Comair exit poll

[skyslug]

It is the COMAIR guys who are screwing the rest of the industry on this one and certainly not your fellow pilots at ASA. We were behind you 110% until YOUR MEC decided to go behind everyone back and negotiate a deal with MGMT!

One more thing jet! Have you ever held a real world job out side of flying or did you go through one of those programs that daddy paid for?

Your ignorance is amazing!!!!!

???????????????/

Pretty harsh words there Patriotflier. First off your Wal-Mart reference a few posts back was interesting. Briefly, Wal-Mart employees CAN'T take concessions when they're already the worst paid and have the worst benefits in the known universe (ALPA article in this month's ALPA magazine). Wal-Mart grew because it compensates it's employees so horribly (sort of like Mesa making money off it's employees backs).

Costco on the other hand compensates their employees much better and as such each employee produces more sales then their Wal-Mart counterpart (there was an article in Newsweek about 6 months ago that supports this). Costco treats their employees well, compenstes them, offers benefits that Wal-Mart can't touch. Costco employees also on average are employeed longer (thus higher paid?) than W-M's. Costco continues to make tons of money!!! Sort of the LUV philosophy for warehouse chains!

There's a lesson in there somewhere!

However.....as for the "going behind everyones back and negotiating a deal with management"...how dare we negotiate! How in the world did we go behind your backs???????? And to have the audacity (hope I spelled this baby right!) to actually negotiate with management???? Wow...who'd a thunk!

Keep in mind there is more to this picture than meets the eyes (there always is whether you vote NO or YES). We are NOT screwing you over, we're voting on doing what's in Comair's best interest. As I look at the LOA it states the agreement is between Comair ALPA (no other airline or bargaining agent mentioned) and our management.

Your negotiating effort won't collapse. In fact I suspect it will become more heated and focused!!! Although judging by some of the posts on this board, it may not seem like it right now, we DO support ASA and their efforts!!!! We want you guys to hit a home run and get a great (industry leading, bar raising or whatever cliche you want to use) contract!!!!! I have no doubt you will. We'll do whatever we can to support you AND do what's best for Comair.

 

[PCL_128]

Surplus 1 is Judas, not John the Baptist

Fins, you're starting to scare me. I've never agreed with you so much before.

Seriously though surplus, don't you think you're Biblical analogy is a little bit over the top? John the Baptist? Give me a break. The ego that has developed within the Comair pilot group is unbelievable. How many of you that pat yourself on the back for the 89 days were even there in '01? It cracks me up to see these junior Comair guys bragging about "holding up the bar" when they were still flight instructing back in '01. Stop patting yourself on the back and trying to justify this disgrace.

ASA and Pinnacle are currently in contract negotiations trying to make gains for the profession. This all but destroys our efforts. How can our MECs go to the NMB and ask to be released when the CMR pilots just admitted that they are overpayed? All of this damage to the professions just so you can buy Fred some new airplanes? You guys are just pathetic.

 

[chperplt]

The ego that has developed within the Comair pilot group is unbelievable.

10 or 20 people out of the 1800 we have speak up and the entire group has an ego problem?

Give me a break buddy...

 

[JI Gone OH]

You ought to make a bag sticker out of that. It sums up who you are and what you bring to the fight.

I'd have more respect for you if you just voted yes and closed your pie hole.

Coward.

After the pay freeze, I might just have to make that sticker; thanx for the idea. As far as respect, your respect for me doesn't improve the long term viability for my company and doesn't pay my bills. Your respect is like an S.T.D., I can live without it.

My bet is that you want me to "close my pie hole" because you don't agree with my position on this. My response to you mirrors what will be on that shiny new sticker: Selfish, yes, but tough sh*t.

And me, a coward, I don't think so Tim. Nice Day....

 

[jetflyer]

It's amazing to me how the ASA pilots don't support our decisions.

It seems like you guys are being selfish. You could care less that Comair WILL NOT get these airplanes. The whipsaw game WOULD END immediately if we received the airplanes after saying "NO". They will keep their whipsaw going till Chapter 7 if they must.

We with HIGHER PILOT COSTS said "NO" last time.
Bla, bla, bla you did too. <---If you say this again I'm going to throw up!

