SWAPA has a transition agreement

[PropPiedmont]

It is not that big of pay raise. SWA is telling their people AT FOs will make 50K more a year=complete lie !! Its like 300-450.00 more a trip. The numbers are out there. Figure it out for yourself.

Just did the math. You're right, for a 5th year FO, it's actually more than $50,000.

 

[Empennage]

Don't think you've been watching how we operate, not to mention you're obviously not used to the delays we get in ATL (although PHL should be similar when they get really jacked up).

For example, this morning in MCO we cranked one engine, taxied from the gate, were told to follow one of your 737's, turned the corner behind you on Echo, started cranking the other one, had it all done by the time we turned the corner at the end for 35L, you guys were rolling, we were told to line up and wait, took off 90 seconds later. Probably saved 50 pounds of fuel.

Multiply that times 6 legs per day per aircraft average, 300 pounds per aircraft times 150 airplanes (rough numbers for easy math) is 45,000 pounds per day, or 6,750 gallons at an average price of $2.35 per gal is $15,862.50 times 30 days per month is $475,875 savings per month. The actual number from the company is considerably higher as some times you can save 200-300 pounds in ATL and PHL and even more with ground holds.

We don't take delays because of our single engine taxi and save approximately $500k+ a month in fuel, or about $6 Million a year. Multiply that times your fleet size and that fuel savings jumps close to $30 Million a year.

Scuttlebutt is that our single engine taxi procedure is the first change you guys might make to save some $$$. Enjoy!

Wow you guys digress on moot points.

 

[Slug]

I can't wait to taxi around on one (on a regular basis).


Any way you AT guys can convince our mgt. that barney blue sux as a color and that we should go back to corndog brown......or better yet, the gold-flake that is on Herb's plane, N711HK.

 

[ALSF 2]

Don't think you've been watching how we operate, not to mention you're obviously not used to the delays we get in ATL (although PHL should be similar when they get really jacked up).

For example, this morning in MCO we cranked one engine, taxied from the gate, were told to follow one of your 737's, turned the corner behind you on Echo, started cranking the other one, had it all done by the time we turned the corner at the end for 35L, you guys were rolling, we were told to line up and wait, took off 90 seconds later. Probably saved 50 pounds of fuel.

Multiply that times 6 legs per day per aircraft average, 300 pounds per aircraft times 150 airplanes (rough numbers for easy math) is 45,000 pounds per day, or 6,750 gallons at an average price of $2.35 per gal is $15,862.50 times 30 days per month is $475,875 savings per month. The actual number from the company is considerably higher as some times you can save 200-300 pounds in ATL and PHL and even more with ground holds.

We don't take delays because of our single engine taxi and save approximately $500k+ a month in fuel, or about $6 Million a year. Multiply that times your fleet size and that fuel savings jumps close to $30 Million a year.

Scuttlebutt is that our single engine taxi procedure is the first change you guys might make to save some $$$. Enjoy!

You make it sound like the pilots of SWA don't want to single engine taxi. WE DO! Everyone since the beginning of time has ran the numbers and can see the cost savings if we did it. But until you convince the head honchos in FLT OPS to make the change, it doesn't happen. I sure hope some of your procedures make it into our book (as long as stuff comes out of our book) but I'm not holding my breath.

Cheers!

 

[Tripower455]

I can't wait to taxi around on one (on a regular basis).


Any way you AT guys can convince our mgt. that barney blue sux as a color and that we should go back to corndog brown......or better yet, the gold-flake that is on Herb's plane, N711HK.

Totally agreed! The goldtops are the best looking paintjobs we've ever had. Not that there was much competition!

 

[maxthrottle]

Just an observation, but I don't think SWA needs to buy AT to do SE taxi. SWA res system seems to be working OK, last time I flew on them. Who needs paperless cockpit? Just seems like benefits you list provide negligible, if any savings to SWA or they're things SWA can implement on it's own, if it deems them cost worthy. Sounds like it's cheaper for SWA to allow AT to operate as it's own airline with it's current wage rates and work rules. In fact without bag fees, which SWA doesn't have, AT actually loses money. So if SWA adopts it's no bag fee to AT, increases wage rates to current SWA level across the board, AT would be a huge money losing operation. And this with AT already doing SE taxi, and going paperless.

 

[Muppets]

btw SWA can single engine taxi... it is just our policy to taxi from the ramp with two engines running. Majority of our taxi times are less than 10 mins. Most of our flights it doesnt make sense to single engine taxi. While your creaping to the runway with one engine running doing 50 checklists, we are in the air getting our customers to their destination... so where is the savings, really?

And your safety record directly reflects that. Cheers.

 

[dicko]

Actually, even that might be overly optimistic given the actual language.

