SWA going against McCaskill Bond?

[Empennage]

So you are against a fair and equitable integration, because you fear it. You recognize that a third party nuetral wont let SWAPA steal seniority from the Airtran pilots. Got it. SWAPA's insecurity is transparent.:laugh:

SWAPA and SWA aren't giving the Airtran pilots anything, zero, zilch. If the Airtran pilots get pay parity it will only be because they demanded it. It will have nothing to do with anything Southwest pilots bring to the table.

The moment has passed sir. It was there during your last section 6. Since you as a group passed on parity and effective bargaining the new gains achieved by default (or on the backs of swapa negotiating/Swa profitability) are relevant. Thus it makes the windfall issue relevant.

 

[FDJ2]

The moment has passed sir. It was there during your last section 6. Since you as a group passed on parity and effective bargaining the new gains achieved by default (or on the backs of swapa negotiating/Swa profitability) are relevant. Thus it makes the windfall issue relevant.

Since SWAPA and SWA are in bed together denying pay parity, then it will be up to the Airtran pilots to demand it. SWAPA gets no credit, since they are a road block to parity. It's all upto to the Airtran pilots and SWAPA gets no credit for something they are not bringing to the table.

 

[FDJ2]

FDJ2,

You can try to come over as a non-union member if you like. Don't think that will work out as well. You see, our pay comes from a contract negotiated by SWAPA!

RF

Yep, and it will be up to the Airtran pilots to demand parity. SWAPA's not offering pay parity, neither is SWA. You get no credit for something you aren't bringing to the table. When the Airtran pilots get pay parity, it will be of their own doing, not SWAPA's.

 

[FDJ2]

Seems to me the A/T MEC just REJECTED pay parity, along with all the other benefits SWAPA pilots enjoy.

What has A/T ALPA done to earn that pay for its pilots?

Oh yeah, that 97% strike vote. Yup, those are exactly the kind of employees GK wants.

The Airtran MEC turned down pay parity with an unacceptable condition, an unfair seniority cram down.

Good for them. They'll ultimately get pay parity, but it will have zero to do with anything SWAPA is offering. SWAPA can no longer claim an economic windfall for the Airtran pilots in the list integration.

 

[Empennage]

Since SWAPA and SWA are in bed together denying pay parity, then it will be up to the Airtran pilots to demand it. SWAPA gets no credit, since they are a road block to parity. It's all upto to the Airtran pilots and SWAPA gets no credit for something they are not bringing to the table.

Let's try this again.

Pay parity could have and probably should have been negotiated. That tine was during your previous section 6 between airtran alpa and airtran airways.

 

[PBRstreetgang]

It seems,
GK, bought a basket of trouble. His problem started when he interjected himself into the integration process. I will guess this will go long and deep if he withers away the tranny operation, and who will win, will be the lawyers.the Frontier comparison doesn't hold water, Pottery Barn rules, he hadn't bought it, so his hands weren't on Frontier. AT is a different story, bought put in the bag and walking to the car when he dropped the bag. He will be arguing a case in front of Obama appointees. The case wouldn't be about integration, it would be about the big bad company that bought a small home town airline and went Frank Lorenzo all over it.
My bet is he will back out of muscling the integration process and allow it to go to arbitration and wait and see, to do otherwise would have too much liability.
Culture is one thing, cash is another.
PBR

 

[scoreboardII]

SWAPA can no longer claim an economic windfall for the Airtran pilots in the list integration.

Exactly!

Yet, a list was agreed upon, so thats the starting point except without the economic windfall. Keep the spin going, this is fun.

 

[Kharma Police]

It seems,
GK, bought a basket of trouble. His problem started when he interjected himself into the integration process. I will guess this will go long and deep if he withers away the tranny operation, and who will win, will be the lawyers.the Frontier comparison doesn't hold water, Pottery Barn rules, he hadn't bought it, so his hands weren't on Frontier. AT is a different story, bought put in the bag and walking to the car when he dropped the bag. He will be arguing a case in front of Obama appointees. The case wouldn't be about integration, it would be about the big bad company that bought a small home town airline and went Frank Lorenzo all over it.
My bet is he will back out of muscling the integration process and allow it to go to arbitration and wait and see, to do otherwise would have too much liability.
Culture is one thing, cash is another.
PBR

Very true and very well stated with the metaphors!

p.s. I love that movie, have you seen the redux?

 

[scoreboardII]

It seems,
The case wouldn't be about integration, it would be about the big bad company that bought a small home town airline and went Frank Lorenzo all over it.
PBR

You folks are living in fantasy-land, SoCal.

