SWA to England?

[TurboS7]

Using the Boeing BLT you should be able to go ISP to LGW non-stop on a good day with ETOPS reserves. If not a quick tech stop at YQX would do the trick. You might have to limit your pax to 110 during the summer but would be able to do a full load in the winter. It is not as far as you would think. Flight time comes to just over 6.0 hours with an averge 80 knot tailwind.

 

[bustinmins]

Very true.

Someone will still be needed to play with the joystick as it cruises across the country.

I am sure that position will pay just as good!!!

 

[igneousy2]

I don't know general...your credibility is all but gone from me...on the one hand you bash swa for going to lbb...and then you come out "we get to go to Lagos!"

Sounds exciting!

I think I'd rather endure lbb than risk getting some still unknown monkey flu in lagos.

As far as JB poison pill... here is rule number one when listening to lawyers...

1. never believe a lawyer who tells you something relating to a contract is "black and white" or "iron clad" it NEVER is.

Additionally, if the lawyers are telling you your only recourse will be to strike...that doesn't sound like such a great deal to me as IF you are RELEASED for a strike (even though you are non-union you are still part of the RLA dungeon) it may very well be what DAL or whoever buys you WANTS anyway...go ahead and strike...we'll just fire you and hire replacements...we only wanted your airline for the JFK slots and gates ANYWAY. self-help is a two way street.

Also it doesn't smell right to me. It sounds like there is punitive language in "the contract" which is NOT ENFORCEABLE. Any kind of penalty inflicted must past a reasonableness test as far as that any "penalty" imposed must reimburse the other party but cannot be punitive in nature. For example, if you back out of an apartment lease...you are liable to pay rent on the apartment for the duration of the lease, however, your landlord must make a good faith effort to find a new tenant, when he does, your obligation to pay the lease going forward would end. You would have to be able to show that you were actually harmed by whatever scheme was imposed on you. Usually only monetary damages are considered by the courts, judges don't understand captain vs. first officer or bidding number one vs. bidding number 100. Because JB has a lower pay scale then Delta's (most of Deltas FO's make more than any of JB's pilots) and the fact that you will probably be seat protected in any merger scheme it will hard to show any actual monetary loss. If you don't believe me ask the 3,000 TWA pilots that got stapled to the bottom of AA's list about this very argument.

The other question I have is who are the "parties" to this contract. Is this something that each individual pilot signs with the company. If it isn't, since there is no entity that represent the pilots (i.e. a union) then there is no "contract" it is merely a policy that whomever controls the company can change pretty much at there will.

My other question would be what the quid-pro-quo (this for that) was. For a contract to be enforceable, both parties must do or give up something in exchange for something else. For example, if I sign a letter saying that I will give you 1.0 million dollars on May 5 and I don't, it doesn't matter, you will not be able to get the money unless you can show that you gave up something in exchange for the 1.0 million dollars. Without the quid-pro-quo it is merely a "promise" which is not enforceable in a court of law. What did JB pilots do or give up in order to justify this contract language.

Anyway, please don't take this as a slam it is not. I am merely putting information out there so the pilots at JB can do there own research and ask some questions when the lawyers start spewing words like "black and white" and "iron clad"

later

 

[General Lee]

I don't know general...your credibility is all but gone from me...on the one hand you bash swa for going to lbb...and then you come out "we get to go to Lagos!"

Sounds exciting!

I think I'd rather endure lbb than risk getting some still unknown monkey flu in lagos.

As far as JB poison pill... here is rule number one when listening to lawyers...

1. never believe a lawyer who tells you something relating to a contract is "black and white" or "iron clad" it NEVER is.

Additionally, if the lawyers are telling you your only recourse will be to strike...that doesn't sound like such a great deal to me as IF you are RELEASED for a strike (even though you are non-union you are still part of the RLA dungeon) it may very well be what DAL or whoever buys you WANTS anyway...go ahead and strike...we'll just fire you and hire replacements...we only wanted your airline for the JFK slots and gates ANYWAY. self-help is a two way street.

