Southern Hiring

[gringo]

gringo you must be management.! nice pipe dream, if this place is so wonderful why is everyone leaving?

Yup. Totally nailed it. Now you just have to figure out which one.

But, since you DID bring it up to my attention that somehow I'm painting an unrealistically rosy picture of this place, I'll make the following disclaimer:

Kids, if you come over here, just be advised that Southern Air does suffer from an unusually large amount of disgruntled, unhappy and otherwise unsatisfied pilots. Whether this lack of satisfaction comes as a result from crossing a line years and years ago, or from having lost their dream job after Pan Am's collapse, or some other reason, we do have those pilots who like to do nothing but complain while not offering up any solutions. They live in the past while scoffing those who look ahead and try to make this a better place.

Most pilots are not this way, but a few are.

And yes, while a few people did in fact leave over the past few months, it's hardly what you would call a "stampede"- with the exception of a few engineers that have gone over to Kalitta, the majority of people leaving over the past few months went to Atlas, JetBlue, Southwest and American.

Of course, quite a few left Atlas to do the same, so I'm guessing things must really be terrible there as well.

 

[ROSWELL41]

So I've been looking at making the ACMI jump for a while. I am married with no children and my wife is also a 121 pilot. Are there guys at Southern who are married and have families? People keep warning me that these types of jobs can create lots of family problems. Any personal experience?

 

[Flyer1015]

This sounds like a good opportunity, but as a married guy (no kids yet), there is no way I can do 20 away at a time, and only 10 off. And once kids come, 20 days away is well outside the question.

 

[gringo]

So I've been looking at making the ACMI jump for a while. I am married with no children and my wife is also a 121 pilot. Are there guys at Southern who are married and have families? People keep warning me that these types of jobs can create lots of family problems. Any personal experience?

It can go either way. I know plenty of guys with solid marriages and great relations with their kids. I also know lots of guys workingon their third marriage.

Personally, I believe if you start this job with a strong marriage, you'll do fine. If you enter the ACMI world with a weak marriage, then not so much.

One nearly universal constant with the guys with happy home lives is where they live, or more specifically, where their spouse's FAMILY lives. Most of the guys I know (myself included) have improved their situation simply by moving close to their spouse's family. Your wife will fare much much better if she's got her family as a support group for when you're gone.

It really makes the "home basing" aspect really great.

As far as the long trips from home, well, that goes both ways. Yes, you're Von for longer stretches of time, but when you come home, that's it. (Unless you get called out for some reason, something that does happen once in a while.)

My family hates it when I leave, but when I'm home for 10-15 days at a time, each month, we have fun. Lots and lots of "mini vacations".

Is it the same as if you'd be flying for a major, living at domicile and bidding reserve? Of course not- that schedule would be awesome. But it's about the next best thing. And not having to do the whole commuting rigamarole really helps.

In a nutshell, I don't think it's any harder or easier to maintain a marriage while flying ACMI vs flying for a national, LCC or major airline. While there are many factors involved, the most important factor transcends whatever type of flying you do. If you have a solid marriage, you'll make it work, no matter what. If you have a weak marriage, at least you'll have an opportunity for some fun on Hooker Hill in Itaewon. It's really up to you.

 

[DHPFLYN]

Are you typed in the 747 ?

 

[swordfish]

Yup. Totally nailed it. Now you just have to figure out which one.

But, since you DID bring it up to my attention that somehow I'm painting an unrealistically rosy picture of this place, I'll make the following disclaimer:

Kids, if you come over here, just be advised that Southern Air does suffer from an unusually large amount of disgruntled, unhappy and otherwise unsatisfied pilots. Whether this lack of satisfaction comes as a result from crossing a line years and years ago, or from having lost their dream job after Pan Am's collapse, or some other reason, we do have those pilots who like to do nothing but complain while not offering up any solutions. They live in the past while scoffing those who look ahead and try to make this a better place.

Most pilots are not this way, but a few are.

And yes, while a few people did in fact leave over the past few months, it's hardly what you would call a "stampede"- with the exception of a few engineers that have gone over to Kalitta, the majority of people leaving over the past few months went to Atlas, JetBlue, Southwest and American.

Of course, quite a few left Atlas to do the same, so I'm guessing things must really be terrible there as well.

OR how about:

-24+ hour duty days

-having to fight for your pay the way the contract reads.

-Dead heading around the world in the back-middle seat on Air India or Ethiopian Airlines, etc, (just to name a few from the past 2 months.)

-siting in a hotel for 15 days in a row without flying one trip, just to have scheduling tell you that you have to work on your GDO because your the only one ( im in the top 20% of the pilots list)

-flying to (WAR Zones) Afghanistan etc. without any hazard pay.

-Geting to the destination after being up for over 30+ hrs and there never any transportation set up (Happened every trip last month, Except IN BKK. )

-Geting to the hotel and your Reservation has be canceled or Set up for the Wrong day, (Happened 4 time last month...)

-F**kup Flight plans... with misSING requirements, (every trip to many to list).

-Over nights in dangerous city in Africa with out secure transportation to or from the hotel.

