Airtran MEC Update

[Ualexpress]

What we've got is a handful of loudmouths on both sides (along with an uninvited third party stirring excrement for amusement), saying the exact same things their counterparts on the other side would be saying if their respective roles were reversed. The radical fringe on the SWA side has a couple of heros and flag bearers who were former Morris guys who actually sued us over that deal so I guess there is always hope for time healing wounds.

Nevertheless, the majority on both sides are reasonable and fair minded people who just want to enjoy a secure career and retire comfortably.

The culture of our industry is more important than any particular airline. There is nothing wrong with fair and equitable even with an inherently broad definition. For the record I don't think either relative or staple are fair and equitable, but I am just one vote that may or may not get to be cast.

There is a lot to be said for treating others as you would expect them to treat you, otherwise, Grandma wouldn't have preached it so often.

I actually hope this thing goes to arbitration because then there will be a third party to despise and blame. In the meantime, there is no reason to expend all this cyberbation getting worked up over hypothetical stuff that is simply out of our control. The future is big enough and bright enough for all of us to enjoy.

Good Post Widow!! Spot on.

 

[bladeusa]

Plus 1

 

[canyonblue]

This "Message Board" has really turned into more of an entertainment site the last 8 years. But even with the "entertainment" aspect, I still can't understand why these Delta pilots always end up on Southwest threads. I posted awhile back on the "stalking" activity of certain Delta pilots, but for God's sake man, this is really creepy.

Listen, guys, there must be something else you can get involved in (like maybe your children or spouses lives) besides a bitchfest between two airlines that may combine. You guys remind me of people that always butt into other peoples conversations, and have no clue how obnoxious their behavior is. I know it's a Free Country, but it's a conversation between a Southwest pilot and an AirTran pilot and unless you fall into one of those groups, get the Hell out of our conversation.

WTF

I was here on this board before the General Lee days, too bad most of you missed it. It was actually a great place to get information back then.

 

[On Your Six]

This "Message Board" has really turned into more of an entertainment site the last 8 years. But even with the "entertainment" aspect, I still can't understand why these Delta pilots always end up on Southwest threads. I posted awhile back on the "stalking" activity of certain Delta pilots, but for God's sake man, this is really creepy.

Listen, guys, there must be something else you can get involved in (like maybe your children or spouses lives) besides a bitchfest between two airlines that may combine. You guys remind me of people that always butt into other peoples conversations, and have no clue how obnoxious their behavior is. I know it's a Free Country, but it's a conversation between a Southwest pilot and an AirTran pilot and unless you fall into one of those groups, get the Hell out of our conversation
WTF

I was here on this board before the General Lee days, too bad most of you missed it. It was actually a great place to get information back then.

That is called BORING. Gen Lee makes it entertaining. And I love how you tell people to go do other things, yet you yourself are on here now. Hypocrite!



OYS

 

[OurMoney1]

I assure you this, if ALPA continues with its rants and rhetoric, Gary Kelly will turn this into a slice and dice acquisition that leaves a smoking hole in Atlanta. SWA doesn't repsond to this type of communication well. I suspect Gary and friends are closely looking at the language of Guadeloupe Holdings right now and patting themselves on the back. ALPA is once again showing their sophmoric culture. Not a good situation for the pilots of Airtran.

 

[SWA/FO]

I assure you this, if ALPA continues with its rants and rhetoric, Gary Kelly will turn this into a slice and dice acquisition that leaves a smoking hole in Atlanta. SWA doesn't repsond to this type of communication well. I suspect Gary and friends are closely looking at the language of Guadeloupe Holdings right now and patting themselves on the back. ALPA is once again showing their sophmoric culture. Not a good situation for the pilots of Airtran.

Exactly.... What I was thinking.

 

[RLAblows]

Exactly.... What I was thinking.

What rants are you guys referring to?

 

[redflyer65]

I assure you this, if ALPA continues with its rants and rhetoric, Gary Kelly will turn this into a slice and dice acquisition that leaves a smoking hole in Atlanta. SWA doesn't repsond to this type of communication well. I suspect Gary and friends are closely looking at the language of Guadeloupe Holdings right now and patting themselves on the back. ALPA is once again showing their sophmoric culture. Not a good situation for the pilots of Airtran.

We have a winner!

 

[Kharma Police]

We have a winner!

Congratulations to him! Now, what prize does the winner get?

 

[orangebellyav8r]

a seat above you

 

[redflyer65]

Red...where are you getting those outlandish 60-80% pay difference figures and applying them to the whole pilot group?

Let's take a look at a 9yr. Capt. as an example. The hourly rates are public knowledge on airlinepilotcentral.com

AT Capt. = 153/hr.
SW Capt. = 203/hr.

Doing the math, it comes out to a 32.7% difference which is not even in the ballpark of the 60-80% difference that you claim.

A lot more than just pay goes into determining career expectations. As GL has correctly stated, an arbitrator is going to look at the whole package.