From page 1 of SL8:

Following the Merger Closing, Southwest and AirTran Airways would each continue to operate as separate air carriers unless and until Southwest combines Southwest and AirTran Airways into a single air carrier.

Your company seems to be a little more upbeat than you Especially your VP of Flt Ops.


DALLAS, Feb. 24, 2011 /PRNewswire/ -- Southwest Airlines (NYSE:LUV - News) announced today that it has reached an agreement with its Pilots, represented by the Southwest Airlines Pilots' Association (SWAPA), on an initial Transition Agreement that establishes a procedural framework for eventually integrating the Pilots of Orlando-based AirTran Airways into Southwest. The integration addressed by the agreement would follow the official legal closing of Southwest's acquisition of AirTran's parent company, AirTran Holdings, Inc., which is currently anticipated to occur during the second quarter of 2011. Closing is subject to the approval of AirTran stockholders, receipt of certain regulatory clearances, and fulfillment of customary closing conditions.
With this initial transition agreement, Southwest and SWAPA establish a framework to begin an orderly transition from operating Southwest and AirTran as separate carriers, to a single carrier under one Single Operating Certificate (SOC). This transition agreement is an integral first step in that process.
"This transition agreement, which was unanimously agreed to by our SWAPA Board of Directors, is an important step in the AirTran acquisition and integration process," said Chuck Magill, Southwest Airlines Vice President of Flight Operations. "Our hard-working Pilots are now poised to begin the important and challenging work of integrating their AirTran colleagues into Southwest Airlines."

 

[Muppets]

Also....where do you get 50 checklists from? Single engine taxi has one extra spot for..Pack and iso switches....set. Come on man.

 

[CaptainKiwi]

ok, 50 items on 1 checklist...of course im exaggerating a bit. I really don't mind single engine taxi. Yes, I am aware of ATL and PHL. Actually flew outta ATL for 10 yrs. Watching you guys single engine taxi from our airside in mco (when you usted to park there) to RW17R... the poor fo was rattling off ckecklist items all the way to the runway. All I could think, wow that poor fo! Any taxi time less than 10 mins is a waste on single engine.

If we choose to single engine taxi, we can, just saying that most of operation doesn't require it. The only restriction we have is a two engine taxi off the gate / ramp area for safety. To say we can't single engine taxi is flat out incorrect! I would like a checklist that would allow us to taxi off the gate single engine, but the powers that be do not want us to. I don't care, the company pays me to fly the plane the way the company wants it flown... I just prefer our shorter checklists on a regular basis...

 

[Kenney G]

In fact without bag fees, which SWA doesn't have, AT actually loses money. So if SWA adopts it's no bag fee to AT, increases wage rates to current SWA level across the board, AT would be a huge money losing operation. And this with AT already doing SE taxi, and going paperless.[/QUOTE]


Are you saying 150 planes flying in and out of Atlanta and the rest of AT's citys using SWA's style of flying and schedules and pricing power can't make money? You really don't see the big picture do you? Basically you are saying if AT went away and SWA came into Atlanta that their pilots would have to take a big pay cut and they would still lose money.

 

[maxthrottle]

Are you saying 150 planes flying in and out of Atlanta and the rest of AT's citys using SWA's style of flying and schedules and pricing power can't make money? You really don't see the big picture do you? Basically you are saying if AT went away and SWA came into Atlanta that their pilots would have to take a big pay cut and they would still lose money.[/QUOTE]

Don't believe that's what I stated or implied. I said AT cannot make money without it's bag fee's, no matter how much they SE taxi, paper they save or res system they use. I don't mean that as a slam. Just stating what the numbers show. I said nothing about SWA's ability to make money. SWA would likely have to raise AT's ticket costs to cover the lost revenue from no bag fee's, even paying existing wages. SWA could reduce AT manning and costs by increasing the utilization of the airplanes i.e pilots per plane, making existing pilots fly more. SWA would likely make money by redirecting flights to the longer destinations they can serve with the 737, which would likely be the emphasis of its operations. That and the more business oriented cities on the east coast. Also seems like some of AT's cities would not be profitable for SWA given cost of maintaining station employees with just a few departures a day. Really doesn't seem to fit the SWA business model. So can SWA make money in ATL? Probably. Just have to makes some changes. You know more about all this than I do. But try to look at it more objectively.

 

[SWA/FO]

Could you SWA guys kick the can down the road for years (maybe even a decade) and prevent the AirTran guys from getting your pay rates? Wow...But I remember a bunch of AirTran guys saying it "wasn't about the money." So I guess it's no big deal then.

All I can say is WOW. Let's talk about SE taxi!!!