Also it doesn't smell right to me. It sounds like there is punitive language in "the contract" which is NOT ENFORCEABLE. Any kind of penalty inflicted must past a reasonableness test as far as that any "penalty" imposed must reimburse the other party but cannot be punitive in nature. For example, if you back out of an apartment lease...you are liable to pay rent on the apartment for the duration of the lease, however, your landlord must make a good faith effort to find a new tenant, when he does, your obligation to pay the lease going forward would end. You would have to be able to show that you were actually harmed by whatever scheme was imposed on you. Usually only monetary damages are considered by the courts, judges don't understand captain vs. first officer or bidding number one vs. bidding number 100. Because JB has a lower pay scale then Delta's (most of Deltas FO's make more than any of JB's pilots) and the fact that you will probably be seat protected in any merger scheme it will hard to show any actual monetary loss. If you don't believe me ask the 3,000 TWA pilots that got stapled to the bottom of AA's list about this very argument.

The other question I have is who are the "parties" to this contract. Is this something that each individual pilot signs with the company. If it isn't, since there is no entity that represent the pilots (i.e. a union) then there is no "contract" it is merely a policy that whomever controls the company can change pretty much at there will.

My other question would be what the quid-pro-quo (this for that) was. For a contract to be enforceable, both parties must do or give up something in exchange for something else. For example, if I sign a letter saying that I will give you 1.0 million dollars on May 5 and I don't, it doesn't matter, you will not be able to get the money unless you can show that you gave up something in exchange for the 1.0 million dollars. Without the quid-pro-quo it is merely a "promise" which is not enforceable in a court of law. What did JB pilots do or give up in order to justify this contract language.

Anyway, please don't take this as a slam it is not. I am merely putting information out there so the pilots at JB can do there own research and ask some questions when the lawyers start spewing words like "black and white" and "iron clad"

later

First of all, I don't really want to go to Lagos, but I will go anywhere once (I went to LBB once, hated it). And, as far as what COULD happen if Delta or anyone else wanted to buy JB, that is questionable. Who knows? But, if the lawyers through in there "every JB employee would get $5 million in quarters if someone bought us"---do you think it would float? I have a feeling that would be taken out of any final agreement, and if JB doesn't have ALPA, it might be tough to get a merged seniority list. Throw in there that most of DL is non union, and the fact that management would want to save face with those employees first, by probably stapling the JB employees below them. ("see, we protected you.....") Who knows, again?

And, me losing credibility in your eyes is not that important to me. I come on here ready to debate, and try to bring up logical discussions, with a bit of entertainment thrown in for me. I like to debate aviation issues. This is not a popularity contest, and I do it for enjoyment reasons. I hope you understand. I am not out to slam every company, well, except Comair and sometimes SkyWest. Take care.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Aubie]

SWA flies to LBB? Man I didn't know that. I've been here 2 1/2 years and never had an overnight or even flown in there.

Good thing I have the general to tell me how bad my quality of life is here at SWA, because boy have I been fooled. Maybe it's all the cash...

 

[canyonblue]

Good thing I have the general to tell me how bad my quality of life is here at SWA, because boy have I been fooled.

Must be his favorite song................

"Misery loves company
Won't you share what's inside of me
Misery loves company
Won't you share my misery
Misery loves company
Won't you share what's inside
Misery loves company
Won't you share my misery
Misery loves company
Step inside, that's what you'll see
Misery loves company, oh yeah"

 

[HalinTexas]

Using the Boeing BLT you should be able to go ISP to LGW non-stop on a good day with ETOPS reserves. If not a quick tech stop at YQX would do the trick. You might have to limit your pax to 110 during the summer but would be able to do a full load in the winter. It is not as far as you would think. Flight time comes to just over 6.0 hours with an averge 80 knot tailwind.

Did you include the fact that you have to run the APU the entire time you're over water? Might effect your fuel calculations.

Next. 110 pax won't ever make money on that route in a B737.

 

[General Lee]

SWA flies to LBB? Man I didn't know that. I've been here 2 1/2 years and never had an overnight or even flown in there.

Good thing I have the general to tell me how bad my quality of life is here at SWA, because boy have I been fooled. Maybe it's all the cash...

If you are based in BWI, you may never go there. If you are based in DAL, you may go there once a week (oh, that would be horrible). A MDW based pilot stated he saw 16 trips with LBB layovers this month. Maybe next month he will get some AMA or MAF layovers---what fun!

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Must be his favorite song................

