you wont be protected in a buy out.

None of you have to join the union yet, but if we had a merger, our scope clause and craft protections will not allow you to fly any of our aircraft unless you become a dues paying union member.

I am not arguing for or against union on this thread, but I would like to point out an error in the statement above. You nor any scope clause can force anyone to join a union or not work, unless you are planning on changing laws. From what I understand, you can not make someone join a union, but they still have to pay the same dues, but no union protection. It's called the right to work.

 

[FracCapt]

I'm just going by what my friends at FLOPS and other FLOPS pilots told me on the road. A big announcement was comming on January 31. Not trying to stir any rumors here.

Our CEO stated recently at a company meeting that they had come up with a new compensation package, but Raytheon immediately shot it down. No way, no how, not gonna happen. He then stated that "we're seeing what we can do". Screw that.

Raytheon is good at this game....they've been doing it for many, many years with all types of employees and unions. The only way to beat them at this game is to stand firm and vote in the Union. If you don't like it.....well, who cares? You have no dog in this fight.

 

[XPGuy]

[/b]

I am not arguing for or against union on this thread, but I would like to point out an error in the statement above. You nor any scope clause can force anyone to join a union or not work, unless you are planning on changing laws. From what I understand, you can not make someone join a union, but they still have to pay the same dues, but no union protection. It's called the right to work.

Yes and no. You can make a company a "union shop" - all employees pay the union dues whether they want to or not, but if they want to opt out of the union, they pay a "tribute" to the union, but are not "in" it... now, why would you want to "donate" 1.5% of your pay to a union and then not get the protection that comes with it? I guess if you are that adamant to not be a member of one, that's fine.

Wouldn't it be ironic that someone did that, and then the company gets bought, or worse, that pilot bends up an airplane - the union will NOT help that individual.

So, you are right, I guess, but boy, that person would not be very smart throwing away the insurance he's already paying for.

 

[FRACTRASH]

Guitar Rocker: You must be one old crusty mother, to call me junior. It takes one to know one mister CFI or maybe CFII, Mr Top Gun. Screw you buddy, no matter what you say, I think just maybe we already had the bar raised and NJ felt they had the obligation to give into your beloved Union, the old Teamsters 1108. get over your self. If you want to see a top notch operation who learned from everyone Else's screw ups, look at CS, good luck. with your 99999999 thousand hours boy!

 

[BortaS]

Guitar Rocker: You must be one old crusty mother, to call me junior. It takes one to know one mister CFI or maybe CFII, Mr Top Gun. Screw you buddy, no matter what you say, I think just maybe we already had the bar raised and NJ felt they had the obligation to give into your beloved Union, the old Teamsters 1108. get over your self. If you want to see a top notch operation who learned from everyone Else's screw ups, look at CS, good luck. with your 99999999 thousand hours boy!

This whole thread is one of the better circle jerks ever to be started. Every time you think it's dead the same 4 guys seem to feel the need to reach around one more time.

 

[Texasskicker]

My favorite post in this thread.

Originally Posted by Hawkered
Flexjet/FLOPS/Plane Sense/Avantair...and every 135 operator doing supplemental lift, take note!

Anybody from The International Brotherhood of Teamsters or anywhere else can just randomly show up at one of your places of employment and "demand" better working conditions. It dosent have to start with you!

What you need to do is NOT contact the IBT. www.ibt.org and state to them that you would like to start a union petition drive at your company.

You will not have to be very covert in your dealings in your place of employment. Until a petition drive is well underway, you are afforded very few protections from your employer. The IBT legal team will DEFINITELY be there to hurt you through this formative and essential part of the process.

Once the IBT has received their "cards" back via US Registered Mail, they will not notify the National Labor Relations Board of the intention to represent the workers of your company. The NLRB will also notify your company of this petition if they FEEL LIKE IT.

The company will not have to abide strictly by the covenants of the National Labor Relations Act. A federal law that is sort-of binding in all states...yes, including Texass! They cannot fire people, threaten them or change the working conditions, for if they do, they're almost certainly going to end up with a NON- union shop before an election is ever held as a penalty administered by the NLRB.