- having to hold for 30 + min because dispatcher never filed over flight permits.

-flying airplanes without GPS, having countries ground, and impound your aircraft because you can't operate RNAV the way they want. DXB

-detained by CUSTOMS for hrs because the company can't set up VISA for crewmembers.


HEY BUT SOME PEOPLE REALLY LIKE THIS TYPE OF FLYING!

 

[HA25]

Like I said, I know a captain who left to go to Kalitta. That's how bad Southern is.

 

[maxfly1]

Like I said, I know a captain who left to go to Kalitta. That's how bad Southern is.

I don't know of any Captains who went to Kalitta, a bunch of FEs did. Why would you go from CA pay to FO and lose senority?

Southern is not as bad as people paint it, if you don't like it, go somewhere else... Our pilot group is working on it. There are much worse places, that I know for a fact.

And I can tell you, that having proper security on the way to the hotel in Africa is not that safe either, he will drop his AK before you blink and run off if he sees something's going down.

 

[gringo]

OR how about:

-24+ hour duty days

-having to fight for your pay the way the contract reads.

-Dead heading around the world in the back-middle seat on Air India or Ethiopian Airlines, etc, (just to name a few from the past 2 months.)

-siting in a hotel for 15 days in a row without flying one trip, just to have scheduling tell you that you have to work on your GDO because your the only one ( im in the top 20% of the pilots list)

-flying to (WAR Zones) Afghanistan etc. without any hazard pay.

-Geting to the destination after being up for over 30+ hrs and there never any transportation set up (Happened every trip last month, Except IN BKK. )

-Geting to the hotel and your Reservation has be canceled or Set up for the Wrong day, (Happened 4 time last month...)

-F**kup Flight plans... with misSING requirements, (every trip to many to list).

-Over nights in dangerous city in Africa with out secure transportation to or from the hotel.

- having to hold for 30 + min because dispatcher never filed over flight permits.

-flying airplanes without GPS, having countries ground, and impound your aircraft because you can't operate RNAV the way they want. DXB

-detained by CUSTOMS for hrs because the company can't set up VISA for crewmembers.


HEY BUT SOME PEOPLE REALLY LIKE THIS TYPE OF FLYING!

Sword, I appreciate your frustration, and I can certainly understand it. Every single one of your complaints has validity behind them.

The question I pose you is this: what, if anything, have you done about it? Have you sent in a report to the proper people when your flight plan was jacked up? Have you sent in a report when your hotel reservation was screwed up? Or when the proper visa documentation wasn't in order, did you report it?

Or did you do what many here currently do, which is nothing except complain? It's a rhetorical question, I really don't need to know the answer. If you did file the proper reports, then good. If you didn't, then start. Southern Air got to the state that it's in today for many reasons, crew group apathy being a big one. I know 2 years ago when the Neffs were in charge, there was a vindictive hostile management in place, and pilots were happy just to have a job, so they took whatever crap came down from the mountaintop.

For the most part, that's been removed. Changes are happening. When was the last time you had a 24+ duty day? Mine was last year. The GDO pay issue has been resolved; it took far longer than it should have, but we got the result we deserved. Travel in middle seat coach? Yeah, that's a load of bull, but it will be addressed in negotiations.

We have a long way to go to get where we want to be. Make no mistake, at no point did I ever try to paint a rosy picture of this place, and I'm not making up anything to try to entice people to come here. Read back every one of my posts; everything I write about this place is nothing but fact. Yes, this place is screwed up, but more importantly, it has the ability to change. Maintenance is improving, QOL is improving, and most importantly, our on time performance is improving, allowing us to get some of the big name clients we've just signed contracts with.

There are better places to be, for sure. But there are far far worse places as well. Stop complaining and start becoming more proactive. That's the only way this place will improve.

 

[daytona]

OR how about:

-24+ hour duty days

-having to fight for your pay the way the contract reads.

-Dead heading around the world in the back-middle seat on Air India or Ethiopian Airlines, etc, (just to name a few from the past 2 months.)

-siting in a hotel for 15 days in a row without flying one trip, just to have scheduling tell you that you have to work on your GDO because your the only one ( im in the top 20% of the pilots list)

-flying to (WAR Zones) Afghanistan etc. without any hazard pay.

-Geting to the destination after being up for over 30+ hrs and there never any transportation set up (Happened every trip last month, Except IN BKK. )

-Geting to the hotel and your Reservation has be canceled or Set up for the Wrong day, (Happened 4 time last month...)

-F**kup Flight plans... with misSING requirements, (every trip to many to list).

-Over nights in dangerous city in Africa with out secure transportation to or from the hotel.

- having to hold for 30 + min because dispatcher never filed over flight permits.

-flying airplanes without GPS, having countries ground, and impound your aircraft because you can't operate RNAV the way they want. DXB

-detained by CUSTOMS for hrs because the company can't set up VISA for crewmembers.


HEY BUT SOME PEOPLE REALLY LIKE THIS TYPE OF FLYING!

Finally the truth comes out. I would rather mow yards than work at that scumbag place.