"Misery loves company
Won't you share what's inside of me
Misery loves company
Won't you share my misery
Misery loves company
Won't you share what's inside
Misery loves company
Won't you share my misery
Misery loves company
Step inside, that's what you'll see
Misery loves company, oh yeah"

I really enjoy my job, and one of the reasons is that I don't ever, ever have to go back to LBB again. I enjoy my San Juan and St Thomas turns. If I need a layover, I try to get SAN or SEA. This summer I will try to get Anchorage layovers. When I finally go over to the INTL side, I will get Venice or Nice. Those trips are more like a mini-vacation. You know (well, maybe you don't) what they say about INTL flying? It is a first class buffet (yes, we get first class meals--in the contract) on the way over to happy hour. See ya. You need to enjoy---DAL--LBB--ABQ--PHX--LAS--BOI--PDX tomorrow.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[canyonblue]

I really enjoy my job.............

Bye Bye--General Lee

One day you may really enjoy a wife and kids, I don't believe you have a family now. On the other hand, if you are married with kid's the what the hell is 8,605 post on FI about?

 

[General Lee]

One day you may really enjoy a wife and kids, I don't believe you have a family now. On the other hand, if you are married with kid's the what the hell is 8,605 post on FI about?

I don't have kids yet, but my wife is in her early 30s (she says "maybe" in a few years) and does very well at her job, making her the bread winner by far. She and I do travel when her schedule allows it. I enjoy flightinfo for the debate and banter, and I also think SWA is a good job, just not the job and routes I would want to have or fly. The pay, on the other hand, is great. Have a good one, and don't get too teed off about my LBB rants. I just really don't want to go there again. You may not want to go to Europe on 10 hour flights, just like I don't want more than 2 legs a day max.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Skybus]

I really enjoy my job, and one of the reasons is that I don't ever, ever have to go back to LBB again. I enjoy my San Juan and St Thomas turns. If I need a layover, I try to get SAN or SEA. This summer I will try to get Anchorage layovers. When I finally go over to the INTL side, I will get Venice or Nice. Those trips are more like a mini-vacation. You know (well, maybe you don't) what they say about INTL flying? It is a first class buffet (yes, we get first class meals--in the contract) on the way over to happy hour. See ya. You need to enjoy---DAL--LBB--ABQ--PHX--LAS--BOI--PDX tomorrow.


Bye Bye--General Lee

DUDE

When you do grow up to the int. side and sow your oats for awhile you WILL discover its a friggin airport and a hotel. Been there done that. The days of the "mini vacations" are long gone. Week in Hong Kong, 5 days in Paris done it. Just keep telling yourself its al worth it now considering your HUGE pay cuts. Have you seen the prices in Europe these days? Have to be a pre Bankruptcy Delta Captain to afford such things.

 

[General Lee]

DUDE

When you do grow up to the int. side and sow your oats for awhile you WILL discover its a friggin airport and a hotel. Been there done that. The days of the "mini vacations" are long gone. Week in Hong Kong, 5 days in Paris done it. Just keep telling yourself its al worth it now considering your HUGE pay cuts. Have you seen the prices in Europe these days? Have to be a pre Bankruptcy Delta Captain to afford such things.

Sure it is expensive. Thank gawd my wife does great at her job. And, I enjoy the job still after BK and 11 years at this place, so I think I will find some fun things to do when I go over to the INTL side. I still enjoy the DOM side right now. Thanks Dad, thanks for seeing it all and becoming jaded. You need to quit.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Aubie]

General,

Just so ya know, I have actually been a MDW-based pilot for a couple years now; never even flown into LBB. LBB isn't the point (it's Texas so I'm sure they're great folks down there). But thanks for illuminating me on how things are at my OWN company.

The point is, if you are going to speak so authoritatively about MY company, you should go to the trouble to get the facts straight (beyond just regurgitating some story you heard from a buddy who knows a guy who has a neighbor that flew for SWA ten years ago.) I don't work for Delta but I like the company and always have. I wish you guys the best. But I would never try to talk authoritatively about delta just based on rumors I hear or threads I read. That would be ignorant and stupid.

I read what you write about SWA and it makes me laugh because it's so off the mark. Not that it matters, really. maybe you're even doing us a favor putting out all the bad gouge.

 

[General Lee]

General,

Just so ya know, I have actually been a MDW-based pilot for a couple years now; never even flown into LBB. LBB isn't the point (it's Texas so I'm sure they're great folks down there). But thanks for illuminating me on how things are at my OWN company.

