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Union coming at Flexjet!

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Then you're well behind the power curve and need to consider that NJA's union was contacted as was Options, and after much discussion it became clear what the only viable path would be. This is not some shot in the dark.
 
DirtyBeech said:
Then you're well behind the power curve and need to consider that NJA's union was contacted as was Options, and after much discussion it became clear what the only viable path would be. This is not some shot in the dark.
Click to expand...

I suspect NJA union types told the truth and the Teamsters did not. The Teamsters want your MONEY. I feel this will not end well for the fine Flex guys and gals.
 
Money is a key part of it. NJ's is unable to help due to a no compete clause, and Options can't because they don't have the money. There needs to be a 700 plus member pilot group to go it alone. It's very simple. The teamsters are the only viable option. You should consider the fact that this has been thoroughly explored by grown men and that the decision for representation wasn't made in a flippant manner.

You can feel whatever you want. Up to this point you have been poorly informed. Right now it's Teamsters or nothing, and quite a few folks are tired of what nothing is like.
 
G4dude said:
I suspect NJA union types told the truth and the Teamsters did not. The Teamsters want your MONEY. I feel this will not end well for the fine Flex guys and gals.
Click to expand...

Yea and the company wants for you to pay for your type rating and live 2 pilots to a room as well. Your also right the Teamsters want their 22%, news flash........their a business, just like the company!
 
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Dime Line, Dime Line, R U doing a line when you make a post. If u r goin to print a bald-face line, why don't you at least preface your BS with something like "You ain't goin to believe this, but..." No-one has ever paid for a type-rating at Flex(unless they broke the training contract), and we don't share rooms. Wouldn't you agree with my statement, Mr. DirtyB. After all, you work at Flex...are you going to agree with DL's line?
WL
 
19,

You missed his point. Badly. Think it through a few times more and see if you can make a connection between DL's post and the one he was responding to.
 
Teamsters fight for respect and once they get it they don't give it back. Weigh the pros and cons and ask lotsa questions keeping in mind that management and unions WILL lie. You just need to decide who is more truthful. Talk to NJ and FLOPS pilots one on one and get many opinions,you can only get the real truth when they are free to speak without their peers around. A fractional has only one choice for union representation for a first CBA and as history has proven it does not need to be permanent. If you think it has to do with money you are entirely correct.
 
dime line said:
Yea and the company wants for you to pay for your type rating and live 2 pilots to a room as well. Your also right the Teamsters want their 22%, news flash........their a business, just like the company!
Click to expand...

This is a funny post! Unintentionally funny! Flex does not require any of these things. Another delightful characteristic of the beloved Teamsters is that they will take some of your dues and give the money to political candidates who disagree with most pilots at FlexJet.
 
DirtyBeech said:
Money is a key part of it. NJ's is unable to help due to a no compete clause, and Options can't because they don't have the money. There needs to be a 700 plus member pilot group to go it alone. It's very simple. The teamsters are the only viable option. You should consider the fact that this has been thoroughly explored by grown men and that the decision for representation wasn't made in a flippant manner.

You can feel whatever you want. Up to this point you have been poorly informed. Right now it's Teamsters or nothing, and quite a few folks are tired of what nothing is like.
Click to expand...

My only info is what I have read on this forum. I do know NJA threw them out on their collective- pun intended- butts.
 
G4dude said:
This is a funny post! Unintentionally funny!
Flex does not require any of these things.
Click to expand...
Another delightful characteristic of the beloved Teamsters is that they will take some of your dues and give the money to political candidates who disagree with most pilots at FlexJet.
Click to expand...

Can you not read beyond the intended context, I'm aware none of the fracs require these items.
 
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dime line said:
Yea and the company wants for you to pay for your type rating and live 2 pilots to a room as well. Your also right the Teamsters want their 22%, news flash........their a business, just like the company!
Click to expand...

I apologize if I misunderstood, but I still don't get it. What was the point of this post? Please explain, not with elliptical language. If it was making fun of the Teamsters, I get it. Sometimes the written word can be misconstrued, even by a vastly superior "Guffstream" Pilot. :-)
 
G4dude said:
Another delightful characteristic of the beloved Teamsters is that they will take some of your dues and give the money to political candidates who disagree with most pilots at FlexJet.
Click to expand...

