Ta reached at 9e

[big shacks]

Venting..sorry

 

[Kaman]

If I where you XJ pilots in that situation you mentioned, I'd be bringing a suit against ALPA for not doing due diligence in vetting our contract, accepting the infamous 11-09 training award and the integrated list.
I also feel awful for all our employees being affected by this mess, and feel very disillusioned by this industry. ABSOLUTELY great people by and large...I am out though as soon as I can.

 

[Flyer1015]

1000 pilots? Try less than 800.

How? 800 for 81 planes means 4.94 crew ratio.

 

[drinksonme]

I would just say f it...buy a fishing pole and call it a day on aviation for now. Life is too short to be a pawn for rich men to play with. I get some need money, health insurance, etc, but at what cost. There is always an alternative if you just look. Good luck to all involved, I am sure all of us at the regional level will be in your shoes soon. Sorry you are 1 of many at the spearhead.

 

[Flyer1015]

This sounds too much like Comair. Comair went from 100+ airplanes to 88 airplanes, to 44 planes, then 0. Right now, Pinnacle sounds like they are at the 81 airplane stage. In 2014, what's to stop them from announing losing the 40 CRJ-900s to [insert another DCI regional carrier], leaving just 41 CRJ-900s. Then some time after, pull a Comair.


Assuming Pinnacle survives, the end state of 91 CRJ-900s will have a huge consequence for the remaining Pinnacle pilots. With all CRJ-200s gone, the quotas on that fleet end. The only remaining quota will be 279 CRJ-900 Captains have to be Mesaba and 95 have to be Pinnacle. Then straight seniority. Mesaba will populate the CRJ-900 fleet left seats with that ratio. When is the quota over? 5 years? What would that date be, sometime in 2015?

 

[OttoPilot]

I think they were allowed. Not certain, though. I think they were just offered a class, with no interview to ask about college. It was a great deal. One Compass Capt was a previous DL Capt that took the early out lump sum retirement before the BK. Now he gets to go back again.


Bye Bye---General Lee

Incorrect. No degree, No flow!

 

[bri5150]

Incorrect. No degree, No flow!

I believe Compass had different language in flow so they were able to flow with no degree. Mesaba pilots needed 4 year degree. I know Mesaba needed degree because I went back to school specifically for that reason...and now I am just getting it done to get it done.

 

[WMUSIGPI]

Was the 4 year college degree required for flow-throughs? If they didn't have the 4 year degree were they prevented from flowing up ?

Anyone flowing had to meet minimums from the street (and be a current captain) If somehow (basically only missing part correctable would be the degree) they weren't "qualified" they retained the rights to flow until becoming elligible. I don't think anyone fell into that issue, they either could and did go or they bid not to go reguardless of the degree. I do think one or two had medical issues that allowed them to keep rights even though the flow passed them.

 

[Data]

So does this mean Delta is not going to merge the seniority list with PCL?

 

[ex j-41]

It looks to me that delta knows the TA will not pass. How can it get a 51% yes vote if 60% or more are going to be losing their jobs. So Delta is just planning on putting the airplanes at GoJerks. I see a 2% chance of 9e surviving this deal. Looks like this is Deltas way of ending the pilot shortage.

 

[Nevets]

So with 140 crj200s gone, another 66 from Skywest/ASA, and some from Comair, how many total does that make? And how many is DAL needing to get rid of?

 

[777_Jackpot]

How? 800 for 81 planes means 4.94 crew ratio.

I would think that ratio is probably pretty accurate. I would be interested in hearing how the 1000 - 1400 number is being generated.

 

[e=mc2]

Another Crowning achievement for ALPO, 2,000+ pilots on the street. What did Colgan Maslab bring to your table, ah, ah, nothing but costs. So now will those who renter the pilot world remember the help to unemployment ALPO gave them, not likely.

Besides when this is voted down the company and union will go to the judge and say, see we tried, these guys just will not work with us and they will get whatever they want.

This is what happens whenyou mix greedy incompetent managers with short sighted entitlement pilots.

Enjoy the future boys, sure you have learned nothing.

 

[wms]

End state of Pinnacle will be 81 CRJ900's. All 140 200's will leave between summer 2013 and early 2015. The 40 New 900's begin arriving next fall.

The big question is how do you get a majority of the 2400 pilots to ratify something that will eliminate all but around 1000 jobs?

Carrot. Dal orders forty and promises them to peanucle if they play nice. Then gets another operator to lower its CPA to take them away.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

This is just the flip side of the coin. A few years from now the company will do the same act that they did in post 9/11. They will furlough and recreate the regional business. This cycle will continue ad nauseum. Why? Because pilots are not very bright and will always think that it cannot happen to them, even when presented with the recent past history.
Robert Crandall did a video posted on Vimeo, in the first video he explains that "there is no price too high to prevent a pilot strike" and what we are all experiencing is the by product of that realization.
Filthy corporate execs will run us into bankruptcy and unemployment without a thought to insure maximum profits.
Congratulations, we are all living the dream.....

