Corporate vs. Commercial

[Skyline]

Danger Kitty

DK,

Yea I have been a pro-pilot for almost 20 years. In the early years I worked jobs like corporate or for FS contract work where I didn't fly that much. One of the years I made the most money I only flew 155 hours while on a Forest Service contract. I knew a guy who was a 20 year tanker Captain who only had 2600 total time. I also have periods of time when I was furloughed or laid off like now. Technically I am a BE200 Captain right now. I was hired and trained over a year and a half ago. I get piss tested and go to recurrent training but they haven't been able to buy a plane yet, so I haven't flown much all during that time.

To answer your other question, yes I am a little upset at aviation in general. In case you haven't noticed a lot of us are very disappointed right now. You are right about me being a moron I guess. It has never really crossed my mind to want to work for a corporate department. Those little jets seemed more like a torture tubes to me. It was only by accident that I ended up in the Lear and Citation. My only focus was to do what it took to get to a major airline. I mean corporate was a dead end. You go do it though. Someone has to I guess.

Skyline

 

[Cheebs501]

Sounds like someone is just pissed because no corporate flight department in their right mind would hire you.

How is corporate a dead end?

 

[Gulfstream 200]

Yeah...

Lets hear how corporate ia a dead end. Im curious.

Hey....Who's the one laid off?

Does ALPA have a shuttle bus that takes you guys to unemployment?....then goes over to negotiations and "fights" for your next 29% pay cut?....

(there I go again, just jealous of airline guys...)

Me thinks skyline was a charter reject who landed at a reject airline.

It all makes sense now.

 

[Skyline]

Yea

Cheebs501

I have never liked the idea and never willingly applied to a corporation for a flying job. My mind is wired to only see the major airlines as a good place to spend a career so anything that doesnt serve that purpose is a waste of time to me. Therefore, building more Lear or Citation time has little value to me. It would only lead to more Lears and Citations.

Events as of late with the airlines has dulled that quite a bit but not enough for me to consider corporate as an alternative. I like flying the same route in the same plane and staying in the same hotel room at the end of the day. It might not be home but the familiarity is comforting and much easier than having to fly into strange places all the time.

Skyline

 

[Skyline]

Gs 200

GS 200,

I don't like charter or corporate style flying. Its no secret. You could say they rejected me but it was I who quit to go to the airlines years ago. Corporate is a dead end since it doesnt really lead back to the airlines. They are into hiring CRJ kid Captains. Therefore corporate flying would be a dead end for someone with airline aspirations.

Skyline

 

[Bjetset2]

The Truth

Live it up. You corporate/charter guys have always had an inferiority complex. Well today is your time in the sun. I am sure that at one time most of you tried hard to get on with a major airline. You don't have to even deny it because I know you will. Many a corporate hangar is filled with airline rejects. Well get out there and crow. The bus drivers have fallen on hard times. For now at least you can dance for us.

Skyline


All in good fun.

I am glad you put "all in good fun" on your post or I would have gotten nasty. I have a Fortune 20 Corporate job and I can tell you it's FANTASTIC. I did just interview with SWA and was turned down as were many airline furloughees and military guys, all highly competent aviators and good guys. That does not give me a "complex" because I have the luxury of KNOWING my current job is better than MOST airline jobs. SWA interests me because of their culture and other airlines just don't get it, on the labor or management side of the fence. I'll wait my year to re-apply at SWA , and continue collecting my 135K, plus profit sharing, plus stock options, with a schedule, loss of license insurance, etc......

 

[Skyline]

Bjetset2

Bjetset,

Thanks but I wouln't be getting an inferiority complex. You are serving to prove one of my points about corporate flying. Even guys with jobs that have a lot of money thrown at them desire to leave for the airlines.

Skyline

 

[Dangerkitty]

DK,

Yea I have been a pro-pilot for almost 20 years. In the early years I worked jobs like corporate or for FS contract work where I didn't fly that much. One of the years I made the most money I only flew 155 hours while on a Forest Service contract. I knew a guy who was a 20 year tanker Captain who only had 2600 total time. I also have periods of time when I was furloughed or laid off like now. Technically I am a BE200 Captain right now. I was hired and trained over a year and a half ago. I get piss tested and go to recurrent training but they haven't been able to buy a plane yet, so I haven't flown much all during that time.

To answer your other question, yes I am a little upset at aviation in general. In case you haven't noticed a lot of us are very disappointed right now. You are right about me being a moron I guess. It has never really crossed my mind to want to work for a corporate department. Those little jets seemed more like a torture tubes to me. It was only by accident that I ended up in the Lear and Citation. My only focus was to do what it took to get to a major airline. I mean corporate was a dead end. You go do it though. Someone has to I guess.

Skyline

I flew for AA for three years and was laid of in 2003. In just over a year from that I was hired to fly a Falcon 50EX at the same pay rate that I was flying a S-80 for AA under the old (and better) payscale. I have far better benefits and fly to much better places. I stay at better hotels, and eat at better restaurants. I have a much much much much better schedule. I rarely fly on weekends and never fly on holidays. I even have a stable retirement fund in place. Plus I fly a much better aircraft.

