Future Prospects Ahead for Legacy ASA

[IBNAV8R]

I'd have to agree that a mixed fleet is not as safe. Flying a -200 and a -700, while similar, land and ground handle very differently. The disparity of operations grows damn-near every day with each new BS AD. Of the runway excursions we've had, I'd suspect at least some are due to -200/700 differences.

I've actually refused several -200 equipment downgrades in situations that would be normal ops for someone who flew it exclusively. To the co's credit, I never heard anything more about it. (I suspect because they don't want the FAA getting wind of that argument)

I would also agree that the motivation behind the Brad Holt Override is to save the co. money in soft time. My guess is INC. would fight integration tooth and nail just to keep mixed-fleet flying on the Skywest side.

 

[Speedtape]

Speedtape, most people on this board know how selfish you are. You aren't fooling anyone. The sad thing is like so many other ALPA supporting baby boomers before you, you will end up shooting yourself in the foot. Your only solace will be that you hurt more people junior to yourself.

It's also obvious how blind you are to anything that doesn't fit your agenda so I will be asking you for specific examples of your rants.
Actually, I am very open minded about contract improvements--ones that are good for you and me. That is my agenda. I don't cosider Dual Qual a contract improvement but a wedge that will be devisive. And, I don't really see it getting much traction, but I am certainly willing to discuss, debate, and have discovery on the issue. Rants? If you feel insecure about discussing relevant issues and choose to make rant allegations against those with opposing views, then color me a ranter. I feel very comfortable arguing the points and request that you engage in meaningful dialogue instead of hurling false charges to try to brow beat those who don't agree with you with your emotional and elementary tactics.

First you say that Skywest pilots would have a say if we merge all 3 lists. How do you figure?
Quite simply, most don't want on your list. They do have an influence in the matter. JA apparently does not want them on your list either, or it would have happened. When was ASA purchased?

Also I want examples of how ALPA airlines are growing more than their non union counterparts.
Who made that statement? Capacity cuts are the current name of the game, not growth. Even Southwest is somewhat stagnant except for the purchase of Airtran. It's the economy and has nothing to do with union or non-union. Virgin may be the only airline out there that is adding some capacity, and I am not sure that is wise in today's economy.

I still want an example on how PBS brought us growth like you advertised. Seems like it's allowing the company to shrink us just like I said from the very beginning.
I didn't advertise anything. PBS put us in a competitive position with the other DCI carriers because it is a staffing tool. At this point growth will not be from a result of the current state of the economy but the failure of other regionals in our industry. A large majority of the pilots I talk to like PBS and would not return to line bidding because they have more control over their schedule.

You say that dual qual decreases safety so much. I'm sure you have some examples.
I said that it is safer to operate the CR2 separately. That is why it was implemented that way 10 or so years ago. Talk to a number of instructors and see what they tell you. It mitigates risk and is a better practice for Threat Management. The airplanes operate differently and have quite different characteristics. You would understand that if you had flown both. There are at least 400 or more pilots that have and can answer that question for you.

Until later.

 

[Speedtape]

I'd have to agree that a mixed fleet is not as safe. Flying a -200 and a -700, while similar, land and ground handle very differently. The disparity of operations grows damn-near every day with each new BS AD. Of the runway excursions we've had, I'd suspect at least some are due to -200/700 differences.

I've actually refused several -200 equipment downgrades in situations that would be normal ops for someone who flew it exclusively. To the co's credit, I never heard anything more about it.

I would also agree that the motivation behind the Brad Holt Override is to save the co. money in soft time. My guess is INC. would fight integration tooth and nail just to keep mixed-fleet flying on the Skywest side.

Thanks for your response! Assuming you are a SW pilot, do you think the majority of your pilots desire a merger and list integration? It's ok to be honest. Honestly, I am not sure that combining ASA and XJet is a great idea and it still may never happen with a common contract and seniority list. From what I hear, we are years away from that happening.

 

[aircombat]

Thanks for your response! Assuming you are a SW pilot, do you think the majority of your pilots desire a merger and list integration? It's ok to be honest. Honestly, I am not sure that combining ASA and XJet is a great idea and it still may never happen with a common contract and seniority list. From what I hear, we are years away from that happening.

Of course SW pilots don't desire a merger. Like previously pointed out. Non union companies reap all of the benefits from their ALPA counterparts. And of course JA wouldn't want a merger either. What manager would want scope protection, yet it does exist. The point is that if we wanted, and we should want, a merger is possible. We wouldn't need SW pilots approval.