Since Comair pilots and ASA pilots both said "NO", they gave them to ASA. They wanted some of them to go to a WO. THEY LOST LESS FACE by giving them to you after YOU said "NO", than they would have by giving them to us.

You guys amaze me thinking that if Comair would have ACCEPTED THE RFP and taken a MAJOR HIT in their pay, that Comair would not have received EVEN ONE OF THE RFP airplanes.

That shows your lack of intelligence.

They WOULD have given us every plane they promised us the first time, to save their integrity for bargaining in the future AND so they could take a MAJOR hit in our UNION fought PAY.

I AM RIGHT AND YOU ARE WRONG ON THIS ISSUE. NOW STOP BEING MORONS AND ARGUING WITH ME ON THIS.

You guys spat off about "YOU'LL GET THE PLANES ANWAYS" because you want us to say "NO".

Comair then WILL NOT GET PLANES and YOU WILL GET THEM. YOU being CHQ, SKW, and ASA.

That is one reason you want us to vote no. You are being selfish.

The second reason is that you want your "COMAIR-1%" Contract to be HIGHER. Again you are being selfish.



ONCE AGAIN, and THIS SHOULDN'T BE ARGUED, WE WILL NOT receive these airplanes.

DELTA, not Freddie MAC, would lose all its respect for bargaining negotiations in the future. THIS would encourage others to fight them in the future, because you'll still be rewarded.

You guys don't see that we are faced with an aging fleet. This LOA protects US from going below 199 planes. It says that when the AGING AIRCRAFT LEAVE they have to replace them to keep the number at 199! This is very valuable to our pilot group and airline.

By Comair saying "NO", Comair would eventually shrink, when our aging planes leave Comair. That is why many are voting yes.

If your company is not growing, it's shrinking. Many of us are worried next time they'll ask us for a pay freeze, so that 35 of our CURRENT airplanes DON'T LEAVE to go to ASA, CHQ, SKW. We're worried they may start dismantling us. This is our worry, NOT YOURS.

Should we vote "NO", so you can get our airplanes and our pay??

OR should ve vote "YES" so we can save OUR JOBS??

I think the answer for many Comair pilots is clear.

Please RESPECT our decision. Let's stop the bickering. ASA pilots are allowing the wedge to be driven between us on this one.

You used to support us. YOU should support us now more than ever during this hard decision for us.

Stop thinking of yourselves for one minute, and look at this whole situation from our perspectives.

That is all I ask,

Jet

 

[~~~^~~~]

Jet:

The low pressure over CVG must be caused due to the Comair pilots massive ingestion of cool aid. In one week I saw Comair pilots go from "we are the most profitable regional airline" to "OH MY GOD IF WEE DON'T CUT OUR PAY WE WILL GO CHAPTER 7, WE WILL LOSE OUR JOBS, OUR MOTHERS WILL NOT LOVE US, WAAAAAAHHHHH, RUN"

Freddie Smooth Talk can do that in a week?

This is Delta Connection fighting over the scraps of the Delta MEC's left over barganing. Your "yes" vote endorses ALPA's scope strategy. Your "yes" vote legitimizes the alpa apartied system. Your "yes" vote tells management that concessions for growth is the strategy for the future. Maybe what this business needs are more military pilots and less Embry Riddle and Delta Concession Academy Grads fighting over who gets to fly the Seminole with the Garmin radios.

No - we don't respect you - we recognize you for what you are. We recognize whipsaw and know that management will be back to ask you for more after they finish with us. We know that airplane purchasing decisions are not made over $5.00 in hourly crew costs.

He11, it costs more to staff the redundant management teams and pay for unecessary hotel rooms, crew costs and scheduling inefficiencies to operate overlapping alter ego air carriers than your measly pay cut gives Delta back. This is a moral victory for management and a morale loss for ALPA members who stood beside you to improve this profession.

