How to get the union on property!

[dime line]

"Reading the article that was discussed in other posts, our raise was going to be given to us regardless if NJ ratified their contract or not. Did our management know what NJ was going for, sure, but even if you didn't vote in your TA, we would have received our raise."


You seemed normal on all of your views untill I read this, and then it all changed. You cannot believe for one minute that you were going to get a raise, like the one you recieved, on merit did you? Its funny how your raise is just 1% above what NJ got. I just don't get it. Your enjoying life and that is great, at RTA we were too, but the only reason you got your raise was NJ's contract. The NJ's contract was the "icing on the cake" for FLOPS strong union drive, and FLEX getting a raise in May.

 

[netjetwife]

Everybody has their own opinion on anything that is discussed. It doesn't matter if people agree with what I say or not, we're still are entitled to our own opinions. I don't agree with alot of things that you say on here, but you have your right for your opinion.

Bogart, being the fair, open-minded person that you are (according to your post) we can also believe that you would support the rights of your fellow pilots to decide their career futures by voting---right? In the context of your post, "opinion" is interchangeable with "vote", is it not. Take a look---

Everybody has their own vote on anything that is discussed. It doesn't matter if people agree with what I say or not, we're still all entitled to our own votes. I don't agree with alot of things that you say on here, but you have your right for your vote.

Finding common ground,
Netjetwife

PS I suddenly remembered a friend's parrot--named Bogart. As many times as I've seen your name, it didn't call up that memory. Until now.
It must have been the loud squawking (anti-union) tone of your post....

 

[Guitar rocker]

I'm sure there are some people at CS that would like to see a union here. They definately are not the majority. We at CS don't hang around the FBO and discuss how to get a union on property, it was never even brought up to me by anyone at CS. The only talk about unions and CS, come from you people from the outside trying to make waves with a company that is exceling because of the hard work of their employees. I am happy for you, Rocker, and all your buddies on here that are happy working for a union shop. I am also happy that I DON'T work at a union shop. Why is that so hard for you union guys to accept?

Reading the article that was discussed in other posts, our raise was going to be given to us regardless if NJ ratified their contract or not. Did our management know what NJ was going for, sure, but even if you didn't vote in your TA, we would have received our raise.

Everybody has their own opinion on anything that is discussed. It doesn't matter if people agree with what I say or not, we're still are entitled to our own opinions. I don't agree with alot of things that you say on here, but you have your right for your opinion.

Bogart, I accept the fact that you do not want a union on the property. That is fine. Our company used to be small and we all knew everyone on a first name basis at one point too. We all knew who to go to if we had a problem. When it gets big, all the faces change. Those that were in a position to believe your word and help you are no longer there for you and they wont even have time for you. When new mgmt comes in, some managers like pilots and then there are those who dont. Perhaps someday you will see that a union acts as a buffer between you and that revolving door of ever changing rules/policies of mgmt as they come and go. It's sad, but it will happen to CS too. Give it some time.

As for the raise that we got you, I would have to say that your mgmt has truly brainwashed you.They are all probably laughing at the fact that you believe that you were going to get a raise becuase you are such good guys and deserved it, regardless of the outcome of our contract. They have you wrapped right around their fingers, dont they??? If you believe THAT, I wonder what else they have sold you on??? Yah, that article does say that you were going to get a raise, but one that would mirror ours when our contract was voted in. One of your own had the courtsey and gratefulness to acknowledge the fact that the raise CS got was as a result of NJA's pilots/union. He mentioned that based on your ungrateful and embarrassing attitude, that he hoped you didnt even work at CS.

In another 5+ years when we re-negotiate our contract, and CS follows suit with a pay raise (just as they did this time), please dont say, "I will never say thanks to an NJA pilot for my raise" again. I really have to question where your dignity is, if not for us, but for your own.

 

[netjetwife]

Just to clarify your post, GR---

The NJ pilots will have a contract ready to replace the current one ON the day it expires. That guarantee is in the contract because it provides for negotiations in advance. The framework of meetings --5 a month--(as a minimum) has already been agreed upon. StrongUnion was determined not to fall victim to the incessant foot-dragging that the pilots were subjected to last time.

UNIONS.....AN OUNCE OF PREVENTION IS WORTH A POUND OF CURE!

 

[Guitar rocker]

Just to clarify your post, GR---

The NJ pilots will have a contract ready to replace the current one ON the day it expires. That guarantee is in the contract because it provides for negotiations in advance. The framework of meetings --5 a month--(as a minimum) has already been agreed upon. StrongUnion was determined not to fall victim to the incessant foot-dragging that the pilots were subjected to last time.

UNIONS.....AN OUNCE OF PREVENTION IS WORTH A POUND OF CURE!

Yes, thats what I meant. But you are indeed correct.

 

[Majik]

Rocker, the merit system was put in place so that the person who excelled in their duties was rewarded with an upgrade, bonus or whatever. In every business there are people who excel and people who just bide their time. The merit system was set up to award the go the extra mile people maybe a little sooner than the bide your time people. Seniority still has alot to do with when you upgrade. CS won't take a 9 month go the extra mile person and upgrade them before a 12 month bide your time person.

