Rah To Fly For Midwest Express

[PCL_128]

PCL needs to first take care of his own SCAB (or psuedo-scab)filled airline first (AirTran).

You mean all 20 of them? Yeah, we're really "filled" with them.

 

[Freight Dog]

Again, completely different situation. The mainline pilots all voted to allow that outsourcing to the "express" carriers. Stupid decision? Yep, but it was theirs to make. No flying was stolen from them, and no letter or intent of the scope language was violated. It was a willful agreement to outsource the flying. That is not what happened at TSA/GoJet.

No, it's not. It's the same end product.

Mainline pilot had a proverbial gun to their head in bankruptcy when they allowed such explosive growth of express carriers in relaxing scope. Either they "allow it" or the judge makes them do it. Some choice...

Let's hope Airtran never goes through bankruptcy, it's not a fun process. But it'd be a huge eye opener for you.

TSA/GoJet case was decided 3 years ago. How is it a willful disregard for TSA scope when the case has been decided against ALPA and there's no legal appeal??? Makes absolutely ZERO sense. If it was still an ongoing legal process, you might have a point. But with the case decided, with ALPA not appealing the decision and literally forgetting about the case, I gotta ask.... how is it a willful disregard of TSA contract?

 

[PCL_128]

Mainline pilot had a proverbial gun to their head in bankruptcy when they allowed such explosive growth of express carriers in relaxing scope. Either they "allow it" or the judge makes them do it. Some choice...

Mainline pilots gave up 70-seat scope long before bankruptcy ever entered the equation. If I remember right, DCI was already doing over 35% of DAL's block hours even when DAL scope only allowed for 57 70-seat replacement jets. In any case, it doesn't matter, because no one had a contract rammed down their throat in the end. Every concessionary contract was approved by the membership, and most of them by very large margins. You can try to blame bankruptcy courts, but a vote is a vote.

But it'd be a huge eye opener for you.

Not really.

TSA/GoJet case was decided 3 years ago. How is it a willful disregard for TSA scope when the case has been decided against ALPA and there's no legal appeal??? Makes absolutely ZERO sense. If it was still an ongoing legal process, you might have a point. But with the case decided, with ALPA not appealing the decision and literally forgetting about the case, I gotta ask.... how is it a willful disregard of TSA contract?

You keep talking about legality, and I'm talking ethics and common sense. Until we break that barrier, this conversation is going nowhere. I don't care about the legality. I care about right and wrong. It's legal to cross a picket line. Doesn't make it right.

 

[Freight Dog]

Mainline pilots gave up 70-seat scope long before bankruptcy ever entered the equation. If I remember right, DCI was already doing over 35% of DAL's block hours even when DAL scope only allowed for 57 70-seat replacement jets. In any case, it doesn't matter, because no one had a contract rammed down their throat in the end. Every concessionary contract was approved by the membership, and most of them by very large margins. You can try to blame bankruptcy courts, but a vote is a vote.

Check bankruptcy contracts and report back on freq. Check UAL also while you're at it. See what happened with them, and how much of their flying went to express carriers while they were in BK and how much they suffered in bankruptcy. Would it surprise you that many United Express carriers have better work rules than mainline UAL pilots flying Airbuses? Thank you bankruptcy court.

Not really.

Dude, it's a whole different animal to read about bankruptcy. It's yet another thing to live through it and watch your contract get gutted either "voluntarily" by management, or by judge thru 1113c process.

You keep talking about legality, and I'm talking ethics and common sense. Until we break that barrier, this conversation is going nowhere. I don't care about the legality. I care about right and wrong. It's legal to cross a picket line. Doesn't make it right.

OK, do you agree with me that the case has been decided against ALPA?

Do you agree that ALPA did not file any appeals to overturn the ruling?

Do you agree that the legal process has run its due course and it's OVER?

So in light of all that... how can you possibly compare scabbing to GoJet TODAY?

I'm dying to know...

 

[PCL_128]

Check bankruptcy contracts and report back on freq. Check UAL also while you're at it. See what happened with them, and how much of their flying went to express carriers while they were in BK and how much they suffered in bankruptcy.

I don't need to "check" anything. I'm already well aware of what happened in bankruptcy. Doesn't change anything.

OK, do you agree with me that the case has been decided against ALPA?

Yes.

Do you agree that ALPA did not file any appeals to overturn the ruling?

Yes.

Do you agree that the legal process has run its due course and it's OVER?

Yes, the legal process is over. The overall situation is not, however.

So in light of all that... how can you possibly compare scabbing to GoJet TODAY?

I'm dying to know...

I've already answered that question numerous times in this thread and others. You just don't seem to like the answer.

 

[Freight Dog]

Yes, the legal process is over. The overall situation is not, however.

I've already answered that question numerous times in this thread and others. You just don't seem to like the answer.

It's not that I like or dislike the answer, it's calling spade a spade. People will go to GoJet regardless of what you or I or anyone else may think.

How is the overall situation not over? What else is left to do? What can we do? What is the reality of the situation? You and I both know the answer... it's just not popular on FI.

 

[nerjdriver]

The point I was trying to make was simply this: Isnt there more to life than arguing with a computer screen all day?

200 Posts in 3 years? I hardly think he is doing that. Try again.

 

[Moustache]

200 Posts in 3 years? I hardly think he is doing that. Try again.

8 posts ------ call the FBO to see if the C150 is open this weekend---D0UCHE!!!!

 

[MarineGrunt]

So are the Republic guys actually going to do this flying even though it's a violation of their contract? Can't they refuse to do it? And what was the outcome of that Sept 16th meeting? It's beginning to look like BOTH unions are about to roll over and take it in the can on this one...

 

[Popeye0537]

So are the Republic guys actually going to do this flying even though it's a violation of their contract? Can't they refuse to do it? And what was the outcome of that Sept 16th meeting? It's beginning to look like BOTH unions are about to roll over and take it in the can on this one...

It's not a violation of our contract until the first midwest pilot sits in the seat of one of the 170's