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Surprising that pilots for regionals, NWA and others are getting on the board and saying Delta's contract stinks. No doubt, SWA has a better contract as does FedEx and UPS. However if you look around the industry at NWA, CAL, US Air, and United, you see that Delta's contract is one of the best of the legacies and arguably the best. So why aren't you including Delta's peer group in your insults?
You have to motivate your troops when times are hard. The greatest tool you have as a leader is motivation hence the big speeches before huge battles."But he does not live in God's own country the USA!"
Now that's some global perspective!
Like I said I think Delta's management's team is doing a better job then most in this industry and Delta is one of the best legacy carriers to work for in the US. But DL management has taken and wants to take as much money as possible away from you that is their job.
No one cares about your airline's bank account.
But how's your paycheck looking compared to a Delta pilot of equal longevity? How about the work rules? Bases? Expectations?
oops.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanker Clown
And after all of this, a 12 year 777 DAL/FO flying international makes about what a 3 year SWA/FO makes ping ponging around Texas. You guys are doing better now, but you need to get a spine and get your money back.
I can't believe that T.C. has finally formulated a blow to Delta guys that has even a trace of intelligence and truth behind it.
Three year SWA F/O makes $98/hr, 12 year DAL 777 F/O makes $131/hr. So it's not necessarily true.
Are wages less than they should be, Yes.
Does a 3 year SWA F/O make about what a 12 year DAL 777 F/O makes. No.
You seem to be implying that the average $200K payout per pilot is direct compensation for the $600m concession package over 3.5 years. Is this all there is to the story?
The Claim was for concessions over 3.5 years.
Unless I totally misunderstood the BK agreements, the cash/stock payout was in lieu of your entire defined benefit pension plan, which was of course terminated. Correct?
Wrong. You misunderstood. There was an additional $650M in cash distributed to account for pension losses, each pilots Money Purchase Pension Plan was taken out of the DB plan and rolled over into each pilots name, and the PBGC received a $2.2B claim to help fund the lost DB plan.
You can do some fuzzy math if you'd like to compare the average pilot's payout today with what he would have had in the old pension (and you sure did better than the UAL & AAA groups), but comparing the payout vs the wages given up seems like apples and oranges.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tanker Clown
And after all of this, a 12 year 777 DAL/FO flying international makes about what a 3 year SWA/FO makes ping ponging around Texas. You guys are doing better now, but you need to get a spine and get your money back.
I can't believe that T.C. has finally formulated a blow to Delta guys that has even a trace of intelligence and truth behind it.
Three year SWA F/O makes $98/hr, 12 year DAL 777 F/O makes $131/hr. So it's not necessarily true.
Are wages less than they should be, Yes.
Does a 3 year SWA F/O make about what a 12 year DAL 777 F/O makes. No.
You are comparing hourly wages, a SWA pilot with a little effort can get paid for 150 trips a month while I doubt a DAL 777 F/O gets more then 85 hours a month. If you look at W2 wages I would bet a 3rd year F/O at SWA makes more than a 12 year DAL 777 F/O.
By the way I think DAL has a better contract than other airlines that went through bankruptcy and has one of the better management teams out there.
You are comparing hourly wages, a SWA pilot with a little effort can get paid for 150 trips a month while I doubt a DAL 777 F/O gets more then 85 hours a month. If you look at W2 wages I would bet a 3rd year F/O at SWA makes more than a 12 year DAL 777 F/O.
I'm not familiar with what 150 trips in a month entails, but I suspect it's a lot of work. How many trips/month does the average 3rd year guy get in an average month?
What if that DAL 777 F/O picks up some overtime at premium pay for a trip to Narita and back? How many trips does the SWA guy need to pick up to match it?
It's tough to make these comparisons when we start throwing in overtime or how one pilot bids compared to another. Hourly rates may not be a precisely accurate comparison, but it has fewer variables than when we start to introduce bidding habits. JMHO.
This is not at all a slight in the SWA pilots. From all indications and from what I've heard SWAPA has the right guy in charge.