The point is, if you are going to speak so authoritatively about MY company, you should go to the trouble to get the facts straight (beyond just regurgitating some story you heard from a buddy who knows a guy who has a neighbor that flew for SWA ten years ago.) I don't work for Delta but I like the company and always have. I wish you guys the best. But I would never try to talk authoritatively about delta just based on rumors I hear or threads I read. That would be ignorant and stupid.

I read what you write about SWA and it makes me laugh because it's so off the mark. Not that it matters, really. maybe you're even doing us a favor putting out all the bad gouge.

Really? So, I don't have any friends that fly for SWA? Really? You are wrong. I can give you exact pairings (not the numbers to give away the people---can't do that) and rotation lengths and routes. My friends say they are tired and don't know if they can handle 5 leg days and 25 min turns for another 20 or more years. Why would I lie about that? Your flying isn't desired by everyone. Get that in your head. Sure, your company is well run and makes a lot of money, and so can you. Great. Not everyone wants to be a corndog. My friends hit the nail on the head, you work really hard. After a long transcon, it is NOT over most of the time. You have atleast one more leg to go, and exhaustion sets in. We make less right now, but that can change, just like when we were making a lot more than you (and helped you set your new rates, thank you very much---you're welcome). Back in the late 90's you had 737 Captains leaving for UAL---true fact, and they were then furloughed. Your company is great now, and you have great pay for what you fly. But, don't tell me I don't know what it is like for you---we all know people who actually do it. Enjoy the 1 2 3 rule and your high pay. I will enjoy my flying, and I really don't have to go to LBB. You could. And a SWA FO I met really did say "they work us like dogs." No joke. Some people don't want to fly like that.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[vixin]

You are one lonely pathetic little boy General. I do feel sorry for you.

 

[Aubie]

Work like a dog? Are you crazy? You still insist you know the situation at my company better than I do as an employee. Simply amazing.

Maybe you're just incredibly lazy and have an unbelievably poor work ethic. I don't know. But if this work is "hard" and thay are "working me to death" than I would hate to see a real job. I "work" like 12 days a week and it's pretty much all fun and games. I don't know who you're hanging around but keep up spreading the bad gouge - I guess it'll scare away people with your concept of what "hard work" is.

Wow. You actually DEFEND your position of thinking you know a company better than its own employees. Amazing. These guys are right - you ARE crazy.

 

[General Lee]

You are one lonely pathetic little boy General. I do feel sorry for you.

You don't have to, I really enjoy my life. I enjoy my wife, my job, and this board. All is peachy keen. Quit feeling sorry for something that is actually fun and good. Have a great one.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Work like a dog? Are you crazy? You still insist you know the situation at my company better than I do as an employee. Simply amazing.

Maybe you're just incredibly lazy and have an unbelievably poor work ethic. I don't know. But if this work is "hard" and thay are "working me to death" than I would hate to see a real job. I "work" like 12 days a week and it's pretty much all fun and games. I don't know who you're hanging around but keep up spreading the bad gouge - I guess it'll scare away people with your concept of what "hard work" is.

Wow. You actually DEFEND your position of thinking you know a company better than its own employees. Amazing. These guys are right - you ARE crazy.

Okay....I talk to people often who work there too. They must be lying to me. Yeah, that's the ticket.....

You may LUV doing 5 or 6 legs a day now, but in a few years that really will wear off. It will. The joy of doing LAS--PHX--ABQ--HOU--MSY--BHM in one day will go away. (do you deny trips like that exist? Liar.) You will dream of one leg days, or maybe a 30 hour layover somewhere nice. Oh wait, you have a family and you want to see them more.....Your family never get's on your nerves? Riiiiiiiight. You don't wish for a little more sleep somewhere tropical or somewhere where things are waiting for you to explore outside your doorstep? Our Paris (FRANCE, not TEXAS) layovers are wonderful, with the Louvre nearby and other interesting museums and restaurants with interesting food and drink. Oh wait, you could do that on your own time---on your own DIME.

I am sure your company can be fun, but most of your schedules are exhausting, and I know enough SWA people to say that. To say that your "good hard working schedules" aren't productive is one thing, they are, but they are also exhausting or will be for you in 10 years. Enjoy that. I will be enjoying INTL flying, or maybe I will be back to domestic and fly 2 or maybe even 3 legs a day. Ouch.

