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Three questions about the Q-400 trim and deice system.

Icywings

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Does the Q have some sort of audible alert to let the pilots know if the trim was being activated by the Autopilot? If so, is it something one would notice if it were often activated during that stage of the approach.

Second question: I understand you can get a deice disconnect or malfunction on low RPM which makes sense as there is a lack of air pressure from the engine. Has anyone heard of this or can anyone tell me more about it and how obvious it is to the pilots.

Third Question: If they pilots is there an SOP telling you to switch from 3 minute to 1 minute on the deice system at a certain stage of an approach or icing condition. Could the crew have left it in 3 which would contribute to the crash?
 

CX880

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Just let it go. Are we goinig to have these threads every other day now? The media is already calling it pilot error, let's not try to come up with something over here as well.
 

Icywings

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I am trying to help stop the media just blame the pilots. Trust me on this! Answer these for me please. Then I can correct things being reported on CNN and on Foxnews. Thanks!!! I am a pilot as well!!! I think it is unfair that they are blaming the pilots.
 

ace6453

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Does the Q have some sort of audible alert to let the pilots know if the trim was being activated by the Autopilot? If so, is it something one would notice if it were often activated during that stage of the approach.

Second question: I understand you can get a deice disconnect or malfunction on low RPM which makes sense as there is a lack of air pressure from the engine. Has anyone heard of this or can anyone tell me more about it and how obvious it is to the pilots.

Third Question: If they pilots is there an SOP telling you to switch from 3 minute to 1 minute on the deice system at a certain stage of an approach or icing condition. Could the crew have left it in 3 which would contribute to the crash?

how many sites do you plan on posting this on?
 

Icywings

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as many as I can until I get until someone stops dicking with me and will just answer me. Can you please post on the http://www.airlinepilotforums.com that I am a member here since 2002 pls? They keep thinking I am new and with the media because of my screen name.
 

CX880

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Does the Q have some sort of audible alert to let the pilots know if the trim was being activated by the Autopilot? If so, is it something one would notice if it were often activated during that stage of the approach.

Second question: I understand you can get a deice disconnect or malfunction on low RPM which makes sense as there is a lack of air pressure from the engine. Has anyone heard of this or can anyone tell me more about it and how obvious it is to the pilots.

Third Question: If they pilots is there an SOP telling you to switch from 3 minute to 1 minute on the deice system at a certain stage of an approach or icing condition. Could the crew have left it in 3 which would contribute to the crash?


Either you have very bad grammar or you have no idea what you are trying to ask. Which leads me to believe that you are not a pilot. As far as the third question, who cares the only ones that will know for sure were the pilots and the NTSB whenever they complete the investigation. And I'm confused are you trying to not make it seem like pilot error or not , look at your last sentence.....
 

Icywings

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Either you have very bad grammar or you have no idea what you are trying to ask. Which leads me to believe that you are not a pilot. As far as the third question, who cares the only ones that will know for sure were the pilots and the NTSB whenever they complete the investigation. And I'm confused are you trying to not make it seem like pilot error or not , look at your last sentence.....

I am trying to type very quickly sorry. Yes, I am trying to provide other explanations to get the media to stop saying or focusing on the pilots. As I am typing this Shepard Smith just said the ntsb is focusing on the pilots action. They should focus on other things as well. What if the deice malfunctioned or lost pressure? The pilots couldn't do anything about it at that point. Now they are trying to focus on the damn autopilot again. I want to get them off of this. It makes us look bad. I hate it! STOP fighting me pls and help me.
 

Jar Jar

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Icywings - if you want to relay something to your media 'connection' tell them to report the NTSB findings verbatim - nothing more.

I just wish the public would become aware of the NTSB's work, and the fact that it is largely IGNORED by the FAA.

Im sure the NTSB will look into any mechanical/deice malfunctions - crash investigations take a very long time to do properly and the folks at the NTSB are very very competent at doing a thorough job. Give them some time.
 

Icywings

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Icywings - if you want to relay something to your media 'connection' tell them to report the NTSB findings verbatim - nothing more.

I just wish the public would become aware of the NTSB's work, and the fact that it is largely IGNORED by the FAA.

I have and sadly they are. They are just picking and choosing. They want to sensationalize this. If I have some info from Q drivers about the darn plane I can pass that on and get them to at least present other possibilities and that it may very well not be a pilot error. I have heard the Deice can malfunction on approach or lose pressure at low rpm. Did that happen? We won't know until the NTSB can get into it. However, by then these poor pilots will have already been found guilty in the public eye and media. THAT is sooooo wrong it makes me sick and don't want that to happen.
 

