What is the status of the ALPA De-certification vote at US Airways?

[Tweaker]

I heard some 14 day countdown began 1/23/8. Does anyone know if this is close to a vote conclusion?

Is is true that new hires may not vote?

 

[TWA Dude]

No announcement from the NMB yet. As far as newhires, I would think all pilots on the seniority list would be eligible to vote.

 

[Bringupthebird]

No announcement from the NMB yet. As far as newhires, I would think all pilots on the seniority list would be eligible to vote.

So should a new-hire vote for a union that has made considerable progress towards a joint contract and promotes stability and therefore job security? [ALPA]

Or should they support a group that will further divide the pilot group and drag out the instability for many years, perhaps putting their positions in jeopardy, for the sole purpose of advancing the career progression of senior F/O's, at the expense of everyone else?[Bargain store brand]

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Questions for USAPA supporters....

Question: What will be the dues rate?

Q: What is fundamentally different about USAPA that will make it better? Is it progressive and/or innovative?

Q: Looking long term, will USAPA just be another pilots union or will the energy, enthusiasm and effectiveness endure? If so...why? How?

Q: How does the APA compare? Is the APA a good model? Does USAPA want to be like APA or better and/or different?

Q: What are USAPA's top five priorities?

Q: The USAPA website calls for volunteers and democratic participation. How does that differ from ALPA?

 

[TWA Dude]

Q: How does the APA compare? Is the APA a good model? Does USAPA want to be like APA or better and/or different?

I know you want a USAPA supporter to answer and I'm not impersonating one but I just wanted to point out that as a former Teamster, a current (inactive) APA member, and an ALPA member at three different carriers I feel comfortable saying there's nothing intrinsically better or worse about the organization of any pilots' unions. The APA is just as screwed-up and has just as many internal detractors as does ALPA. Unity and happiness in one's union comes more from effective leadership than any other component. Effective pilot union leaders are few and far in between.

 

[ferlo]

IMO, any us air new hire that votes for usapa, if given the chance, is crazy. The airline will implode in short order, the furloughs will flow, and they'll be wishing for their Mesa seat back.

 

[PCL_128]

I'm somewhat curious how the dimwitted USAPA supporters think they'll be able to run their union without ALPA's help. Every other independent pilots' union pays ALPA to help them with lots of things, but it would be political suicide for the USAPA "leadership" to keep giving money to ALPA for services after all of this crying about ALPA that they've been doing. Besides, I doubt ALPA would even do business with them.

 

[Turtle21]

I heard some 14 day countdown began 1/23/8. Does anyone know if this is close to a vote conclusion?

Is is true that new hires may not vote?

The NMB has ruled that the pilots of USAir comprise a single carrier. That is if a representational vote occurs then a majority of those voting (as long as 50% of eligible voters vote) will establish which Constitution and Bylaws govern the CBA.

The NMB declared February 6th as the date that all cards must be turned in. The company is now required to provide a list of all the pilots along with their status and address. The NMB will next validate the number of cards and determine if there is sufficient number to require an election. If so they will establish the date of the election and distribute balloting information to the pilots at the address supplied by the company.

All pilots (active, medical leave, furloughed, etc) should be able to vote, but the NMB will establish who is eligible to vote in the election.

There are many who oppose the right of individuals to vote and the derisive rhetoric will likely increase as the democratic process moves forward.

It seems all but certain that a representational election is now unavoidable. More than ample cards to force the election were submitted in November, and now again duplicate cards were submitted at the beginning of February. It might be problematic for ALPA to prove the cards are invalid, seeing that over 3200 have been submitted twice .

 

[MK82Man]

These are the questions I’d like the East guys to answer:

1) ALPA was fine until the binding arbitration ruling came out and then the East didn’t like the results. At that point, the East pushed USAPA in order to delay and stall the implementation of the Nicolau Award. How will USAPA overturn the Federal Binding Arbitrated Seniority List?

2) Does USAPA have the financial resources to fight the West as they litigate over the Federal Seniority Award?

3) Now that 65 has passed, US Airways has very little attrition. Since that was the chief argument of the East “the west has no right to our attrition during the merger”, how does USAPA plan to expedite the joint contract talks?

Since 80% of the work has already been done between both ALPA parties (ok mostly between the West and ALPA National, since the East hasn’t been at the table with us for 9 months), why would someone vote for USAPA and start the process all over again?

The West pilots will drag their feet for years. Since the East guys are now big-time stagnated due to age 65, why would you vote for a new union that will only prolong the path to a joint contract?

The East guys are still stuck on their LOA contract while the West guys actually have a real contract. Why would you vote for a group that keeps you on the sub-standard LOA wage and work-rules contract?

The only winner (every single day) is management as contract talks just stall forever and ever.

4) At some point isn’t it just better to work together for a better future. We are a new company, the new US Airways. It isn’t the US Air of old and it isn’t the America West of old, we are stuck together, like it or not. USAPA is a clearly divisive tactic designed to stall the merger integration and enable the East to upgrade their FOs to Captain outside the Nicolau Award. It is designed to help the East take advantage of the West. Rather than alienate 1800 West pilots who will not pay dues and enlist ALPA National help to litigate, why didn’t the East seek a different path to protect their FOs rather than just insist on a DOH seniority list?

Finally for all ALPA members …. Do you realize how much this is costing ALPA? We get tons of flyers printed, tons of letters at home … the postage bill alone must be huge. Not to mention the Blue Ribbon Committee, Special Committee, Committee of Concerned Pilots, Joint Task Force, Airline Pilot Mom’s who resolve to figure it out – all designed to resolve differences, promote mutual understanding and harmony (the glittering generalities are killing me) …. It just goes on and on. The Flight Pay Loss alone that all ALPA members are paying must be stunning and the senior leader’s hotel bills and per diem cost over the issue of East and West integration is a significant sum. Why isn’t the rest of ALPA rising up and criticizing the East guys for playing outside the sandbox? The East actions are costing all 65,000 guys a staggering sum of money … all wasted since they weren’t happy with the Seniority Award.

And of course the East guys will tell you …. It is more than that. We haven’t been happy with ALPA for years; this was just the final straw …. sure.

I’d like some East guys to post on why you submitted cards and why you intend to vote for USAPA if an election is held

 

[Lampshade]

When is USAPA gonna break the news to the flock about dues and assessments to get this Titanic off the docks? My guess 2% dues plus $1000/500 CA/FO yearly assessment as a starter.