Two people in Aviation with Kids. Does it work?

[capt. megadeth]

Sorry, mega... all I've gotten is "I want to have my cake and eat it too..." Why are women still unhappy after the last 50 years when they have more choice?

That's fine. I DO want my cake and eat it too. Sorry you don't feel that you can hack that in your life but I can and I always have.

I dunno why it's claimed in a newspaper article that women are still unhappy. Do you really believe everything you read? I don't. I couldn't be more happy with my life so I don't know what that gibberish is all about.

 

[capt. megadeth]

Bingo!

1. Live with in reality!

2. And??? What is the point? I think you should be able to return after a long maternity leave.... but you can't... So lets deal with reality....

3. And its someone's fault? Society? Who? Men?

4. It is just the way it is.... where are the limitations? What is the question over on the 'US Navy message board'? Two parents on 6 month sea crusies with kids... does it work?

5. Who gets to speak for the kids? As we have grown from one income to two incomes 'needed', who speaks for the kids?

6. It is easy to do whatever you want when it comes to kids, because they don't know better and they really aren't going to question much. IOW it's called taking advantage of unconditional love.

Generally speaking about your entire rant there....

Uh.....WHAT?!?!?!? Have you been drinking tonight?

1. Actually, I do live in reality....I seriously have doubts about whether you do though.

2. Exactly! I can't therefore I will go back. Anyone that would give up working 8 nights a month for $150K a year and a career at UPS has a f***ng screw loose. That IS living in reality.

3. Fault???? Huh? Who said anything is anyone's "fault"? I like my life. I like my job. I will love my kids. My choices are MINE. I don't know what your point is here. I am doing what is best for my family not blaming anyone for it. See Rez, I do live in reality....the reality that you cannot just drop an airline career, go back and pick up where you left off.

4. It's not quantity...it's quality....apparently you don't "get" that.

5. Dude! My mom was ALWAYS working. I can tell you right now that I NEVER ONCE, NOT ONCE thought "gee, I wish my mom was at home all the time". That thought NEVER crossed my mind. It's just the way it was. I never said that in my situation, I "needed" two incomes. You keep trying to make the point about people wanting tons of money and toys as the reason couples both want careers. It's a lot deeper than that for me but you just don't get that either.

6. Dude! That's f***ed up! I just can't believe you would say that wanting to financially secure your family's future 100% (ie. having a career and not running from judge to judge or depending on life insurance) is taking advantage of kid's unconditional love. Unreal! You way of thinking is too f***ed up for me man.

 

[capt. megadeth]

Because God never improved the quality of men.

LOL! No kidding!

 

[capt. megadeth]

Once again, Mega buries her head in the sand to the inconvenient science and facts and would rather live by the laws of feminist political correctness; the fashionable thing to do today I suppose.

Just make sure to invest in a good breast pump as the APP recommends an infant nurse well into their first year.

Hopefully you'll never be one of those families affected by the strain and conflict of two careers and having kids, but that wouldn't be because you're the norm, it would be because you're lucky (anecdotal). Then your husband might just be a stay at home dad too..

Hey....why don't you go crawl back into your cave? I really don't care what a "Roman Catholic" has to say. Do you molest little boys too? :laugh:

 

[capt. megadeth]

Plenty of posters have offered coherant debate on the issue and all we get back from you, Flyual and mega is superficial society acceptance combined with fustration, name calling and "I am packing up my marbles and going home."

Rez....you are so friggin funny it's ridiculous!!!!!!!!!

The posters that have supposedly offered "coherent debate" in your eyes are the people that AGREE with you. Hmmmm, funny how that works.

Your "debate" is your OPINION and a link to a news article. Once again, do you believe everything you read or only the things that you agree with??? LOL!

Now, if you would post a link to an article that PROVES FOR A FACT that every kid that is screwed up and on meds in this country comes from a dual working parent household (since you love to imply that), you may show me that you have some credibility. Come on....I dare ya!

 

[HA25]

Now, if you would post a link to an article that PROVES FOR A FACT that every kid that is screwed up and on meds in this country comes from a dual working parent household (since you love to imply that), you may show me that you have some credibility. Come on....I dare ya!

no drugs mentioned, but I don't see anything positive in it based on what these articles say.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,3604,1084834,00.html

http://www.psychosomaticmedicine.org/cgi/content/abstract/61/2/205

 

[capt. megadeth]

no drugs mentioned, but I don't see anything positive in it based on what these articles say.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,3604,1084834,00.html

http://www.psychosomaticmedicine.org/cgi/content/abstract/61/2/205

Well, first off, I wasn't asking YOU neanderthal. You talk about MY head in the sand??? If it was up to you, all of us women would have our heads in our man's crotch hoping to be given some spending money sitting at home barefoot and pregnant. GMAFB! Secondly, I want to see something about the amount of kids on various drugs and their parents working.