Why do you think that every company would benefit with a union? IBM doesn't have a union and look how large they are. We are treated great by management here at CS. That is why there will NEVER be a union here at CS. We have alot of people from union backgrounds that are relieved to be away from a union shop. If you can't accept that fact, I'm sorry. I am not management, just a pilot flying the line like you. I don't even know while I'm answering you, because you won't answer my questions as to how long does it take on average to upgrade at NJ?

In a perfect world, you are right. It would be great if everyone could always stand on the same scale and be judged solely on merit. But when the managers that do the promotion decisions are out of sight and thousands of miles away, the equality of their judgement is a guess at best. Haven't you ever made a safety decision based on your experience and the fact that you were on the scene, only to be second-guessed by a manager that has a schedule to meet and owner services breathing down his neck? Are you sure he won't negatively remember your name as the guy that he had problems with, regardless of whether it was your fault. Having some form of job protection is like insurance.

Insurance is nothing but wasted money until you need it, and then it's the best money you ever spent. You may feel lucky and gamble that you will never need insurance. Good luck with that decision. I have friends at Options that were promised NJA pay plus 15% (remember that?). Since then, their quality of life has been going downhill fast.

The fear of a union is what has given your management the motivation to increase your pay at CS. I'm really happy for you that we (Local 1108) were able to scare your management into keeping you from falling too far behind us. I'll also be happy if your gamble pays off and they continue to match whatever gains NJA pilots are able to achieve over the next 20 years. The day they don't may be the day you wish you had purchased some insurance.

 

[netjetwife]

Speaking of insurance, I was very pleased to see short-term coverage added to the contract. I know 3 pilots within our gateway that had undue financial stress added to their injuries of --a broken arm, a broken leg, and a knee replacement. 1108 recognized the problem and went to bat for the pilot group. Accidents can happen to anyone. Pilots should ask themselves what position they'd be in if it happened to them. What is the policy where you work? Would your family lose its income? Has your meager salary allowed you to build up a significant emergency fund? What if you were the one in the next car wreck? When you're injured, keeping a roof over your family's head should be the least of your worries.

 

[FRACTRASH]

You only have to worry about the merit system, if you're one of these pilots that do a poor job. Not anyone deserves to excel in a company if they don't put out the goods. Most companies outside aviation have some kind of merit system.

As for my opinion of Unions, My father worked in the steel industry under a union for many years and lost his job, Thanks union! My grandfather worked in the coal industry under a union, lost his job, Thanks union! My uncle worked in the trucking industry, got screwed by Teamsters! I worked for an airline under ALPA for several years and also got screwed by the union. What makes you think your union will be any different. Remember this, your owner at NJ has deeper pockets then any union, so good luck with your future at NJ.

 

[Hawkered]

Fractrash; can you spell P-i-t-t-s-b-u-r-g-h? Okay, so you went to one of those Useless Air wannabe commuters? So you could say, "Two years ago I couldn't even fly a plane, now I'm an airline pilot!"

I think I saw you in Flying Magazine.

Fractrash, if you knew anything about any of these industries you just quoted you would know that unions had little to do with their demise.

Let me start with USair. Three screwed up mergers: Usair-Piedmont, Usair-PSA and Usair-Trump (Eastern) Shuttle. Three screwed up CEOs: Ed Cologny,(who ordered all those freakin' F-100s), Seth Schofield, (started as a baggage handler and spent his whole time as CEO on the golf course), and Steven Wolfe, (give it a coat of paint, call it new and take a golden parachute for doin' nothin').

They operated fifteen different aircraft on a predominantly East Coast domestic market with the corresponding costs of parts, staffing and training. Fourteen more than were necessary for doing the job. They were so ineffective at negotiations they nearly sold off half the operation at a fire sale to British Airways, their only hope of international-feed because no other alliance partner wanted them!

You blame the unions for this?!!

Alright...the steel industry.

The Japanese didn't stop sneak attacks after 1941!

They figured out that by dumping cheap steel on the US auto' industry they could lure the US manufacturers into believing there would be an endless supply of cheap steel. GM, Chrysler, Ford and Chevy bought it, and the steel mills were forced to close.

The price of Japanese steel has gone up more than tenfold and now the US Auto Industry is in trouble!

The problem now is not the unions but the EPA, it would take ten years to start one mill of the comparable size you saw of the seven or eight in Aliquippa as a small child.

Alrighty...then.

Coal. Yeppo those poor miners in Sago really held the gun to managements head now didn't they?!

You dumb idiot!!!

So you want child labor and no enforced workplace safety provisions.

Where do you think all of this started? The Teamsters probably save your sorry backside from being hit by a truck hauling steel as a small child too. That's where truck driver logs started so they wouldn't be falling asleep at the wheel.

Those nasty, nasty unions!

 

[XPGuy]

More FUD from fracttrash which only further proves he knows absolutely nothing about what he's trying to talk about.


Go back to the general aviation section, fractrash. This area is for professional pilots (and netjetswife).