Your company is great, but not everyone wants your schedules. Nah. And they aren't a secret---someone besides you knows what the average trip at SWA is all about. Fun for a couple years I am sure...


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Aubie]

Again.......... I guess you're right. I don't know what I'm talking about. My lines bear nothing in common with what you describe.. Sure those lines exist, particulrly out of DAL. But in 2 1/2 years I have had pratically NO days like you keep arguing we have everyday. No crap that would be exhausting. The only factual thing you said that's true across the board is our 25 - min turns. Personally I hate wasting time and would rather get my flying done efficiently then go home, but hey - that's just me. Sitting around waiting through an incredibly slow boarding process isn't me cup of tea.

But I'm wasting my time and will stop. You amazingly feel you know every detail about other people's situations better than those who are actually experiencing them. Amazing..... I don't judge your situation by the 9-yr Delta guy who quit you guys to come here and tells me how much better he loves it, I know that's just ONE guy. Every situation is different. If you love your job so much that's GREAT. Good for you.

Adios amigo.

 

[General Lee]

Again.......... I guess you're right. I don't know what I'm talking about. My lines bear nothing in common with what you describe.. Sure those lines exist, particulrly out of DAL. But in 2 1/2 years I have had pratically NO days like you keep arguing we have everyday. No crap that would be exhausting. The only factual thing you said that's true across the board is our 25 - min turns. Personally I hate wasting time and would rather get my flying done efficiently then go home, but hey - that's just me. Sitting around waiting through an incredibly slow boarding process isn't me cup of tea.

But I'm wasting my time and will stop. You amazingly feel you know every detail about other people's situations better than those who are actually experiencing them. Amazing..... I don't judge your situation by the 9-yr Delta guy who quit you guys to come here and tells me how much better he loves it, I know that's just ONE guy. Every situation is different. If you love your job so much that's GREAT. Good for you.

Adios amigo.

Hey, don't get too mad at me. I was just stating that not everyone wants your average schedules. You do work harder than most, and are more productive. That can be good and bad. Enjoy that high pay, that is one of many good things about your company. And, your stews are fun.

Later gator.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[vixin]

Hey GL the average is like 2.87 legs per day. I have also never had the days you mention. You are a real tool. I know enough people at the shrine delta and they hate the job and company. Yup working hard is a problem for some people. I now understand your lazy. But 12 days a month 2,3 maybe once in awhile 4 legs in a day wont kill me. Oh yeh and I havent spent the night in LBB, go figure. Your friends at SWA must like to work like that, because it is there choice. The lines do exist, but you make it sound like it is half the company. None of my (actual, unlike your make believe ones) buds that are with SWA fly the lines you mention. HMMM we sure must be lucky.

 

[Quimby]

Okay....I talk to people often who work there too. They must be lying to me. Yeah, that's the ticket.....

You may LUV doing 5 or 6 legs a day now, but in a few years that really will wear off. It will. The joy of doing LAS--PHX--ABQ--HOU--MSY--BHM in one day will go away. (do you deny trips like that exist? Liar.) You will dream of one leg days, or maybe a 30 hour layover somewhere nice. Oh wait, you have a family and you want to see them more.....Your family never get's on your nerves? Riiiiiiiight. You don't wish for a little more sleep somewhere tropical or somewhere where things are waiting for you to explore outside your doorstep? Our Paris (FRANCE, not TEXAS) layovers are wonderful, with the Louvre nearby and other interesting museums and restaurants with interesting food and drink. Oh wait, you could do that on your own time---on your own DIME.

I am sure your company can be fun, but most of your schedules are exhausting, and I know enough SWA people to say that. To say that your "good hard working schedules" aren't productive is one thing, they are, but they are also exhausting or will be for you in 10 years. Enjoy that. I will be enjoying INTL flying, or maybe I will be back to domestic and fly 2 or maybe even 3 legs a day. Ouch.

Your company is great, but not everyone wants your schedules. Nah. And they aren't a secret---someone besides you knows what the average trip at SWA is all about. Fun for a couple years I am sure...


Bye Bye--General Lee

Are your buddies that are so sick & tired of working at SWA applying to DL now that you're hiring?




didn't think so.

 

[Flycatcher99]

Really?

Okay....I talk to people often who work there too. They must be lying to me. Yeah, that's the ticket.....