I'm not a big fan of the Teamsters and was one of the individuals that helped get us our own independent union, but that statement is false.

Unions are prohibited from doing that. They may however, start a PAC, solicit voluntary donations and use those funds for political purposes. The IBT most certainly does that.
 
I reread DL's post and realize what he was saying...my apologies. That said, he then calls the Teamsters a business....uh, most folks whose eyes are open see them as an on-going criminal enterprise...I do. They and their ilk are in bed with the Democratic Party and eventually destroy the livelihood of whoever they “represent” by their outrageous demands and threats...businesses go
over-seas, develop robotics to replace humans, etc. If the few grieveance mongers who post here need a union to keep the big, bad, management foot off our throats, at least try to get one that “might” actually represent us ie inhouse etc (and yea, I know some of the difficulties involved in that....let's just take the easy way out, right? ( get the Devil, uh, the Teamsters). If the Teamsters are voted in and some of our more vocal proponents of unionization go on the MEC, I'll probably go to the Army Surplus, but a Japanese WWII sword, and commit Hari Kari (rather than have those genius's “represent” me). I think the majority of Flex pilots are mature enough to know the Teamsters are not a good answer to our few problems....I may be wrong.
WL
 
fracjack said:
Teamsters fight for respect and once they get it they don't give it back. Weigh the pros and cons and ask lotsa questions keeping in mind that management and unions WILL lie. You just need to decide who is more truthful. Talk to NJ and FLOPS pilots one on one and get many opinions,you can only get the real truth when they are free to speak without their peers around. A fractional has only one choice for union representation for a first CBA and as history has proven it does not need to be permanent. If you think it has to do with money you are entirely correct.
Click to expand...

I must say the reason the Teamsters have to fight for respect is because they are a bunch or intimidating crooks. One has to fight for respect when one obviously doesn't deserve respect. The other way to get respect is to behave in a manner which engenders respect, but that's not going to happen.
 
warlord19 said:
I reread DL's post and realize what he was saying...my apologies. That said, he then calls the Teamsters a business....uh, most folks whose eyes are open see them as an on-going criminal enterprise...I do. They and their ilk are in bed with the Democratic Party and eventually destroy the livelihood of whoever they “represent” by their outrageous demands and threats...businesses go
over-seas, develop robotics to replace humans, etc. If the few grieveance mongers who post here need a union to keep the big, bad, management foot off our throats, at least try to get one that “might” actually represent us ie inhouse etc (and yea, I know some of the difficulties involved in that....let's just take the easy way out, right? ( get the Devil, uh, the Teamsters). If the Teamsters are voted in and some of our more vocal proponents of unionization go on the MEC, I'll probably go to the Army Surplus, but a Japanese WWII sword, and commit Hari Kari (rather than have those genius's “represent” me). I think the majority of Flex pilots are mature enough to know the Teamsters are not a good answer to our few problems....I may be wrong.
WL
Click to expand...

If you want to know more about the ins and outs of this movement then you ought to by now know where to find it. That you are uninterested in educating yourself, or more likely, are not allowed access to that information because of who you are is your problem.

In summation:
A) Both the Options and NJ's unions were contacted about starting our own, or forming a fractional union. It's not monetarily possible for one and the other has a no compete clause.
B) A 700+ pilot group is required to go it alone with an in house union.
C) There are more than a few grievances here or the movement would not be generating the kind of numbers that it is.
D) Get your cards in.

...and you make it a good one for you.
 
Mr. DirtyB., if I for a second thought we (Flex pilots) needed a union, I would know all the little intricacies of forming one. I've never tried to access their boards or requested their card 'cause it doesn't interest me....I don't find that to be a “problem”. You, obviously, are very involved, and have been coached on how to answer criticisms 'cause your recents postings are not as obnoxious, Flex-loathing, and self-serving as they used to be.....good for you. I've been a member of a chemical union in-good-standing in my youth, and know what unions do and don't do. Bringing a union on property is a power game...I think most people understand and realize this. But people have to weigh the pros and cons of having representation. I would rather spend my “union dues” on college funds, retirements accounts, etc. I'm treated fairly at Flex, never had a paycheck bounce, and have strict guidelines(FOM,FAR's, Bombardier Employee Handbook, etc) as to my treatment at Flex. Problems...yea, a few. Worth 3% of my GROSS PAY to an ongoing criminal enterprise....don't think so. I do appreciate your yearly drives to unionize, however....it keeps some pressure on management to keep improving the company. In the meantime, keep on stewing about your obviously miserable working conditions....this might be your year.
WL
 