Hey - you take care of #1. Who needs unity, right?

~~~^~~~

 

[jetflyer]

You guys don't see that we are faced with an aging fleet. This LOA protects US from going below 199 planes.

It says that when the AGING AIRCRAFT LEAVE, they have to replace them to keep the number at 199! This is very valuable to our pilot group and airline.

We would all be able to keep our jobs, as the fleet was replaced because of this provision.

35 planes, heck this LOA means 4 X that number more, when you count the replacement aircraft too. This would keep US ALL EMPLOYED.

I think you guys would rather us say "NO" and be out on the streets furloughed than us doing what is right for us. AMAZING and very selfish of you.


Jet

 

[homerjdispatch]

Thank you for the good wishes. A word of caution -- if everytime you come into the room you smell sh!t, the first place you need to look is your own shoes, not Comair's shoes.

The funny thing is, I walk around all day and dont smell a thing. Then I see "surplus1" and guess what? It starts smelling again. I didn't say Comair smells, just your "COMAIR PILOTS ARE ON A HIGHER PEDASTAL" attitude.

 

[jetflyer]

Jetflyer,
One more thing jet! Have you ever held a real world job out side of flying or did you go through one of those programs that daddy paid for?

Your ignorance is amazing!!!!!

Patriot,
I thought I'd let this go but I can't. I come from a poor household. I owe much debt from college and my flight training. I graduated SUMMA cum laude from that university.

I flew 135 freight for close to two years in large twin engine aircraft. I paid my dues and was thanking God every day when Comair hired me when I had close to 3000 hours. I thought I was going to be flying cruddy 135 for the rest of my life.

To answer your question, daddy didn't pay for squat, and I am not ignorant.

Sorry for this post, I just get sick of the personal attacks that occur on here, when you stand up for what you believe in.

Jet

 

[~~~^~~~]

I think you guys would rather us say "NO" and be out on the streets furloughed than us doing what is right for us. AMAZING and very selfish of you.

Jet

Jet:

Here is a time line for you, you putz:

Three weeks ago - UNITY , Comair pilots are confident their Company is doing well.

Two weeks ago - Freddy Smooth Talk comes in tells you the sky is falling and waives a pitcture of an E170 under your nose.

Currently - You can't vote quick enough to try to "get me, mine"

March Second - The ASA pilots loathe and hate you, the race to the bottom has a competitor that makes Dale Earnheart look like the Pope.

The ASA pilots have not changed, the ASA pilots did not break the unity, ASA pilots ( like me ) have done nothing but send your pilots and your causes personal checks to financially support our mutually beneficial quest and now, ASA pilots like me see you as self serving scum. The ASA pilots saw you as brothers, supported one list when you were not growing and you were senior to us - not any more. Your vote makes you a threat to destroy with our harmful votes. Lack of unity is pleasant 'eh?

~~~^~~~

 

[737 Pylt]

Thank you Comair for the mortal precedent. Dangle a shiny new jet in front of pilots = automatic givebacks. I suppose we ASA folks have nothing to aspire to, since you gave it all away. All that hold the line b.s. for nothing. This industry sucks.

I agree completely. We have seen our true enemy, and it is ourselves!
737

 

[surplus1]

Has there ever been ANYONE on here backpedaling as fast as Surplus1 the past few days?

--a formerly concerned regional pilot

I'm slow so forgive me. What do you think I'm backpedaling about? I really don't have a clue so tell me.

 

[~~~^~~~]

I graduated SUMMA cum laude from that university.

We can tell.

 

[jetflyer]

Last time I checked, we're Comair pilots, NOT ASA PILOTS.

I'm glad I'm doing what is right for ALL of OUR EMPLOYEES, even the janitors. I'm glad they and the pilots will be able to keep our jobs from this and have JOB SECURITY FOR THE FUTURE.

We are not selling you out, and sorry you see it that way.

The PROVISION keeping the fleet from shrinking below 199 is too great, and will keep our company from shrinking as aircraft are replaced.

Sorry guys. You need to try to understand and PLEASE respect this as OUR DECISION not yours,

Jet

 

[~~~^~~~]

I'm slow so forgive me. What do you think I'm backpedaling about? I really don't have a clue so tell me.

Your are not slow - we know that You are in what Dr. Laura would call, "an ethical dilemma" and we are astounded to see the Emperor in a thong and shower shoes.

Perhaps he means your complete reversal on :

1. concessionary bargaining
2. predatory bargaining
3. endorsement of ALPA's apartied scope policy
4. buying Buttrell's economic allegation when both ALPA and the Company say that there was no economic analysis of this ever performed
5. crashing the unity between the ASA and Comair pilot groups

I'm thinking this is the beginning of the end for the RJDC. At least a third of the support base is not feeling the same old warm and fuzzy for the integrity of Comair pilots.