If you dont like Corporate then fine. But to say that there are not good Corporate jobs out there or that 90% of the Corporate jobs suck is an uneducated statement to say the least. Most people that succeed in this business or anything else in life will probably say the following statement; "Disregard the naysayers. Don't believe the people that will tell you that you will never succeed in xxxxx line of work."

I was told to get out of aviation at a very early point in my training. I never listened to any of it and now I make six figures working for the employer of my dreams. 95% of my success comes from a good attitude, motivation, and a good work ethic.

I dont know about your motivation or work ethic but from your posts I can tell that you attitude is not very good. Might wanna take a long good look in the mirror. Maybe the only thing that is holding you back is you.

 

[Bjetset2]

SWA and NO OTHER

Bjetset,

Thanks but I wouln't be getting an inferiority complex. You are serving to prove one of my points about corporate flying. Even guys with jobs that have a lot of money thrown at them desire to leave for the airlines.

Skyline

ONE airline. If it's not yours, you should go to corporate. If SWA is your carrier , I'll be the first to congratulate you on a fine job move. I am going to pick up my kids and go to the park. I did edit out the "complex" part after you read it. Sorry about that. Signing off. Have a nice day sir.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

GS 200,

I don't like charter or corporate style flying. Its no secret. You could say they rejected me but it was I who quit to go to the airlines years ago. Corporate is a dead end since it doesnt really lead back to the airlines. They are into hiring CRJ kid Captains. Therefore corporate flying would be a dead end for someone with airline aspirations.

Skyline

"airline aspirations"..."corporate dead end"

Again, who is the one unemployed?

I know of quite a few unemployed airline pilots, I know ZERO unemployed corporate pilots...and this had been since 2001...thats 5 years almost. Keep telling yourself thats a "cycle"

When are you going to realize the old days are gone? heck, it sounds like you never even made those big airline bucks! You are crying about the good old times you never even experienced! You are a wanna-be, you have crap experience, and the coffin sealer....a loser attitude.

People transition from corp to airline and back again all the time. Its all about personality and contacts. I know folks who left 6 figure DAL jobs and walked into 6 figure corp jobs very easily....

now tell me, why are YOU unemployed???

I know, its the market, 9/11, George Bush, the LCC's, ......

its something huh?

wonder what that could be?

 

[fokkerjet]

Cheebs501

I have never liked the idea and never willingly applied to a corporation for a flying job. My mind is wired to only see the major airlines as a good place to spend a career so anything that doesnt serve that purpose is a waste of time to me. Therefore, building more Lear or Citation time has little value to me. It would only lead to more Lears and Citations.

Events as of late with the airlines has dulled that quite a bit but not enough for me to consider corporate as an alternative. I like flying the same route in the same plane and staying in the same hotel room at the end of the day. It might not be home but the familiarity is comforting and much easier than having to fly into strange places all the time.

Skyline

I'd call that a "dead end job".

 

[Skyline]

Dk

DK,

Go back and re-read the posts. We have already determined that to you all the term "corporate" means good paying fortune 500 jobs. It doesnt mean that to me so when I say that most "corporate" jobs are bad I take every parts hauling Cessna 206 and broken down Queen Air into consideration.

As for my motivation I can assure you that myself and my friends have been very motivated. Most people would consider my career as a successful and effective one however, luck plays a roll as well and I have had my share of bad luck.

Over time things change. After almost two decades of low low wages, lay offs and setbacks my attitude is not like it was when I was 20. At this point you are correct in assuming that it is mostly me that is holding my career back. Every time I evaluate a new employment prospect my stomach begins to turn with bad memories of past similar employers. In addition my growing family wouldn't do well with another move to a strange city. For their sake we are living back at home surrounded by old friends and family.


Skyline

 

[Skyline]

Unemployed

"airline aspirations"..."corporate dead end"

Again, who is the one unemployed?

I know of quite a few unemployed airline pilots, I know ZERO unemployed corporate pilots...and this had been since 2001...thats 5 years almost. Keep telling yourself thats a "cycle"

When are you going to realize the old days are gone? heck, it sounds like you never even made those big airline bucks! You are crying about the good old times you never even experienced! You are a wanna-be, you have crap experience, and the coffin sealer....a loser attitude.

People transition from corp to airline and back again all the time. Its all about personality and contacts. I know folks who left 6 figure DAL jobs and walked into 6 figure corp jobs very easily....

now tell me, why are YOU unemployed???

I know, its the market, 9/11, George Bush, the LCC's, ......

its something huh?

wonder what that could be?

You are right about most of those statements. I am a looser. Despite my best efforts I never made it to a good company. Most of my peers never made it either. At this point in my life I have a wife and (soon to be) 4 small kids to think about. I suppose I could be out there banging on doors and taking another "crap" job but my family is happy and settled in a good home in a good small town. More than just preferences I need a good airline job to meet the requirements of a family life. 150K per year has no value to me if it means that I would have to leave for a two week stay at PHX at the drop of a hat. Most of my best contacts are either dead, unemployed like me or are not in a position to help right now.