You may LUV doing 5 or 6 legs a day now, but in a few years that really will wear off. It will. The joy of doing LAS--PHX--ABQ--HOU--MSY--BHM in one day will go away. (do you deny trips like that exist? Liar.) You will dream of one leg days, or maybe a 30 hour layover somewhere nice. Oh wait, you have a family and you want to see them more.....Your family never get's on your nerves? Riiiiiiiight. You don't wish for a little more sleep somewhere tropical or somewhere where things are waiting for you to explore outside your doorstep? Our Paris (FRANCE, not TEXAS) layovers are wonderful, with the Louvre nearby and other interesting museums and restaurants with interesting food and drink. Oh wait, you could do that on your own time---on your own DIME.

I am sure your company can be fun, but most of your schedules are exhausting, and I know enough SWA people to say that. To say that your "good hard working schedules" aren't productive is one thing, they are, but they are also exhausting or will be for you in 10 years. Enjoy that. I will be enjoying INTL flying, or maybe I will be back to domestic and fly 2 or maybe even 3 legs a day. Ouch.

Your company is great, but not everyone wants your schedules. Nah. And they aren't a secret---someone besides you knows what the average trip at SWA is all about. Fun for a couple years I am sure...


Bye Bye--General Lee

Your couple of anecdotal reports are pretty misleading. You don't see anyone here presuming to know your life and schedule based on a couple of Delta pilots' reports, reports that no one can confirm, reports that don't have a timeframe or any other particulars, reports that quite possibly are being embellished either by the source of the info or by someone who's heard the info.

If anyone is interested in the particulars of SWA schedules, I can attest that I rarely fly more than 4 legs in a day, and by rarely, I mean there are months that go by that it doesn't happen. I can also attest that many of my trips fly only two legs in a day, often a transcontinental flight or a flight up or down the eastern seaboard, and that I have indeed had days that consisted of only one leg.

I won't argue that our days and trips are often fairly dense, which is to say that we don't sit at the airport for an hour or more between flights. That means that when I'm on the road, I'm making money, not sitting and waiting to make more money. My schedule is 17-19 days off per month, typically 3 on and 4 off. I leave home on Thursday afternoon and am home by Saturday night. Not bad, eh?

 

[AV80R]

Maybe that’s why ATA recently reorganized and purchased World Airways? Now they own ATA, North American, and World, and of course SWA owns a big share in ATA so maybe the Open Sky agreement prompted SWA to plan for international flights?

Personally, I think Global Economy is great! – if SWA decides to get into international travel we’ll be able to proudly show off our “trailer-park travelers” all over the world! Wal-Marts of the world – UNITE!

Folks, lighten up, I am just joking….

Btw, I wouldn't be surprised if SkyBus decides to go after that market in the future, and of course Virgin America will code share with Virgin Atlantic, might be a pretty brilliant concept actually, fly on the “same” airline all the way – even though we all know Virgin America will NOT be controlled by Branson, riiiight?

 

[Saluki Dawg]

OK, I've got a 6 leg day on my next trip so there are days like that at this airline. I also fly out of TX, so that probably has something to do with it. I don't think that most of the pilot bases have 6 leg days very often with the exception of the DAL and HOU bases.

 

[BVT94]

I'm so tired of hearing how bad my schedule is...............I'm going to bed.

 

[General Lee]

Hey GL the average is like 2.87 legs per day. I have also never had the days you mention. You are a real tool. I know enough people at the shrine delta and they hate the job and company. Yup working hard is a problem for some people. I now understand your lazy. But 12 days a month 2,3 maybe once in awhile 4 legs in a day wont kill me. Oh yeh and I havent spent the night in LBB, go figure. Your friends at SWA must like to work like that, because it is there choice. The lines do exist, but you make it sound like it is half the company. None of my (actual, unlike your make believe ones) buds that are with SWA fly the lines you mention. HMMM we sure must be lucky.

