What is the status of the ALPA De-certification vote at US Airways?

[Freight Dog]

OK... fair enough. Now, let me ask you this. Your junior pilot that was never furloughed - what was his status on the date that the merger was announced?

What was his career expectation at the old, original USAirways? How long was he going to wait to upgrade to captain?

Also, what about the top 517 pilots from the old USAirways?

Can you address that too?

 

[Turtle21]

What IS right?

Can someone answer that? I really want to know what do AAA guys think is right. By 'right', I mean right for both groups, no windfalls.

We all know that DOH isn't right. So what is?

PLEASE... someone answer that.

One lovable fault of pilots is their desire to jump in and assume responsibility for fixing things, without asking the question "Who's responsibility is it?"

Prater and his pals have collected a hell of a lot of dues from the pilots, yet they have embraced the failed policy that they of all people are NOT the ones who will discern what is fair--they just collect dues and publish color magazines.

In this vacuum of direction created by ALPA it is necessary that we all rely on the wisdom of each other. Starting with the premise that each of us is equally intelligent then we can extrapolate that a majority vote is in order to get us all past this ALPA train wreck and into a path where we can all collectively move forward, with a mutual solution decided upon by each of us collectively.

 

[vetrider]

There were calls for decertification of ALPA Within minutes of the ALPA-Nic abortion being delivered.

Prater and his pals (along with his pals at AAA) have tried everything they know to deflate the grass roots drive to decertify and replace ALPA. Everything that is.. except do what is right.

I disagree, I think Prater wants US east and west gone and out of his hair. I think ALPA national's attempt to deflate the usapa threat is half hearted at best, just enough to make it appear that they care.

I think Prater tried to help the east "get out of" the nic, but obviously found that he couldn't. I believe that he has probably lost what sympathy he had for the east when he saw how downright nasty alot of them could get. End result, he just wants us all gone, in my opinion.

 

[Turtle21]

I disagree, I think Prater wants US east and west gone and out of his hair. I think ALPA national's attempt to deflate the usapa threat is half hearted at best, just enough to make it appear that they care.

I think Prater tried to help the east "get out of" the nic, but obviously found that he couldn't. I believe that he has probably lost what sympathy he had for the east when he saw how downright nasty alot of them could get. End result, he just wants us all gone, in my opinion.

Perhaps ALPA does just want us out.. which makes it even more necessary that we rely on the wisdom of everyone of us to come to an agreeable way to move forward, seeing that we can no longer hang onto the skirt of ALPA.

 

[Freight Dog]

One lovable fault of pilots is their desire to jump in and assume responsibility for fixing things, without asking the question "Who's responsibility is it?"

Prater and his pals have collected a hell of a lot of dues from the pilots, yet they have embraced the failed policy that they of all people are NOT the ones who will discern what is fair--they just collect dues and publish color magazines.

In this vacuum of direction created by ALPA it is necessary that we all rely on the wisdom of each other. Starting with the premise that each of us is equally intelligent then we can extrapolate that a majority vote is in order to get us all past this ALPA train wreck and into a path where we can all collectively move forward, with a mutual solution decided upon by each of us collectively.

You still didn't answer my question. What IS right?

 

[erjdude]

We could do it one of two ways. The first way would be to negotiate an agreement.

If the sides cannot agree maybe we could bring in a mediator to help both sides come to an agreement.

If all else fails then binding arbitration might be necessary. Ideally this arbitrator would be one of the most experienced and respected in the nation. Also it would be a big plus if both sides choose this arbitrator.

Ultimately I would hope that this arbitrator come up with a list that would leave senior captains as senior captains. And hopefully it would leave those that were junior FOs in their respective position.

This would avoid any windfall for any one group or person because that would leave them in exactly the same position before and after the merger.



The second way would be to just use date of hire. This would work fine for two companies that had been in business a similar period of time, with a similar growth pattern and financial health. However if one airline had been in business for a great period of time, had not done well financially for many years say two decades and in fact had done nothing but shrink for twenty years (except for one brief period involving red airplanes) and the other airline had only been in business for twenty years but had been continually growing and hiring for that period then date of hire could be problematic. For example it could lead to a furloughed pilot at one airline ending up senior to over half the captains at another airline.

By the way any guesses how the lists will be merged in the coming consolidation. My guess is not one list will be merged DOH.

 

[Turtle21]

You still didn't answer my question. What IS right?

Just because I didn't tell you what you want to hear does not mean that I didn't answer your question.:laugh:

It does not matter what I think is right or what you think is right. Neither of us has the authority to make it a reality.

What matters is who has the authority to establish the reality of "right". ALPA has decided they don't, so we all will now have to vote on it. And since we are all smart and wise pilots, the collective answer in a vote will be the right answer. Ask me what is "right" once the vote is over--that will be my opinion, and then my opinion will mean something.
:beer:
Cheers!

 

[Carl S.]

If the West gives an inch to the demands of the East for their demands of "Fair and Equitable" after a decision was rendered in binding arbitration, a new legal process will be established. I like to call it the "HostagePhase" and all cases after this with a list merger with an arbitration will look into it.
What is the East willing to give for some form of relielf from the implementation of the list? All other arguements are moot because the list is done, except for the process to play out.

 

[waveflyer]

when is the vote?

 

[ALGFLYR]

when is the vote?

1-2 weeks...