There is one thing you are mistaken about. I am employed. For the last two years I have been building houses and doing well at it. I am constantly stunned by meeting guys daily who pull wire or drive a dump truck and earn fantastically more than my regional airline captain friends. The guy who installs carpets for me is taking in more than 120K/year and fully expects to be retired in ten years.

The world is turned upside down.

Don't get me wrong I envy you guys. I miss flying and am sad that my career is over. Every day I wish I was at a good company, but I am not. And there is little hope at this point that I ever will get there.

Besides all the aforementioned situations that have combined to sink my career. The biggest thing that kills an aviation career is success in another field. So far things are going well with my construction company. If they keep headed uphill then there is no way I could ever go back to flying unless it is in my own Citation Mustang !!

Wish me luck

Skyline

 

[semperfido]

DK,

when I say that most "corporate" jobs are bad I take every parts hauling Cessna 206 and broken down Queen Air into consideration.

No, these jobs would not be classified as corporate. they would more than likely fall under the broad classification of business aviation or on-demand charter. you obviously have been associated with the less than desirable operations.

 

[Gulfstream 200]

You are right about most of those statements. I am a looser. Despite my best efforts I never made it to a good company. Most of my peers never made it either. At this point in my life I have a wife and (soon to be) 4 small kids to think about. I suppose I could be out there banging on doors and taking another "crap" job but my family is happy and settled in a good home in a good small town. More than just preferences I need a good airline job to meet the requirements of a family life. 150K per year has no value to me if it means that I would have to leave for a two week stay at PHX at the drop of a hat. Most of my best contacts are either dead, unemployed like me or are not in a position to help right now.

There is one thing you are mistaken about. I am employed. For the last two years I have been building houses and doing well at it. I am constantly stunned by meeting guys daily who pull wire or drive a dump truck and earn fantastically more than my regional airline captain friends. The guy who installs carpets for me is taking in more than 120K/year and fully expects to be retired in ten years.

The world is turned upside down.

Don't get me wrong I envy you guys. I miss flying and am sad that my career is over. Every day I wish I was at a good company, but I am not. And there is little hope at this point that I ever will get there.

Besides all the aforementioned situations that have combined to sink my career. The biggest thing that kills an aviation career is success in another field. So far things are going well with my construction company. If they keep headed uphill then there is no way I could ever go back to flying unless it is in my own Citation Mustang !!

Wish me luck

Skyline

You're Bi-Polar.

You come here looking for a fight about airline-vs-corporate -- trashing the corp arena you know nothing about as you were obviously a garbage charter pilot....

Now you lay out a big sob story? -- boo-hoo....

For your sake, I hope this is real bad flame bait.

FWIW -- there is far less friction between airline and corp guys than you want to believe, most people are simply judged on thier own personality.

freakin' nutbag.

 

[bigD]

Guys, don't feed the trolls. Read a bunch of what Skyline says on other threads, and you'll see that he's FOS everywhere. He just does it to get a rise out of people. I will say this though, as far as trolls go around here, he's pretty good at it.

 

[banned username 2]

There is one thing you are mistaken about. I am employed. For the last two years I have been building houses and doing well at it. I am constantly stunned by meeting guys daily who pull wire or drive a dump truck and earn fantastically more than my regional airline captain friends. The guy who installs carpets for me is taking in more than 120K/year and fully expects to be retired in ten years.

The world is turned upside down.

Don't get me wrong I envy you guys. I miss flying and am sad that my career is over. Every day I wish I was at a good company, but I am not. And there is little hope at this point that I ever will get there.

Besides all the aforementioned situations that have combined to sink my career. The biggest thing that kills an aviation career is success in another field. So far things are going well with my construction company.

If the world is so rosey for you outside of aviation, what the heck are you doing here? Why don't you go spend some of your big bucks and play with your kids? Why are you posting in the middle of the day? Shouldn't you be out building a house, like most house builders do, during daylight hours???

 

[Flechas]

Guys, don't feed the trolls. Read a bunch of what Skyline says on other threads, and you'll see that he's FOS everywhere. He just does it to get a rise out of people. I will say this though, as far as trolls go around here, he's pretty good at it.

I don't think he's flaim bait though, I think he's just a glass halfempty kinda guy. He needs to get out of aviation.

 

[bigD]

I dunno Flechas, go re-read his Scary Numbers thread. If he isn't a troll, he easily has the poorest attitude of anyone I've ever met in aviation, and frankly, am happy that he's on the airline side - I won't ever have to share a cockpit with him.

But I still think he's a troll.

 

[Flechas]

I dunno Flechas, go re-read his Scary Numbers thread. If he isn't a troll, he easily has the poorest attitude of anyone I've ever met in aviation, and frankly, am happy that he's on the airline side - I won't ever have to share a cockpit with him.

But I still think he's a troll.

He IS a troll, no doubt about that!! I didn't know he was in the airlines,I thought he diidn't make it.