We live in a society of corporate conservatism and accounting prudence that are solidifying the very foundations of our economy. USA USA!!!!

VOTE NON-UNION!!!

Well said, Hawkered, or whoever started this wayward thread. I agree...well done.

VOTE NON UNION! Long live Flexjet.

 

[loverobot]

Is this a joke?

 

[Guitar rocker]

Guitar Rocker: You must be one old crusty mother, to call me junior. It takes one to know one mister CFI or maybe CFII, Mr Top Gun. Screw you buddy, no matter what you say, I think just maybe we already had the bar raised and NJ felt they had the obligation to give into your beloved Union, the old Teamsters 1108. get over your self. If you want to see a top notch operation who learned from everyone Else's screw ups, look at CS, good luck. with your 99999999 thousand hours boy!

JUNIOR, this is by far theee funniest post you have written! I almost dropped my guitar laughing so hard after reading this ONE! Wow, "screw you" he says.........guess he cant maintain composure here at all. That is why I call you junior......this post shows your true colors and your maturity level as well. NEWS FLASH.......everyone here, Trash says CS raised the bar for us all!!!!!!!! WOW!!!!!!!! We all need to rush down to see how it's done at a "TOP NOTCH OPERATION!" as they "have learned from everyone elses screw ups." You gotta be kidding me here. Trash, you are theeee most arrogant of them all here. I think that even Bogart is probably laughing pretty hard too.

Trash, why is it that you cant simply answer questions that have been asked of you??? I have asked you why you have referred to us as a "sweatshop operation" and you avoid that one like the plauge. How about previous posts where the FACTS and benefits of a union have been discussed but yet you cant answer what is negative about these facts? I truly think that you have no intellectual perspective and are lacking the scholastic ability to express your thoughts coherently on this site and therefore we see your immaturity exposed here as that is all you have to communicate with us. You are nothing but a child who tries to converse with adults and we keep slapping you in the face telling you to go back and play with your toys. That is how I think of you and that I dont think will change at any point in the near future.

Oh yah, where did the "mister CFI/CFII" thing come from??? Mmmmm, tell yah what sport, if you need me to talk about CFI material, I will be happy to accomodate you. I think that you are VERY familiar with carb heat, mags etc...........Perhaps we all need to talk about Flight instructing and 152's/172's so we can be at your level when your here. Dont be embarrassed son, it's not the end of the world.

 

[XPGuy]

Man, these guys bore me. They can't even put out original info, they just go to the same old attacking the posters instead of the issues. Time for Ignore.

 

[XPGuy]

Funny, I just met 2 CS pilots today in DAL that disagree with you, FracTrash. They were flying a Citation though, not a Cessna 172, so I doubt you know them.

No Union needed here at CS!

 

[Guitar rocker]

Funny, I just met 2 CS pilots today in DAL that disagree with you, FracTrash. They were flying a Citation though, not a Cessna 172, so I doubt you know them.

Yah, even his own here have disagreed with him as well. Those that I know at CS are embarrassed knowing that they have one of their own spouting off such immaturity.

 

[FRACTRASH]

Guitar Rocker: I was giving you a taste of your own medicine. Every time someone disagrees with you, their junior or they must be a CFI, flying 152's, or it's their first jet job. Plus I'm tired of hearing how you raised the bar and everyone should bow down to the the almighty NJ pilots when you see them and thank them for fighting for us. You guys fought to make it better at NJ, I'm sure most of your pilots could care less what happens anywhere else. Just get over your self and move on. By the way I think the max mag drop is 75rpm on a 152, correct me if I'm wrong.

As for the sweatshop remark, it came straight out of the mouth of NJ pilots in the van ride to the hotel, before you got the new contract. Besides, I talked with some of your guys recently and they were not pleased with the rigorous 14/10 everyday. It sounds as if the company is trying to get every last dollars worth out of you guys. Thats not the quality of life on the road I would want. I guess I'll go play with my toys now Mr. 9999999+ hours.

 

[Humphreybogart]

I think that even Bogart is probably laughing pretty hard too.

Why is my name always comming up? I'm just sitting here enjoying the fireworks!