 

[SoberIrishman]

So with 140 crj200s gone, another 66 from Skywest/ASA, and some from Comair, how many total does that make? And how many is DAL needing to get rid of?

And you guys at LXJT should perhaps pause and think about where your hard nosed attitude in our current JCBA negotiations might lead us all.
LXJET pilots need to wise up, and come together to get this contract done before we suffer the same fate as PCL.
Don't expect to achieve too much either this time around.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

 

[Nevets]

And you guys at LXJT should perhaps pause and think about where your hard nosed attitude in our current JCBA negotiations might lead us all.
LXJET pilots need to wise up, and come together to get this contract done before we suffer the same fate as PCL.
Don't expect to achieve too much either this time around.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

Nice, you didn't even answer the question. So, would you like us on the ERJ side to take concessions just to get a contract? What are you willing to give up? Flightline? Vacation low? Dual qual? Otherwise you may end up like PNCL!

I've got plan B and working on plan C. Perhaps you should do the same instead of using fear tactics on others in order to get what you want.

 

[SoberIrishman]

Nice, you didn't even answer the question. So, would you like us on the ERJ side to take concessions just to get a contract? What are you willing to give up? Flightline? Vacation low? Dual qual? Otherwise you may end up like PNCL!

I've got plan B and working on plan C. Perhaps you should do the same instead of using fear tactics on others in order to get what you want.

You guys at LXJT are simply nutcases. What on earth is wrong with you all? You just don't get it at all. There is no way that you will have to take a concessionary contract, if you apply sensible and realistic gioals, but you can't expect the moon and stars at this time. You seem to want to ruin this airline. YOU were purchased by SKYW and lucky for you that it was. Otherwise you were going down. GET IT? OUT OF BUSINESS EVENTUALLY! This is what you will do to us all if you keep up this nonsense. I SIMPLY CANNOT BELIEVE THAT GROWN ADULTS CAN BE SO DUMB. We even keep telling you that our PBS is just fine, yet you lot want to introduce a globalized one. WTF?????

My preference would be to keep you lot separate, let you all negotiate away to your heart's content, and leave the sensible part of the pilot force, namely the ASA side to move on without you. I think taking on XJT and merging with ASA was a very bad deal, and I know most of my ASA colleagues are fed up with your ignorant rants.

You are so shortsighted and ignorant of the regional industry econiomics right now it is unbelievable.

Keep working on all your great plans, maybe when you get to plan Z we will eventually see the back of you.

 

[Nevets]

You guys at LXJT are simply nutcases. What on earth is wrong with you all? You just don't get it at all. There is no way that you will have to take a concessionary contract, if you apply sensible and realistic gioals, but you can't expect the moon and stars at this time. You seem to want to ruin this airline. YOU were purchased by SKYW and lucky for you that it was. Otherwise you were going down. GET IT? OUT OF BUSINESS EVENTUALLY! This is what you will do to us all if you keep up this nonsense. I SIMPLY CANNOT BELIEVE THAT GROWN ADULTS CAN BE SO DUMB. We even keep telling you that our PBS is just fine, yet you lot want to introduce a globalized one. WTF?????

My preference would be to keep you lot separate, let you all negotiate away to your heart's content, and leave the sensible part of the pilot force, namely the ASA side to move on without you. I think taking on XJT and merging with ASA was a very bad deal, and I know most of my ASA colleagues are fed up with your ignorant rants.

You are so shortsighted and ignorant of the regional industry econiomics right now it is unbelievable.

Keep working on all your great plans, maybe when you get to plan Z we will eventually see the back of you.

If we don't take a concessions in a new contract then that's fine with me. But if the overall contract is worse than the current one, then I will vote no. I'm just one vote and one voice. You have nothing to worry about though. It's status quo for us over here. If we weren't bought by SKW them we were going out of business. If we stay separate from you guys because we won't take a concessionary contract, then the ERJ side goes out of business. So what's the difference? That's why I have plan B and working on C. And one of those is being out of aviation altogether. I rather not do that but I don't want to do what I'm doing for less either. If the economics don't work for me, at least i have options. What's wrong with that?

 

[General Lee]

This may not help, but on the Majors section on UAL hiring, a LCAL MEC member said UAL will start hiring 72 pilots per month, indefinitely. Some may want to eventually end up at DL, some may not care. If you are at the beginning of a hiring wave, your life can be sweet. First year pay may be tough, but QOL over a couple years will increase quickly, and the pay will be there eventually. I know DL says no hiring through 2013, but when it does open, it will be similar.


For any of you 9e guys who are considering leaving, get an app out to UAL now! I think the new contract is a lot better than their previous one, new hire insurance is finally included, and advancement due to retirement is almost a sure thing. Go for it, and good luck!


Bye Bye---General Lee