ABX Furloughs

[727Niteflyer]

Are you suggesting that nobody should get the severance?

It would be nice if everyone could keep their job. What Im saying is what makes everyone think they are entitled to a severence ? A lot of companies go out of business. People dont get severence or retenton.

How much does the average abx pilot make ? Id like for one of you guys making 200 k a year go to a ramper and tell them your entitled to a severence.

that would be funny

 

[DC-9er]

It would be nice if everyone could keep their job. What Im saying is what makes everyone think they are entitled to a severence ? A lot of companies go out of business. People dont get severence or retenton.

How much does the average abx pilot make ? Id like for one of you guys making 200 k a year go to a ramper and tell them your entitled to a severence.

that would be funny

Listen pal, you really have no idea what you're talking about. But just to confuse you more, the rampers ARE getting a severance

 

[laserman2431]

It would be nice if everyone could keep their job. What Im saying is what makes everyone think they are entitled to a severence ? A lot of companies go out of business. People dont get severence or retenton.

How much does the average abx pilot make ? Id like for one of you guys making 200 k a year go to a ramper and tell them your entitled to a severence.

that would be funny

But I'll tell you what I AM entitled to. When the union local assumes the responsibility of negotiating on my behalf, I AM entitled to fair representation!

 

[727Niteflyer]

Listen pal, you really have no idea what you're talking about. But just to confuse you more, the rampers ARE getting a severance

They should. But whether anyone is entitled to it is another story.

Didnt ryan have an issue when they were doing postal years ago before the fedex deal. If I remember right postal paid a large amount for pilot pay. Ryan just paid the normal salaries and nothing more. I think the pilots sued or tried to sue and lost.

The point is your only entitled to what is in the contract. Management knows they will be able to operate the airline because pilots love thier jobs. You very rarely see a shutdown in aviation at the hands of pilots unlike other industries (UAW).

Im not trying to pour salt in the wound but look at the situation. Everyone knew this day was coming. The day it was announced everyone should have shut it down and negotiated a severence package while the airplanes were parked. Thats how you get things, dont move the freight.

 

[laserman2431]

It's called Severance and Retention

DPWN Holdings (USA), Inc. ("DHL") and ABX Air, Inc. ("ABX"), which is a wholly owned subsidiary of Air Transport Services Group, Inc.
("ATSG"), entered into a Severance and Retention Agreement (the "Agreement")
pursuant to which DHL will reimburse ABX for certain costs incurred in providing severance, retention and other benefits to ABX's employees whose employment is terminated in connection with DHL's implementation of its U.S. restructuring plan.

http://biz.yahoo.com/e/080820/atsg8-k.html

I think that statement referred to employees who were not in bargaining units.

 

[laserman2431]

With pilots getting ready to hit the street there may be pressure to do something quick. It's better to take the time to do things right than to rush into a decision that cannot be reversed.

 

[mxer]

727, Your a little out in left field. There are a lot of differences between us and Ryan. DHL had agreements that they backed out of. That is why severences are being offered to pilots, rampers, and possibly the county. (airport donation, if it happens) The severence that you say we are not entitled to, has already been earmarked by DHL for the pilot group. The discussion then is not if we deserve it or not. The discussion is on the perameters that it will be disbursed. Not trying to slam you. From the outside looking in, the view is probably a bit different.

 

[FastHap]

I think that statement referred to employees who were not in bargaining units.

From the Form 10Q filled 14 NOV 08

"...ABX has begun to discuss and negotiate termination and wind-down costs with DHL, including employee severance and retention arrangements. In August 2008, ABX and DHL executed a severance and retention agreement. The agreement specifies employee severance and retention benefits that DHL will pay to ABX in conjunction with its U.S. restructuring plan. DHL will reimburse ABX for the cost of non-union employee severance and retention benefits paid in accordance with the agreement. The same agreement includes provisions to pay ABX for crewmember benefits if ABX and the collective bargaining unit for the crewmembers can reach an agreement in regards to the use of those funds for severance, retention or other issues arising from DHL’s U.S. restructuring plan."

http://yahoo.brand.edgar-online.com...122-117515&type=sect&dcn=0001193125-08-235609

 

[727Niteflyer]

727, Your a little out in left field. There are a lot of differences between us and Ryan. DHL had agreements that they backed out of. That is why severences are being offered to pilots, rampers, and possibly the county. (airport donation, if it happens) The severence that you say we are not entitled to, has already been earmarked by DHL for the pilot group. The discussion then is not if we deserve it or not. The discussion is on the perameters that it will be disbursed. Not trying to slam you. From the outside looking in, the view is probably a bit different.

All Im trying say is, Just like the ryan deal I dont think ABX is obligated to pay you anymore than whats in the contract. If ABX decided to take the money earmarked for the pilots and disperse it to the rampers or people that make far less than the pilots I think they can do that. I think personally that would be ther right thing to do. You guys made a ton of money you had a good contract.

I think the only people that would have a right to dispute it would be DHL. That would be between DHL and ABX.

The point that I was trying to make between Ryan and ABX was the entitlement to extra funds for the Pilot group. Both companies were provided funds specifically earmarked for the pilot group. Ryan didnt distribute any of it, and they were not obligated to. So the question is, is ABX obligated to ?

 

[mxer]

And what I contend, is YES they are. It is not their money. Currently, that money belongs to DHL. It is up to DHL, not ABX, as to rather that money will be disbursed. I don't claim to know any details of Ryan, but if they did something wrong, then that doesn't make it right for ABX to do the same. ABX is nothing more than the disburser of the funds. By DHL insisting that the pilot group and the the management agree on this disbursement should prevent the management from taking it for their own agenda. In theory. Doesn't seem to be quite working that way.