Erlanger

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I have and sadly they are. They are just picking and choosing. They want to sensationalize this. If I have some info from Q drivers about the darn plane I can pass that on and get them to at least present other possibilities and that it may very well not be a pilot error. I have heard the Deice can malfunction on approach or lose pressure at low rpm. Did that happen? We won't know until the NTSB can get into it. However, by then these poor pilots will have already been found guilty in the public eye and media. THAT is sooooo wrong it makes me sick and don't want that to happen.

Maybe if you were more forthcoming and tell us all who you are, you may get more help on this.

You claim to be a member since 2002 but you have only made 1 post in 7 years until this BUF accident. Why the FI hiatus till now? What's your interest in this accident? Do you still fly for Ameriflight?
 

flynryan15

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Either you have very bad grammar or you have no idea what you are trying to ask. Which leads me to believe that you are not a pilot. .....

After years on this board I have to disagree. His bad grammar proves he is a pilot!!! :laugh: :D
 

Icywings

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yea my grammar sucks. I'll give you all that..lol

I was a Metroliner driver for Ameriflight up through 9-11. After 9-11 I couldn't compete with the flight time the senior guys getting laid off had and couldn't get hired. I got a later start then normal as a pilot so by the time I could get hired and looking at the future of the industry and retirement I SADLY decided I couldn't make a long term legit career out of it to where I could support my family with enough income. So, I turned it into a hobby. I have been a member here since 2002 as it says. In fact, I need to update the hours on there. I didn't realize it until a few minutes ago.
 

ultrarunner

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as many as I can until I get until someone stops dicking with me and will just answer me. Can you please post on the http://www.airlinepilotforums.com that I am a member here since 2002 pls? They keep thinking I am new and with the media because of my screen name.


If I recall correctly, it is FAR Part 25 requirement that a 'trim-in-motion' clacker be installed. However, in some part-25 aircraft, this clacker is inhibited in some configurations, namely with flaps extended. But not in ALL planes.

And in some cases in may be related to weather or not the aircraft has a visual trim-in-motion wheel.

Go take a look at Part-25. It's an easy search on the net.

Ultra
 
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Icywings

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If I recall correctly, it is FAR Part 25 requirement that a 'trim-in-motion' clacker be installed. However, in some part-25 aircraft, this clacker is inhibited in some configurations, namely with flaps extended. But not in ALL planes.

And in some cases in may be related to weather or not the aircraft has a visual trim-in-motion wheel.

Go take a look at Part-25. It's an easy search on the net.

Ultra

Thank you! The 767 does not have any audible indication but others do. I am trying to find out if the Dash 8 has one. Thank you for the reply though!
 

Raskal

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If I recall correctly, it is FAR Part 25 requirement that a 'trim-in-motion' clacker be installed. However, in some part-25 aircraft, this clacker is inhibited in some configurations, namely with flaps extended. But not in ALL planes.

And in some cases in may be related to weather or not the aircraft has a visual trim-in-motion wheel.

Go take a look at Part-25. It's an easy search on the net.

Ultra

I don't think it has to be a clacker, a light or efis indication also meets the requirements if I remember right-I'm too lazy to actually look it up.
 

Axel

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Dude-

It doesn't matter what you tell the media. The more responsible among them will misreport it through ignorance of the subject matter, the blood suckers will rape the context and twist it into an unrecognizable shape that gets them ratings. Neither will report it accurately.

As was stated above, the best thing you can do is tell your contacts that if they have any interest at all in the integrity of their profession they will read and/or print verbatim, without opinion, what is released by the NTSB in their press releases and news conferences. Nothing more, nothing less.
 

Icywings

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Dude-

It doesn't matter what you tell the media. The more responsible among them will misreport it through ignorance of the subject matter, the blood suckers will rape the context and twist it into an unrecognizable shape that gets them ratings. Neither will report it accurately.

As was stated above, the best thing you can do is tell your contacts that if they have any interest at all in the integrity of their profession they will read and/or print verbatim, without opinion, what is released by the NTSB in their press releases and news conferences. Nothing more, nothing less.

I do have the ear of the producers. They can get it right if I can get them the right info. They are reporting what is said just not all of it. I agree they need to do it.
 

BirdCatcher

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I do have the ear of the producers. They can get it right if I can get them the right info. They are reporting what is said just not all of it. I agree they need to do it.

Well then tell them to just report the news, and stop making it. Read the NTSB briefing from a teleprompter, how hard is that?
 

Axel

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That is exactly my point. Tell the producers that the only people who have all the right information is the NTSB. Tell them that if they report verbatim what the NTSB releases - nothing more, nothing less - they will have accurately reported all the facts that are known at that time.

If they need to explain what stick pusher is, have a professional pilot, qualified in type, as their expert; not the first private pilot Cessna owner they can grab off the street muddying up the water in the name of 15 minutes fame.

In short, tell your producer friends to report responsibly.

That's all the help you are going to get from me. I am not qualified on a Dash 8, and I am not NTSB. I have nothing further to offer.
 
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