NWA wants DOH

[PuffDriver]

I know you elite DAL guys like to equate NWA to USAIR. In case you didn't realize it, NWA is in a stronger financial position than DAL. With until this quarters numbers come out.

There it is again, the "elite" Delta pilots. We are not the ones pointing out one small facet, Narita, of a very large airline to be. We are not, although we probably will, pointing out that Africa flying is the new Narita, has been wildly profitable from the very first day, and is about to get even larger. We are not the ones trying to convince ourselves that we have premium widebody flying, when truth be told that very little of your wide body flying brings 2 captains and 2 copilots--meaning jobs--to the mix despite that premium ultra awesome 4 engine man-o-maker. Your figures have been debunked in the transcripts. Try reading them for real.

I also like your mythical fleet expectations of each side, based on zero foundation. DAL had 10 777s with I believe ZERO firm orders (I could be wrong as I haven't looked it up to be sure-I'm sure you'll correct me) when this merger was announced. NWA is updating it's freighter fleet while you are convinced it's going away. There is no more credibility to that than your old 767 fleet and MDs going away, but yet you like to spew it as fact.

"I haven't looked it up to be sure," is pretty much the crux of everything you and your boys have been posting, and your lawyer has been spewing. He has been getting eaten alive in the proceedings, and will continue to be so. The -9s and the -200 are going away. It has been proven, and re-proven in the testimony. Go back and reread with comprehension this time. These things can, do, and will matter to the panel of three.

In short, you are clueless as to how things work in the not-drinking-the-NWA-koolaid-world. Prepare yourself. You have been warned.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

I just hope that their presentation next week falls along the lines of their opening statement......

 

[Schwanker]

There it is again, the "elite" Delta pilots. We are not the ones pointing out one small facet, Narita, of a very large airline to be. We are not, although we probably will, pointing out that Africa flying is the new Narita, has been wildly profitable from the very first day, and is about to get even larger. We are not the ones trying to convince ourselves that we have premium widebody flying, when truth be told that very little of your wide body flying brings 2 captains and 2 copilots--meaning jobs--to the mix despite that premium ultra awesome 4 engine man-o-maker. Your figures have been debunked in the transcripts. Try reading them for real.




"I haven't looked it up to be sure," is pretty much the crux of everything you and your boys have been posting, and your lawyer has been spewing. He has been getting eaten alive in the proceedings, and will continue to be so. The -9s and the -200 are going away. It has been proven, and re-proven in the testimony. Go back and reread with comprehension this time. These things can, do, and will matter to the panel of three.

In short, you are clueless as to how things work in the not-drinking-the-NWA-koolaid-world. Prepare yourself. You have been warned.

So, DAL just took delivery of 2 777's early 2008, totaling 10. When did they order more?

Your wrong on the testimony. The DAL guys looked like idiots who could not defend their positions.

Why did DALPA request lower rates on the A330?

Why does the 767 flying go so junior? It must not be that premium.

Schwanker

 

[ACL65PILOT]

It goes junior for a few reasons. One is the two year seat lock. Two, when things started moving again, it put every and I mean every pilot hired pre 9/11 with in striking distance of a command position. Why go through training twice when you could wait an extra year and go through a short course to get an A position on the 88, the same airplane that most guys are hanging out on.
It is not that the flying sucks, we all hate training and why do it more than you need to.

 

[ACL65PILOT]

DAL also has eight more of these bad boys showing up as soon at the Boeing strike is over.
Add to that two more that we will get in 2010. Now add the what ifs and this fleet is getting quite big. Either way it will be bigger than your 787 fleet for the next five to ten years.

 

[General Lee]

SS-
I know you elite DAL guys like to equate NWA to USAIR. In case you didn't realize it, NWA is in a stronger financial position than DAL. With until this quarters numbers come out.

I also like your mythical fleet expectations of each side, based on zero foundation. DAL had 10 777s with I believe ZERO firm orders (I could be wrong as I haven't looked it up to be sure-I'm sure you'll correct me) when this merger was announced. NWA is updating it's freighter fleet while you are convinced it's going away. There is no more credibility to that than your old 767 fleet and MDs going away, but yet you like to spew it as fact.

Schwanker

HAHHAHAH. You think we are "comparing" NWA to USAir? You sound like a typical McCain sound bite---twisting the truth. We are comparing your STANCE---DOH. And, thinking that you have SOOOOO much more money than we do, is crazy. It is not even close to the AWA buyout of almost liquidated USAir. Nope. Good try though. Also, maybe you have not seen or heard the large amounts of evidence from our side stating the demise of your ANC base, but let me assure you, it will be gone, and you have probably read the same stuff we have. It is losing money, and the 742 is not a good cargo plane. The only reason it will continue into part of 2009 is to keep the NRT slots ready for new 777 and 767 "ultra premium flights" to start. And, we also know that some of your DC9s are going away. Will our MD88s be going away soon? They are first to get the WIFI connections. Sorry to blow your theory away. A PM is awaiting you...

