Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Friendliest aviation Ccmmunity on the web
  • Modern site for PC's, Phones, Tablets - no 3rd party apps required
  • Ask questions, help others, promote aviation
  • Share the passion for aviation
  • Invite everyone to Flightinfo.com and let's have fun

Flexjet Union Drive on the move

Welcome to Flightinfo.com

  • Register now and join the discussion
  • Modern secure site, no 3rd party apps required
  • Invite your friends
  • Share the passion of aviation
  • Friendliest aviation community on the web
Register   Log in
Av8rr said:
Hmm... there have been several leave and go over to NJ to "self destruct".
Click to expand...

My dogs not in this fight, but your statement assumes that the parent companies of both FlexJets and NetJets are in similar financial situations and have equally deep pockets.

This is not the case. Berkshire Hathaway is profitable. As a matter of fact, yesterday's Wallstreet Journal called their BRKA stock a bargain at $100,000 a share. Thus, they can continue to withstand NetJets' losses.

On the other hand, Bombardier, FlexJet's parent company, is losing money and yesterday announced that they were laying off an additional 1330 employees after having just layed off 1980 people at their Montreal and Toronto plants and closing their Tucson location. They cannot long sustain losses from any quarter.

Bombardier's losses combined with FlexJet's narrow margins (for similar aircraft Flex purchase prices, monthly management fees and occupied hourly fees are significantly less than NetJets) may constitute a compelling reason not to increase operating expenses at this critical juncture for FlexJets future.


GV
 
GVFlyer said:
My dogs not in this fight, but your statement assumes that the parent companies of both FlexJets and NetJets are in similar financial situations and have equally deep pockets.

They cannot long sustain losses from any quarter.

Bombardier's losses combined with FlexJet's narrow margins (for similar aircraft Flex purchase prices, monthly management fees and occupied hourly fees are significantly less than NetJets) may constitute a compelling reason not to increase operating expenses at this critical juncture for FlexJets future.


GV
Click to expand...

GV,

I think the FlexJets pilots are in a stronger position than anyone else.

Who will sell Lears and Challengers on the Fractional market if Bombardier does not operate Flexjets?
 
GVFlyer said:
My dogs not in this fight, but your statement assumes that the parent companies of both FlexJets and NetJets are in similar financial situations and have equally deep pockets.

This is not the case. Berkshire Hathaway is profitable. As a matter of fact, yesterday's Wallstreet Journal called their BRKA stock a bargain at $100,000 a share. Thus, they can continue to withstand NetJets' losses.

On the other hand, Bombardier, FlexJet's parent company, is losing money and yesterday announced that they were laying off an additional 1330 employees after having just layed off 1980 people at their Montreal and Toronto plants and closing their Tucson location. They cannot long sustain losses from any quarter.

Bombardier's losses combined with FlexJet's narrow margins (for similar aircraft Flex purchase prices, monthly management fees and occupied hourly fees are significantly less than NetJets) may constitute a compelling reason not to increase operating expenses at this critical juncture for FlexJets future.


GV
Click to expand...

Site your source. Bombardier is NOT losing money.
 
cosmotheassman said:
Site your source. Bombardier is NOT losing money.
Click to expand...

You should be able to tell all you need to know about Bombardier’s profitability by looking at their stock price compared to that of their competitors (2:46PM 10/26/2006).

Bombardier (FlexJet) is valued at $3.47

Here are the competitors.

Berkshire Hathaway (NetJets) – BRK.A $104,600.00
BRK.B $3,481.00

Textron B (Citation Shares)- $319.00

General Dynamics (Gulfstream) – $72.25

Raytheon (Flight Options) - $49.21


Here are the sources to support my post concerning Bombardier layoffs.

http://wichita.bizjournals.com/wichita/stories/2006/10/23/daily8.html

http://milwaukee.bizjournals.com/wichita/stories/2006/10/23/daily8.html

The previous layoffs I cited are detailed here.

http://www.cbc.ca/money/story/2003/03/05/bombardier_030305.html



Bombardier is also laying off workers in it’s non-aviation businesses

http://money.canoe.ca/News/Sectors/Industrials/Bombardier/2006/09/19/1862958-ap.html



Here is an excerpt from a recent article concerning Bombardier’s decline in profits.

From the Wichita Business Journal
Bombardier Aerospace logged a 31 percent increase in business jet orders during the second quarter of 2006, yet parent company Bombardier Inc. saw its net profit drop 50 percent versus the second quarter of 2005.

The Montreal-based company posted a net income of $58 million for the three months ending July 31 compared to $117 million for the same time period last year.





GV







~
 
Last edited:
gunfyter said:
OK

The second article you linked to was from 2003. All of business aviation was hurting that year.

NJ Inc had pilot layoffs at EJM. About 50 I think.
Click to expand...


I clarified my post to show that the quote was from the previous round of Bombardier cuts (which resulted in the Tucson Learjet Assembly plant's closure last year) which I had referenced in my original post.

GV
 
Hey Av,

I think that was a demonstration of the true ignorance. He really thinks that BRK has 30,144 times the market cap of Bombardier. And, I don't know, might that also be Canadian dollars?
 
EdAtTheAirport said:
Hey Av,

I think that was a demonstration of the true ignorance. He really thinks that BRK has 30,144 times the market cap of Bombardier. And, I don't know, might that also be Canadian dollars?
Click to expand...

What a truly asinine post. No one with even a vestigial understanding of the market would make such an assumption. To suggest as much is acutely inane.

I'm managing a seven figure diversified personal portfolio from which I'm enjoying a greater than 14% annual return. How are you doing with your equities and bonds, Ed?

Market cap may be a good indicator of the size of a company, but certainly not it's profitability. What do you suspect Chrysler's or United Airlines' market cap was on the eve of their respective bankruptcies?

A better indicator would be revenues versus earnings.

Bombardier Annual Revenue - 16.750B CAD, Earnings - 232m CAD (projected- down significantly from last year).

Berkshire Hathaway Annual Revenue - $81.663B, EBITDA - $17.22B

Since it seems to be important to you, I'll provide market cap as well.

Bombardier - 6,978 million CAD

Berkshire Hathaway - $161.45 Billion

Of course Bombardier is quoted in CAD, it's traded on the Toronto exchange.

And Av8rr, some profitable companies, like General Dynamics have recently split (March 27, 2006) and climbed right back up, Bombardier hasn't had the growth to offer a stock spilt in recent memory.

Any way you look at it, Berkshire Hathaway has much deeper pockets than Bombardier - which was my original thesis.


GV
 
GVFlyer said:
You should be able to tell all you need to know about Bombardier’s profitability by looking at their stock price compared to that of their competitors (2:46PM 10/26/2006).
~
Click to expand...

You are the one who tell all he needed to know about a company by its stock price. You either didn't know what you were talking about, or you were a fraud for arguing something that you knew to be irrelevant.

There was nothing asinine about my post other than the subject. You're the one who wrote it.
 
EdAtTheAirport and Av8rr - what a pair! They can't tell the difference between a stock that's $3.47 Canadian and one that sells for $100,000. What a couple of scholars!

You clearly don't understand GVFlyer's post or the significance of the information he gave you.

...just like a pig looking at a wrist watch.
 

Share this page

Latest posts

Latest resources

Latest media

Carbon Cub FX-3 Shenandoah Valley
Back
Top