 

[HA25]

Well, first off, I wasn't asking YOU neanderthal.

Ug.. Me sorry. Me try to give article to help debate. Me think guardian article very relevant to discussion. Ug!

Me hungry now... where food?

Me go hunt mammoth!

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Perhaps this thread would have been different if it was titled....

"Two People in Aviation with Kids. Whats Best for the Kids?"



nahhh...probably not...

 

[capt. megadeth]

Perhaps this thread would have been different if it was titled....

"Two People in Aviation with Kids. Whats Best for the Kids?"

Well, it wasn't, but you tried your damndest to make it into that.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

Well, it wasn't, but you tried your damndest to make it into that.

What is best for kids?

A. Parents are wealthy and don't have to work. Mom, Dad and kids are together as much as they want to be.

B. One spouse works 40+ work week and one spouse stays at home.

C. Both spouses work. Execute tag team parenting method. Kids, more often than not, are not with both parents simultaneously.

D. Single parent. Works and raises kids.

E. Divorced parents sharing custody.



I tried to come up with the most commom combination, although I don't think A is too common.

 

[HA25]

What is best for kids?

A. Parents are wealthy and don't have to work. Mom, Dad and kids are together as much as they want to be.

B. One spouse works 40+ work week and one spouse stays at home.

C. Both spouses work. Execute tag team parenting method. Kids, more often than not, are not with both parents simultaneously.

D. Single parent. Works and raises kids.

E. Divorced parents sharing custody.



I tried to come up with the most commom combination, although I don't think A is too common.

While not filthy rich, I've got enough to stop working now and live an upper middle class live for the rest of my natural life.. wife hasn't worked a full time job since we got married, but I would argue it's not good for kids to grow up and not see the father working, as it sends a wrong message to both the boy and the girl.

My belief is that it's best to stress education for both boys AND girls and then to instill good family values into the kids so that when they grow up, marry and have kids they have their priorities straight.

 

[FlyUnited]

And what are "good family values"? That the girl is worthless and must lose her entire identity once she becomes pregnant?

I would argue that it's not good for kids to grow up and not see the MOTHER working, as it sends a wrong message to both the boy and the girl.

Rez, B and C are the same thing because the kids are not seeing both parents simultaneously anyway if Dad is working and Mom is sitting at home trying to keep from gouging her eyes out with spoons.

FMS - BS ALERT! So you have enough to live well without working for the rest of your life yet you are trying to get an interview at VA? Ummmm, I find that a little hard to believe. Do you want to miss holidays and birthdays with your family on purpose? I thought you were all about 'family values'. Good job, that should instill a lot in the kiddies....."our dad has so much money that he doesn't even have to work, but he leaves for days on end just so he won't have to be around us". WTG! Father of the Year! Now why were you criticizing us women? Oh yes, I remember, because we have the positions that you can't seem to get.

 

[climbhappy]

the only reason girls play with dolls is that they're told to do so. we put them into roles from infancy. boys play with tractors and cars, and girls have tea parties.

all we can do is instill a good work ethic. study habits and use performance based pay
(do your chores) little girls all grown up are making inroads all over amercia now(in pay)
and in advertising , they're making more than men. the new role of a woman is to make money. crap, you can't take a vacation now for four if you don't have 5 grand in the vacation fund. assuming your flying somewhere.
bottom line. i would rather have a wife that worked and contributed than what i see around me. the wives who get to shop and have lunch and then starbucks after a nappy nap are inherently lazy, bitch and wine when you walk in the door, and create contempt in the marriage.(they're unhappy because they're not fulfilled) this from a stockbroker friend
whose marriage tanked and now he is putting her through nursing school. he said she never was really happy, ouch!! it is suppose to be a partnership and today it matters where income is concerned. my friends tell me their stay at homes are moody, and "not in the mood" more often than not.
why work hard when you have to carry dead weight.

these are the new family values.

 

[Rez O. Lewshun]

And what are "good family values"? That the girl is worthless and must lose her entire identity once she becomes pregnant?

Your second sentence is skewed with how you see the world and how our society views women. And that is too bad that we don't value pregnant women.

That is very profound! In our society we do not value pregnant women. A step further... women in our society do not value pregnant women. Which raises the next question... why do we have kids if they hinder our efforts to find value in our society?

I would argue that it's not good for kids to grow up and not see the MOTHER working, as it sends a wrong message to both the boy and the girl.

As I recall, FLYUAL.. you have or had employed domestic work in your house? A maid and/or cook?