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Noserider76]

Also, maybe you have not seen or heard the large amounts of evidence from our side stating the demise of your ANC base, but let me assure you, it will be gone, and you have probably read the same stuff we have. It is losing money, and the 742 is not a good cargo plane. The only reason it will continue into part of 2009 is to keep the NRT slots ready for new 777 and 767 "ultra premium flights" to start.
Bye Bye--General Lee

I don't think that's something we should be happy about at all. It's something we should find a way to fight as it's all of our jobs in the end. Another short-sighted move by a management that thinks there's no money in cargo. Somehow other companies all over the world make tons of money with it. Update the product and operations, if need be, but don't give up a business you'll never be able to get back into.

 

[General Lee]

I don't think that's something we should be happy about at all. It's something we should find a way to fight as it's all of our jobs in the end. Another short-sighted move by a management that thinks there's no money in cargo. Somehow other companies all over the world make tons of money with it. Update the product and operations, if need be, but don't give up a business you'll never be able to get back into.

How many cargo carriers are flying 747-200s these days? Not many. Cargo airlines like World and Kalitta are switching to 747-400s, and almost all major Asian cargo carriers are doing the same. Air France is starting to replace their Cargo 744s with Cargo 777s. That plane is too old for the job, and costs a lot to maintain. Now, if we were moving the pax 744s to the cargo arena, great, but I don't see that, since we still want the pax version. Can we aquire more to keep the cargo ops? I don't know. But, the simple fact is, the 742s are going away, and that needs to be addressed in the SLI. We have heard of no replacements so far, and if it goes away sooner than later, no DL pilot should be affected, especially if this decision is made prior to the DCC, which it apparently has. It should be brought up.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[PuffDriver]

So, DAL just took delivery of 2 777's early 2008, totaling 10. When did they order more?

Your wrong on the testimony. The DAL guys looked like idiots who could not defend their positions.

Why did DALPA request lower rates on the A330?

Why does the 767 flying go so junior? It must not be that premium.

Schwanker

Sigh. Where to begin? You must have missed the 6 scheduled to arrive before march. You also neglect to mention your airplane which is supposed to be here by now, will not fly until 2010 now, and is likely going to be cancelled by Delta. The cancellation, of course is hearsay.:erm:

"The Delta guys looking like idiots" is akin to saying that Palin won the debate. To the few freaks who can't see their hand in front of their face, she did. To the vast majority, who do not have blinders on, she got her a$$ handed to her.

Why does the ER go so junior? First off, it doesn't. Like NWA we have f/o on the ER who can hold captain on it--not so junior. It seems as if NWA has plenty of very senior f/os on their widebodies as well. I suppose another reason it the fact that the pay disparity between it and the rest of the domestic fleet is less than that of the disparity between NWA widebodies and their domestic fleet--which is much smaller than Delta's. Of course, the -Er does fill much of the same role as the long range 330s in that a fair amount is augmented with double crews--also known as more jobs. Add to that 2, instead of 1, are captain positions. Now throw in the extra 500 positions Delta's contract brings to the table via staffing formula, the 10 soon-to-be-16-soon-to-be-18-probably-ending-up-in-the-range-of-30 777s which are ALL ultra long haul bringing in 2 captains and 2 f/o positions with each with each flight. Now lets take ALL of those 757/767/767-400/777 jobs, put them next to those A330 and 747 jobs and see who has more. More of ANYTHING means it is going to go more junior. If half of YOUR flying was international, I guarantee it would go more junior. But, by all means, don't let facts get in your way. Our 3 777s used to be reserved for the top 500. Now it goes down into the 2000s. Deal with it. It is fact, and it is kicking your a$$ in the courtroom.

Why did Delta request lower rates on the 330? it is in the testimony, verbatim. Go look it up, for apparently you have not read them yet.

Edited to add: Oh yes, our financial positions. This could have been a factor if one of us had been in BK, or is currently in BK. We are not, we are both viable companies with eerily similar balance sheets--another point refuted in the proceedings if you had read them.

 

[PuffDriver]

I don't think that's something we should be happy about at all. It's something we should find a way to fight as it's all of our jobs in the end. Another short-sighted move by a management that thinks there's no money in cargo. Somehow other companies all over the world make tons of money with it. Update the product and operations, if need be, but don't give up a business you'll never be able to get back into.

Thee isn't money in cargo. The planes are flying one way empty, and the other way partially full. There is a glut of cargo operators to the Orient right now. It is losing money for the cargo only operation. Look it up. It is being continued to preserve position.