Don,

We went over this in a previous thread dated 12/12/2010. You asked about comparing 9yr FO rates at both airlines. Not sure why you picked that but I responded with this....




Wow, not sure where to start with this one but I'll do the math.

First off, you have to use your original payscale that was used as a snapshot in Sept. I really like how you guys want to hold up the new one and say 'it isn't that much different now'.

But I'll do the public math anyway..

9yr AAI FO - 75/hr x 70 = 5250/month (original payscale)
9yr AAI FO - 97/hr x 70 = 6790/month (new payscale)

9yr SW FO - 124 trips for pay, mulitpied by a conservative rate of 1.15 (1.18 is closer to reality), equals 142.

142/hr x 70 = 9940/month that's a 90 percent increase off your original pay, or 46 percent increase off your new payrates. (which won't be used)

So instead of 50-80 percent, I should have use 46-90 percent. My bad.

At SW, that same 9yr FO can easy fly 110-115 trips a month making 13,600 for the month. That is the windfall no matter how you add the numbers.



I'll run any other numbers side by side if you need me to.

RF

 

[uba757]

At SW, that same 9yr FO can easy fly 110-115 trips a month making 13,600 for the month. That is the windfall no matter how you add the numbers.

Man, thats almost 6 legs a day for 20 days out of the month (I assume that 10 days is the average amount of days off for a SW pilot in a month) WOW!

 

[ASADFW7]

SWA is interview window is opening again.

 

[waveflyer]

At SW, that same 9yr FO can easy fly 110-115 trips a month making 13,600 for the month. That is the windfall no matter how you add the numbers.

Man, thats almost 6 legs a day for 20 days out of the month (I assume that 10 days is the average amount of days off for a SW pilot in a month) WOW!

And you would assume stupidly.


No really- you would.

My Feb: 115TFP - 14 days off in a short month- zero premium time. 1 5 leg day - 4 4 leg days- 6 3 leg days- 2 2 leg days and 1 1 leg day-

Never been scheduled in a less fatiguing way in my 20 year career.
And have never been treated better by a company. The lack of stress here is worth years to your life- I leave 9/10 trips smiling and happy
Don't get too riled up here- both sides are well represented- we'll be alright if no one takes the 1%ers here too seriously

 

[Lonestar]

Man, thats almost 6 legs a day for 20 days out of the month (I assume that 10 days is the average amount of days off for a SW pilot in a month) WOW!

Just a little better than 10 days off a month...

-Last calendar year (6-7 yr FO) I flew 205 days.
-That's an average of 17 days OFF a month.
-I also averaged just UNDER 4 legs per day.
-Top it off with an average of 109 TFP per month.

$13 grand a month averaging 17 days off...

*I had the ENTIRE month of August off with two weeks of vacation so that did skew the average days off a bit.*

 

[GuppyWN]

*I had the ENTIRE month of August off with two weeks of vacation so that did skew the average days off a bit.*

POW POW! :laugh:

I took over a month off in one pop last year too.......... with two weeks vacation. This year I'm taking about 7 weeks off in a row with 3 weeks vacation.

Sucks doesn't it?
Gup

 

[canyonblue]

And I love how you tell people to go do other things..................

OYS

That's because I am SENIOR to you here, not be a good little boy and find a thread about Delta hiring or something else exciting. :laugh:

 

[Luv2BFlyin]

I assure you this, if ALPA continues with its rants and rhetoric, Gary Kelly will turn this into a slice and dice acquisition that leaves a smoking hole in Atlanta. SWA doesn't repsond to this type of communication well. I suspect Gary and friends are closely looking at the language of Guadeloupe Holdings right now and patting themselves on the back. ALPA is once again showing their sophmoric culture. Not a good situation for the pilots of Airtran.

Are you kidding me? If the angry 13% would have written a response, THAT would have gotten GK's attention. These "rants and rhetoric" are just part of the game SWAPA has decided to enter into. There will be a lot more over the coming months. Buckle in, it'll be a long bumpy ride and neither side would expect anything less in making the case for their respective sides.

 

[737tanker]

Man, thats almost 6 legs a day for 20 days out of the month (I assume that 10 days is the average amount of days off for a SW pilot in a month) WOW!

You would assume wrong. For March I'm scheduled for 111 TFP with 16 days off. Week 1 is a 4 day with 13 legs; Week 2 is a 3 day with 9 legs; Week 3 is a 4 day with 12 legs; Week 4 is a 2 day with 7 legs; and Week 5 is a 2 day with 6 legs.

 

[Widow's Son]

Gup,

Our industry has a long history of professionalism, respect, and comraderie.
Yes things are good for us right now, (aside from your incessant whining and complaining on internal forums), but we remain one bad spindle of being on the other side of acquisition. There is a fine line between being in a position of strength and being a dick.

I agree with the current pprune swell that your body of work on this forum of late is an embarrassment.