Many mothers who worked realize that it is more difficult to stay at home than raise kids. I think that is shows excellent values and ethics to show a spouse managing the home. Only once the home life is safe, physically and emotionally can the family grow as a group and as individuals...

The thread turns to Whats best for kids and you say its best for both spouses to leave the kids and go off to work? That is best for kids?

Rez, B and C are the same thing because the kids are not seeing both parents simultaneously anyway if Dad is working and Mom is sitting at home trying to keep from gouging her eyes out with spoons.

Why is Mom gouging her eyes out? This is a perception of yours based on experience and environment. It is not common reality. I never said mom should stay at home, yet you responded as if it was.

In addtion your comments above are contridicting. Best for the kids IS B. An income must be made. The house note, food and clothing must be paid for. One spouse must work for a large percentage of families. However, when that spouse comes home then the entire family is together, longest compared to C & D, for a period of time.

Whereas in C, when one spouse comes home, the other leaves shortly after that...


We are now talking about what is best for KIDS....

 

[HA25]

FMS - BS ALERT! So you have enough to live well without working for the rest of your life yet you are trying to get an interview at VA? Ummmm, I find that a little hard to believe.

As I said, it's not good for kids to see their dad not working, but I guess you didn't read that part.

What do you want for proof? I'm comfortable with any reasonable requests that don't give away my personal information. Send me your email via PM and I can provide proof in the form of expensive toys, cars, etc...

On the matter of this topic, in the end, I really don't care what you believe, as you don't care what I believe. At this point, we are debating for the sake of debate here, aren't we?

 

[FlyUnited]

Rez,

I completely respect your position because I know that you believe it is the best situation for your family.

Now, in MY opinion, I would NEVER recommend staying home to anyone. It was the most boring years of my life. I am so glad it is almost over and I never actually did all the domesticated things I'm sure you make your wife do. I always had a cook and a cleaning lady and the kids had nannies, the only thing I did insist on is that my kids study hard in school, that they play hard in sports, and they have fun in life. We laughed a lot and hugged a lot, that's it. That's all I did. I left the dirty work for the hired help. And I still found it boring. I loved the kids to pieces but I think that raising kids is not as rewarding as some would like you to believe. I would not recommend it as a fulfilling career.

I failed at the Mommy of the Year Awards: I didn't sign up for class mom ever for any of them, I let them each pick ONE class trip a year to chaperone, I payed my way out of having to work the snack bar at Little League, I dreaded "back to school night" but armed myself with a nice tall glass a vino beforehand to help get me through the torture, I bought cake for birthdays and all partys were catered, crafts were a no-no.

I did something right though. One boy at Yale, one applying early action (and no doubt getting it) and another hoping for Northwestern in a couple years. They drive themselves wherever they need to go nowadays, so I'm off that hook too. My Point: It doesn't take constant "stay home" moms to produce decent kids. I didn't have to clean my house, cook for my family and sacrifice MY LIFE to ensure that my kids succeeded....they had to do that on their own. I had a job (eventually I went back), their dad had a job and they had a job (school). We took school very seriously and I believe it has a lot to do with the fact that no one was ever just sitting around doing nothing. Everyone worked. Kids were expected to get A's.

Someday my boys will marry and I hope they respect their wives enough to let her decide what is the best course for her. Her children will turn out better if she is happy.

I just read in the paper today that at least 2/3 of all divorces are because the woman wants out. I am not surprised when I read what some of the men on this board have posted. It sounds like slavery, not marriage.

 

[HA25]

I just read in the paper today that at least 2/3 of all divorces are because the woman wants out. I am not surprised when I read what some of the men on this board have posted. It sounds like slavery, not marriage.

When there is a meeting of the minds, there is no divorce.. My wife and I agree 100% on this topic, as clearly you and your husband do. The problem lies when (and I know of several instances like this) where both have careers and neither will yield to the other's and then they part..

I know of an American captain friend of mine who's wife was a (then) Big 6 CPA and wanted a promotion that moved them out of MIA, she insisted on it and he didn't want to commute as they made enough money where they were. She then filed for divorce and broke up their home with two young teens over this lack of "meeting of the minds" which I contend was due to her placing her career ahead of her family.

 

[FlyUnited]

I think it was HIS fault because he could still do his job had he been more flexible yet she would not be able to move up in her job without the promotion. He refused to give so he ends up losing everything over being stubborn. That hurts. Commute or lose entire family. I guess he showed her.

 

[capt. megadeth]

The thread turns to Whats best for kids....

Uh, noone but you thinks that this is what the thread is about. YOU are the one that keeps trying to turn it into that. You should just give it up for crying out loud!