SWAPA has a transition agreement

[General Lee]

It's very simple, if I was a Southwest FO that wanted a certain week of vacation and it goes to a Trannie instead (who never got hired on, or maybe even got turned down after busting a SWA interview) then I would be royally screwed by this "merger" (not really a merger, but you get the idea).

Every single AirTran pilot gets a huge windfall no matter what the integration is like, which is why most people think a staple is very fair. Trannies start at the bottom just like every other Southwest pilot did.

Bobby,

Every recent arbitration award disagrees with you. Now, I know you don't fly for either airline (just like me), and you are entitled to your opinion. Maybe you should sign up to be an arbitrator. I know one side that would do anything to give you a shot at it.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[SELCAL checks]

there was a common goal to get a JOINT contract first before the SLI.

Was that a contractual requirement, or a function of ALPA merger policy?

 

[jonjuan]

Gary Kelly has already told shareholders, the SEC and you that buying AirTran will make SWA money by integrating the operations. He has warned them that without integration SWA could lose money.

The cost of paying AirTran employees SWA wages is calculated as a part of that integration. It's in the SEC filings.

Are you saying that Gary Kelly is lying or wrong ?

He's just saying that he and redflyer are smarter than Gary. Bottom line is they simply want to accelerate their upgrade timeline by standing on the shoulders of the airtran peeps. Bob Dylan also seems to think that there will be less vacation time to go around with the addition of more pilots.

 

[redflyer65]

What's funny is that you use the term "windfall" when in fact it's a pay raise. You are purposely trying to act dumb by insinuating that the "windfall" airtran pilots receive is at the expense of southwest pilots. You don't lose a thing. You are just pissed they will make what you make even though it won't affect you one bit.

Ok Jonjuan,

What does the Southwest pilot group get out of the merged list?

Payraise like Airtran? No.

So enlighten me on the 'fair and equitable' portion from the SW side while the AAI guys are stepping up the backs of the SW pilots contract (that they worked for YEARS to obtain). Tell me.

 

[jonjuan]

Ok Jonjuan,

What does the Southwest pilot group get out of the merged list?

Payraise like Airtran? No.

So enlighten me on the 'fair and equitable' portion from the SW side while the AAI guys are stepping up the backs of the SW pilots contract (that they worked for YEARS to obtain). Tell me.

You already got your pay raise. Now it's ATALPAs turn.
You get more growth that was grinding to a halt (at least GK thinks this). Upgrades should continue, albeit at a much slower pace versus grinding to a halt. You got what GK said you would get- a more stable company with a little more growth. The alternative? You go backwards in terms of competition and much longer upgrades.


Finally:

You are trying to manage their expectations, and really, you can't.

 

[redflyer65]

Gary will run the company as he see's fit. Neither of us have any input on those kind of decisions. For ALPA or SWAPA to attempt to dictate anything different is ludicrous.

The future is completely unknown. Gary could buy Airtran and STILL say no growth until 2015. You can't predict 1000 factors that effect this industry. He could just as easily cancel ALL orders, including yours. There is no gurantee to any quick upgrade or growth.

 

[jonjuan]

Let me ask you this. What does the #1 sw pilot want? What does he/she thinks he/she deserves in the merger?

 

[redflyer65]

He could careless for two reasons,

1-He will be long gone before there is ever a SLI.
2-He was hired way before all the AAI guys anyway.

Better question is what does the #1 FO at AAI expect to gain from the Southwest contract?

 

[GuppyWN]

A cowboy, a priest and a hooker walked into a bar.................

 

[flynvixen]

The Alpa job killing machine just took another major beat down, one in a long list of future beat downs to come with this deal. They will not rest until they burn the SWAPA house down.

If the tables were turned The ALPA job killing machine would be trying to do the very same thing to SWAPA. ALPA is used to running the show and being in charge of every meeting and negotiation. It burns them up they are not calling the shots on this deal, they are going to throw fits,scream bloody murder and drag their feet forever until we all end up with a US Air deal

There is no talking to the citrus guys that want all the good deals they are getting plus our left seats

Fence them off forever then choke them off like we did to the fools at Muse.

I bet the citrus guys that turned down the new hire offer a couple months ago are kicking themselves.

I'm just saying

 

[airlinepilot]

Only Check Airman can give PC's at SWA.....don't expect that to change. Was in Dallas for training and Bob Torti said "SWAPA will never buy that" (non-SWA check airman giving PC's)

Aircrew Program Designee - they are company employees in the training department who can give Type Ratings as well as PC's / PT's.

http://fsims.faa.gov/PICDetail.aspx?docId=3379CB6C41F3E7C3862573D0006CB2FE


As for "Single Operating Carrier", in FAA speak, that means "on the day we can surrender the AirTran Operating Certificate and operations with all fleets and employees continues on a daily basis as-normal."

The only way they can do that is to have every, single facet of the operation on the Southwest Ops Cert.

Thanks for the details, Scoreboard. More to come, I'm sure.

 

[roughneck]

Originally Posted by Lear70
Aircrew Program Designee - they are company employees in the training department who can give Type Ratings as well as PC's / PT's.

http://fsims.faa.gov/PICDetail.aspx?...2573D0006CB2FE


As for "Single Operating Carrier", in FAA speak, that means "on the day we can surrender the AirTran Operating Certificate and operations with all fleets and employees continues on a daily basis as-normal."

The only way they can do that is to have every, single facet of the operation on the Southwest Ops Cert.

Thanks for the details, Scoreboard. More to come, I'm sure.

This was taken care of in our Transition Agreement. AirTran check pilots or instructors will not be checking or training Southwest pilots.

 

[jonjuan]

...........................

 

[Bob Dylan]

Let me ask you this. What does the #1 sw pilot want? What does he/she thinks he/she deserves in the merger?

I'll guarantee you he wants a straight staple because it's the fairest thing in the world. Everybody starts at the bottom of the SWA list just like they always have.

Add to it that the majority of Trannies would vote for a staple anyway if it were put to a vote.

 

[Bill Nelson]

This conversation is futile. Fast forward about 3 years and this is what you get.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gdn-e5SsdKc