Mr. DirtyB., if I for a second thought we (Flex pilots) needed a union, I would know all the little intricacies of forming one. I've never tried to access their boards or requested their card 'cause it doesn't interest me....I don't find that to be a “problem”. You, obviously, are very involved, and have been coached on how to answer criticisms 'cause your recents postings are not as obnoxious, Flex-loathing, and self-serving as they used to be.....good for you. I've been a member of a chemical union in-good-standing in my youth, and know what unions do and don't do. Bringing a union on property is a power game...I think most people understand and realize this. But people have to weigh the pros and cons of having representation. I would rather spend my “union dues” on college funds, retirements accounts, etc. I'm treated fairly at Flex, never had a paycheck bounce, and have strict guidelines(FOM,FAR's, Bombardier Employee Handbook, etc) as to my treatment at Flex. Problems...yea, a few. Worth 3% of my GROSS PAY to an ongoing criminal enterprise....don't think so. I do appreciate your yearly drives to unionize, however....it keeps some pressure on management to keep improving the company. In the meantime, keep on stewing about your obviously miserable working conditions....this might be your year.
WL
 
DirtyBeech said:
and the other has a no compete clause.
Click to expand...

Not exactly correct. The NJASAP bylaws state that we exist to represent NetJets pilots only. It would require a Bylaws change to bring any other pilot groups on board. I personally think that is unlikely.
 
DirtyBeech said:
If you want to know more about the ins and outs of this movement then you ought to by now know where to find it. That you are uninterested in educating yourself, or more likely, are not allowed access to that information because of who you are is your problem.

In summation:
A) Both the Options and NJ's unions were contacted about starting our own, or forming a fractional union. It's not monetarily possible for one and the other has a no compete clause.
B) A 700+ pilot group is required to go it alone with an in house union.
C) There are more than a few grievances here or the movement would not be generating the kind of numbers that it is.
D) Get your cards in.

...and you make it a good one for you.
Click to expand...

Very interesting information, of which I was unaware. Thanks. Good luck with the Teamsters, I think you are all going to need it. Luck, that is.
 
If the Teamsters are voted in and some of our more vocal proponents of unionization go on the MEC, I'll probably go to the Army Surplus, but a Japanese WWII sword, and commit Hari Kari (rather than have those genius's “represent” me).
Click to expand...

Its really funny you say this. We at FLOPS have heard this same story from a bunch of pilots during the 3.5 years that it took to get a contract, and yet they are still here, some of whom are able to keep their jobs (due to their screwups) thanks to the union, the very union they don't support. Oh and they enjoy the protections of the contract. F..ing Hipocrites
 
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Also I guess it was announced a couple of days ago, FLEX managment has hired Ford and Harrison. Funny FLOPS hired them as well, (I would love to see that bill). So we now have G4Dude and Warlord19. Good luck Flex.
 
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dime line said:
Also I guess it was announced a couple of days ago, FLEX managment has hired Ford and Harrison. Funny FLOPS hired them as well, (I would love to see that bill). So we now have G4Dude and Warlord19. Good luck Flex.
Click to expand...

Where was it "announced". Want to quote a real source or is that just rumor too??
 
dime line said:
Also I guess it was announced a couple of days ago, FLEX managment has hired Ford and Harrison. Funny FLOPS hired them as well, (I would love to see that bill). So we now have G4Dude and Warlord19. Good luck Flex.
Click to expand...

Get ready for the pizza parties and the invitations to dinner from your management pilots.
 
We don't meet the definition of air carrier according to the RLA or Bond-McCaskill. How does voting a union help us during a merger/buyout? What are the specific deficiencies in our treatment that a union would address? Convince me that I need representation.
 
If you want to try privately, you can pm me. But really, no one wants to get specific about a union?
 

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