 

[aircombat]

I said that it is safer to operate the CR2 separately. That is why it was implemented that way 10 or so years ago. Talk to a number of instructors and see what they tell you. It mitigates risk and is a better practice for Threat Management. The airplanes operate differently and have quite different characteristics. You would understand that if you had flown both. There are at least 400 or more pilots that have and can answer that question for you.

I never said that dual qual wouldn't affect safety at all. And I'm sure that 10 years ago that excuse was used just like you use it now. But now, just as in back then, we all know the real reason. Maybe a little pay but mostly it's your ego that you are so concerned about. Other companies have dual qual. Were are the accident examples. And FWI I have been between nearly every seat from the ATR to 900.

 

[Speedtape]

Of course SW pilots don't desire a merger. Like previously pointed out. Non union companies reap all of the benefits from their ALPA counterparts.
It is what it is. You need to get over that and move on. Why do you even care what they get?

And of course JA wouldn't want a merger either.
And until he does,if ever, it WILL NOT HAPPEN! He has the ideal situation with at least 2 Companies within Inc competing for flying. Maintaining them separately, helps control the costs of both (If we are smart.)

What manager would want scope protection, yet it does exist. The point is that if we wanted, and we should want, a merger is possible.
I want a million dollars. Gaining it is more likely to happen than any "want" we have for a merger. You should apply for JA's job, maybe then you could change it. But, then, if you had his insight, you probably wouldn't want it to happen.

We wouldn't need SW pilots approval.
You may need to get a reality check on this one. Are you able to force your significant other to do something he/she does not want to do? We are not dictators or Kings. We also have very little leverage in this matter.

The only history of this happening in this industry that I am familiar with is the American Eagle Project and the Mesa/Freedom Project. At Amercian Eagle, three or four commuters (that was what they were called) that were outsourcers for American, all were willing participants for a slaughter in the mid 90's. They wanted it so bad that they were willing to make concessions and sign a 15 year contract. They managed to put it together, but at a significant long term cost. That contract ran out last year. Now look at the situation, what good did it do them? At Mesa, they had to give away the farm to get Freedom on their list. Again, what good did it do them?

In summary, "We" cannot have any influence over merging all because ALL are not willing participants and the INC MGMT has been very clear that it will not happen--ask the Xjet guys. And if we were, there would be a cost too steep to make it happen. Based on the history above, most pilots wouldn't want to make those kind of sacrifices. It's a pipedream and the benefits would never outweight the benefits--history proves it!

 

[aircombat]

Originally Posted by aircombat
Of course SW pilots don't desire a merger. Like previously pointed out. Non union companies reap all of the benefits from their ALPA counterparts.
It is what it is. You need to get over that and move on. Why do you even care what they get?

Well you should. They are getting your beloved 700/900s
Your American Eagle and Mesa examples are completely different. I don't know if there is an example of a union airline forcing a merger with a non union airline. ALPA seems to like the whipsaw and it will be their downfall. Just because it hasn't happened doesn't mean it can't. And mark my words the cost of not doing so will eventually be higher than not.

 

[777forever]

Lol of course it is safer to operate 200/700 separately just as it is safer to stay in bed all day than to risk getting up and hurting yourself

 

[Freebrd]

Lol of course it is safer to operate 200/700 separately just as it is safer to stay in bed all day than to risk getting up and hurting yourself

astounding

 

[Oakum_Boy]

Were are the accident examples. And FWI I have been between nearly every seat from the ATR to 900.

So what, you've flown four airplanes? Whoop de friggin doo. There is no way someone going from six months of flying the -200 just hops in a -900 and has a stellar time of it. No way. You assume the people you work with are competent. You have to look at the entire pilot group and understand exactly what you're dealing with. Safety departments look at the big picture, which isn't you. Plenty of idiots here who get through only by the graces of their ******************** eating Southern accent.

 

[SpaceShipEarth]

Hell I'm scary enough in just one aircraft here and I've flown 40 different types.... I'm a no vote on dual qual.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

Hell I'm scary enough in just one aircraft here and I've flown 40 different types.... I'm a no vote on dual qual.

Having just done 200,700 and 900 in one 4 day trip, while they all look similar, the differences are enough to be a distraction.

 

[Flyguy1226]

So... when is this USAirways flying coming?

 

[79%N1]

So... when is this USAirways flying coming?

It's not......

Unfounded rumor with zero basis in fact.

 

[damnflyboy]

It's not......

Unfounded rumor with zero basis in fact.

Ok. So I'm going to crawl back into my hole and continue dying.