Thanks for the "average" amount of legs per day--2.87....okay? Anyway, the average means the highs and lows mixed, so you really have a 4 day trip with 5 legs on the first day, a couple on the second and third (transcons plus one more dreaded flight that makes you puke), and then 5 the last day. Sounds about right. No thanks. And I am lazy? Huh? I tend to do two leg days (turns from ATL to San Juan or St Thomas, and back to ATL--7:45 per day) or maybe a 3 or 4 day with 2 legs max. If I see 3 legs, I try to avoid it, unless it is overtime pay. Does that mean I am lazy, or smart? And, my SWA friends are telling me the truth. I am sure there are some trips that have fewer legs, but those are probably tough to come by. Even a 3 leg day for you could be a killer---like ORF--LAS--SMF--PDX. That will cause extreme exhaustion for you, if not now, in 10 years. Sorry, not everyone wants to fly like that. If you do, great. Enjoy.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

Your couple of anecdotal reports are pretty misleading. You don't see anyone here presuming to know your life and schedule based on a couple of Delta pilots' reports, reports that no one can confirm, reports that don't have a timeframe or any other particulars, reports that quite possibly are being embellished either by the source of the info or by someone who's heard the info.

If anyone is interested in the particulars of SWA schedules, I can attest that I rarely fly more than 4 legs in a day, and by rarely, I mean there are months that go by that it doesn't happen. I can also attest that many of my trips fly only two legs in a day, often a transcontinental flight or a flight up or down the eastern seaboard, and that I have indeed had days that consisted of only one leg.

I won't argue that our days and trips are often fairly dense, which is to say that we don't sit at the airport for an hour or more between flights. That means that when I'm on the road, I'm making money, not sitting and waiting to make more money. My schedule is 17-19 days off per month, typically 3 on and 4 off. I leave home on Thursday afternoon and am home by Saturday night. Not bad, eh?

Sounds great. But, your trips are a lot more productive than ours, which means more flying. Do you always have 5 or 6 leg days? Probably not. Are your 3 leg days easy? I doubt it. You don't go LAS-PHX-LAX and call it quits, do you? No. You go OAK--PHX--BWI--MHT. That is tiring, and not everyone wants it that way. That is the point here. Sure, your pay is great, and I hope we get our 737 pay up to yours someday (actually, I hope the 777 goes that high). But, a lot of people on here extol SWA beyond belief, and think it is sacreligous to say anything bad or against the mighty SWA. I think a lot of people need to know about your schedules, so in 10 years when they are burned out from 25 minute turns (you do have those, right?) and MULTIPLE legs (is that better?) per day, they didn't ask themselves why they didn't look into a different option. I still think the majority of your flights can be fun with the fun stews, but even that can get on your nerves after awhile.

If you enjoy SWA, good for you. And, if you have that many days off without being exhausted a couple of those after you get home, then you must be Superman. High pay and lots of time off can be great, unless you are sleeping in 12 hours each day when you return.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[737lj]

General Lee = incompetence

Sounds great. But, your trips are a lot more productive than ours, which means more flying. Do you always have 5 or 6 leg days? Probably not. Are your 3 leg days easy? I doubt it. You don't go LAS-PHX-LAX and call it quits, do you? No. You go OAK--PHX--BWI--MHT. That is tiring, and not everyone wants it that way. That is the point here. Sure, your pay is great, and I hope we get our 737 pay up to yours someday (actually, I hope the 777 goes that high). But, a lot of people on here extol SWA beyond belief, and think it is sacreligous to say anything bad or against the mighty SWA. I think a lot of people need to know about your schedules, so in 10 years when they are burned out from 25 minute turns (you do have those, right?) and MULTIPLE legs (is that better?) per day, they didn't ask themselves why they didn't look into a different option. I still think the majority of your flights can be fun with the fun stews, but even that can get on your nerves after awhile.

If you enjoy SWA, good for you. And, if you have that many days off without being exhausted a couple of those after you get home, then you must be Superman. High pay and lots of time off can be great, unless you are sleeping in 12 hours each day when you return.


Bye Bye--General Lee

Here is what I'm doing when I go to work next time:

337 OAK 1500 LAX 1615 700 115 30
337 LAX 1645 MDW 2045 700 400 25
337 MDW 2110 IAD 2255 700 145 1910

895 IAD 1805 MDW 2000 700 155 30
895 MDW 2030 LAX 0050 700 420 1255

82 LAX 1345 PHL 1915 700 530 2115

77 PHL 1630 LAX 2230 700 600 30
77 LAX 2300 OAK 0010 700 110 0

This comes out to 2.0 legs per day. I wish that it paid more, but 30.5 hours of pay for a four day trip is a lot better than the best four day trip I flew at my two previous airlines. I'm yet to feel exhausted after flying a trip at SWA. Then again, I was civilian before I came to SWA, so that may have something to do with it.