 

[livintheredream]

DALLAS, Feb. 24, 2011 /PRNewswire/ -- The Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) informed Southwest Airlines that it has accepted the carrier's transition plan to combine the operations of Dallas-based Southwest Airlines and Orlando-based AirTran Airways, following the financial close of its transaction to acquire AirTran. On Sept. 27, 2010, Southwest (NYSE:LUV - News) announced an agreement to acquire all outstanding shares of common stock of AirTran Holdings, Inc. (NYSE:AAI - News), the parent company of AirTran Airways (AirTran), for a combination of cash and Southwest Airlines' common stock. Closing is subject to the approval of AirTran shareholders, receipt of certain regulatory clearances, and fulfillment of customary closing conditions.

"It's been a great team effort by a lot of people to reach this initial milestone, but we still have a lot of work to do to ultimately bring our two carriers together. We appreciate the collaborative approach of all parties, including the FAA Joint Transition Team (JTT)," said Brian Hirshman, Southwest's Vice President Maintenance and Engineering, and Executive Sponsor of the carrier's Single Operating Certificate (SOC) team. "We consider this acceptance by the FAA as the first major milestone on the journey towards SOC. There are too many people to recognize individually, but we are hopeful the team's hard work will allow us to achieve our SOC goal in the first quarter 2012."

Southwest and AirTran currently have separate operating certificates. The transition plan accepted by the FAA outlines the methodology, processes, tools, and timing to be employed to maintain the safety of their day-to-day operations during the transition period and to ultimately achieve a Single Operating Certificate. The SOC is issued by the FAA once all of the steps outlined in the transition plan have been completed. The carriers' processes, and procedures may not be fully integrated when the SOC is issued, however; they will operate under a single FAA certificate at that time.

Relevant to its submitted plan, Southwest clarified that after the transaction close, which is currently anticipated to occur during the second quarter of 2011, all certificated and flight-related AirTran Employees (Pilots, Dispatchers, Flight Attendants, Mechanics, Schedulers, etc.) will maintain their AirTran employment status at least until the SOC is issued by the FAA for the combined carriers. The logistics of how and when this group of certificated employees will then be transitioned to Southwest employment status has yet to be determined.

In its 40th year of service, Southwest Airlines continues to differentiate itself from other low-fare carriers--offering a reliable product with exemplary Customer Service. Southwest Airlines is the nation's largest carrier in terms of originating domestic passengers boarded, now serving 69 cities in 35 states. Beginning March 13, 2011, Southwest will initiate service to Charleston and Greenville/Spartanburg, South Carolina, and on March 27, 2011, service will begin to Newark Liberty International Airport. Southwest also is one of the most honored airlines in the world known for its commitment to the triple bottom line of Performance, People, and Planet. To read more about how Southwest is doing its part to be a good citizen, visit southwest.com/cares to read the Southwest Airlines One Report(TM). Based in Dallas, Southwest currently operates more than 3,200 flights a day and has nearly 35,000 Employees systemwide.

 

[funnyman12]

Ya know guys, believe it or not this is two airlines merging with a total of 43,000 employees being affected. Not integrating the airlines will hurt everyone. Unless you want an airline with less revenue, hiring, and no upgrades then don't ever integrate Airtran. Unfortunately that will hurt all 43,000 employees. Pilots are all such a-holes.

 

[SWA/FO]

Last time I typed something like that I was banned for a month.

 

[Kharma Police]

Ya know guys, believe it or not this is two airlines merging with a total of 43,000 employees being affected. Not integrating the airlines will hurt everyone. Unless you want an airline with less revenue, hiring, and no upgrades then don't ever integrate Airtran. Unfortunately that will hurt all 43,000 employees. Pilots are all such a-holes.

Well that's just great, guy! If we get integrated, then what the heck will I do with all the "Guadalupe Holdings" T-Shirts, stickers, plastic wings, plush toys and other assorted merchandise I ordered! With all your wishing for a fair and equitable integration, did you ever consider us shameless profiteers?!?!

 

[Secret Squirrel]

I have heard you guys talking that SWA and SWAPA are talking about section 1 issues. What is to stop "Guadalupe Holdings" from signing a contract with Skywest to feed "Guadalupe Holdings" to fly the 20 aircraft up to 86 seats that are allowed in our contract (along with unlimited turboprops and limited smaller jets)? Is that addressed in your transition agreement?

 

[redflyer65]

The Section 1 section of the current SW agreement prevents that from happening.

SWAPA will have to give some domestic codeshare relief for Airtran, beyond that I don't see anymore relief. Right now it's ironclad. ZERO domestic codeshare allowed.

 

[Bill Nelson]

I have heard you guys talking that SWA and SWAPA are talking about section 1 issues. What is to stop "Guadalupe Holdings" from signing a contract with Skywest to feed "Guadalupe Holdings" to fly the 20 aircraft up to 86 seats that are allowed in our contract (along with unlimited turboprops and limited smaller jets)? Is that addressed in your transition agreement?

No, not allowed in our CBA.