Have you seen the LUV stock price of late? $8

Thats with LOW oil prices.

At the start of this debacle, it was closer to $11

$2.5 Billion dollar loss of market CAP since AT was bought.

Gary could could cash out and shutter AT and there would be not one lawsuit that makes it past opening date.

Open your eyes folks, this is a different economy than last year, even last month.

 

[Kharma Police]

You folks are living in fantasy-land, SoCal.

Have you seen the LUV stock price of late? $8

Thats with LOW oil prices.

At the start of this debacle, it was closer to $11

$2.5 Billion dollar loss of market CAP since AT was bought.

Gary could could cash out and shudder AT and there would be not one lawsuit that makes it past opening date.

Open your eyes folks, this is a different economy than last year, even last month.

How would Gary face the other CEOs at the Wings Club or at The Conquistadores del Cielo meeting?!? He would all hear the other airline CEOs whispering, Gary is a nice guy, but he's no Herb. His ego made the mistake of involving himself in the process, now he has to figure out a way out to save face.

 

[Roomwithaview]

The title of this thread

SWA going against McAsskill Bondage

Hmmm? Lemme think about that. Congress passes all kind of BS laws all the time and people take them to court and they are overturned. All the time. B/M is untested, unproven and never been tetched. Sure, maybe we (SWAPA) or the company will be the ones to lead the charge on overturning it. Funny how cactii and USAir followed the letter of the law in their contracts and USAir saw fit to de-certify ALPA and fight to overturn Nicolau. So, what's that say about your contracts, your fair and equitable, your Allegheny Mohawk and your precious Bond Mcaskill? Not a f&cking thing.

Whatever happens, if you don't like the outcome you guys will sue. We expect that. Gary expects that. It's part of doing business. The one that has the most compelling case, and can convince the final court that hears it wins. That's the way it always works. If you guys have such a strong case and feel like you are getting royally screwed then stop with all the Flight Info chest-thumping and put your money where your mouth is.

We'll gladly see you in court where you can tell us all about how Airtran was the place to be and that pilots were leaving Southwest in droves to come over there because the pay, bennies, mgt, QOL, schedule, retirement and everything else was so much better.

 

[Irishav8r]

Not sure how management couldn't be involved, they are writing the checks. They would still have to sign off on whatever was negotiated wouldn't they? Pay protections, fences, longevity protection.....if they are paying for it, they should have a voice...No problem with it..

 

[Kharma Police]

SWA going against McAsskill Bondage

Hmmm? Lemme think about that. Congress passes all kind of BS laws all the time and people take them to court and they are overturned. All the time. B/M is untested, unproven and never been tetched. Sure, maybe we (SWAPA) or the company will be the ones to lead the charge on overturning it. Funny how cactii and USAir followed the letter of the law in their contracts and USAir saw fit to de-certify ALPA and fight to overturn Nicolau. So, what's that say about your contracts, your fair and equitable, your Allegheny Mohawk and your precious Bond Mcaskill? Not a f&cking thing.

Whatever happens, if you don't like the outcome you guys will sue. We expect that. Gary expects that. It's part of doing business. The one that has the most compelling case, and can convince the final court that hears it wins. That's the way it always works. If you guys have such a strong case and feel like you are getting royally screwed then stop with all the Flight Info chest-thumping and put your money where your mouth is.

We'll gladly see you in court where you can tell us all about how Airtran was the place to be and that pilots were leaving Southwest in droves to come over there because the pay, bennies, mgt, QOL, schedule, retirement and everything else was so much better.

I love it!, Southwest is going to take on the US Government, the World is next! Bill Gates has more money stuffed in his mattress than Southwest and Microsoft lost. Too bad the pro labor Democrats are in power too!

We should have sent Southwest to Libya to kick some arse, "Hey Gaddafi, IT'S ON!!!!!!!!!!" LOL!

 

[Roomwithaview]

Caramel poo-eater police

U missed the best part.

We'll gladly see you in court where you can tell us all about how Airtran was the place to be and that pilots were leaving Southwest in droves to come over there because the pay, bennies, mgt, QOL, schedule, retirement and everything else was so much better.

 

[scoreboardII]

ALPA lawsuit against SWA theory

The case:

Jugde: "let me get this right, you had an AIP but refused to let the membership vote?"

ALPA: "Yes, why would we want them to vote for something they may have accepted, it was less than their desired goals".

Judge: "But if they voted it in, wouldn't it meet there goals?"

ALPA: "No, because they don'teven know what their goals are."

Judge: "I see, case dismissed as, you don't know what you want."