Pay raise for Hawaiian Airlines CEO

[Sleepyhead]

Yeah, I heard a rumor that our MEC secretly enlisted the help of NSA/CSS, CIA, DIA, FBI and ATF to try to uncover the dark Banmiller/Chinese secrets of Aloha Airlines...

Maybe an agent of one of these agencies can chime in...

Agent-69 chiming in here... I'm with an agency so secret even our name is a secret.

the latest... As of a few weeks ago there were 3 investors they were talking with. One dropped out, one only wanted inter-island and is not being considered and the other one is who they are talking with.

I could tell you who they are but then I would have to kill my self,( agency rules) so right know you will have to wait until it is printed in the Advertiser because they also have an agent on their staff.

 

[Erndogg]

I could tell you who they are but then I would have to kill my self,( agency rules) so right know you will have to wait until it is printed in the Advertiser because they also have an agent on their staff.

Let me guess the mole within the Advertiser? His initials are T.T.S? Now I will have to kill myself since I have revealed his identity!

 

[Freight Dog]

Let me guess the mole within the Advertiser? His initials are T.T.S? Now I will have to kill myself since I have revealed his identity!

Naw, you don't have to kill yourself. I'm sure Banmiller's henchmen will take care of you.

 

[FlickerFade]

.....

 

[mdanno808]

http://starbulletin.com/2005/09/08/business/index3.html

Even as delta slashes flights they continue to add flights to Hawaii. Wish HAL would do the same. Dan Roman, I'm feeling down, hit me with some of that eternal optimism.

 

[FlickerFade]

The last chapter in the AQ bk exit plan hasn't even had its rough draft laid out.


What is going on at AQ?????????

 

[HAL]

Dan Roman, I'm feeling down, hit me with some of that eternal optimism.

I'll echo that thought. It has been over two months since the exit from bankruptcy, and we kept hearing 'hang on guys, you'll all be back soon'. Some of our guys are nearing 3 years on furlough (I know, some have gone much longer in the past), but so far there is nothing on the horizon. One of our furloughees just got furloughed from her third airline in two years. It is getting depressing out there and we need help.

I'm trying to remain optimistic, but where is the movement? As mdanno said Delta is again increasing service to the islands, and HA is being left in the dust. I know Dunkerly & co. are trying to be conservative and not waste money. But there is also a difference between being conservative, and stagnating.

So please Dan Roman, let us know if there really is anything coming up for us. Thanks.

(trying to keep a positive outlook) HAL

P.S. Inserting shameless self-promotion here: AOPA Pilot magazine, September '05, pg 92.

 

[Dan Roman]

Dan Roman, I'm feeling down, hit me with some of that eternal optimism.[/QUOTE]

I just saved a bunch of money on car insurance??

OK, I'll try, keep in mind I stand to lose fifty bucks (bet I made) if no one is recalled by the end of the year! By all accounts Ranch has the pockets to do whatever they think will enhance their investment. I'm getting impatient myself and I'm working, so I can imagine it's multiplyed a lot being on the street. That said, I think we are all better off that they are not jumping into whatever just to expand for the sake of expanding. They are very actively looking for airplanes and the whole industry is in a huge state of uproar. Your guess is as good as mine, but their WILL be a lot of changes. Ranch appears to be wisely waiting for the right opportunity. Hawaiian is just like anyone else, anything can happen overnight, whatever they do I'm sure it will be a big surprise when it happens.
From what I hear they are looking at a lot of different possibilities (confirmed by Seavy) and who knows what they will come up with. They do have a line on 6-8 717's (confirmed by Seavy), who knows what they want to do with them? Bill did say a hub in LAS is being considered.
I know it sucks being out and recalls seem like they will never happen, but the fact is, you will look back on this as a distant memory someday quicker than you realize. Ranch didn't buy Hawaiian just to sit on it and none of us have forgotten that we have guys on furlough and we want to get you back as bad as you want to get back.

 

[Freight Dog]

What is going on at AQ?????????

Sorry... it's an ancient Chinese secret.

 

[mdanno808]

Dan Roman, I'm feeling down, hit me with some of that eternal optimism.

I just saved a bunch of money on car insurance??

OK, I'll try, keep in mind I stand to lose fifty bucks (bet I made) if no one is recalled by the end of the year! By all accounts Ranch has the pockets to do whatever they think will enhance their investment. I'm getting impatient myself and I'm working, so I can imagine it's multiplyed a lot being on the street. That said, I think we are all better off that they are not jumping into whatever just to expand for the sake of expanding. They are very actively looking for airplanes and the whole industry is in a huge state of uproar. Your guess is as good as mine, but their WILL be a lot of changes. Ranch appears to be wisely waiting for the right opportunity. Hawaiian is just like anyone else, anything can happen overnight, whatever they do I'm sure it will be a big surprise when it happens.
From what I hear they are looking at a lot of different possibilities (confirmed by Seavy) and who knows what they will come up with. They do have a line on 6-8 717's (confirmed by Seavy), who knows what they want to do with them? Bill did say a hub in LAS is being considered.
I know it sucks being out and recalls seem like they will never happen, but the fact is, you will look back on this as a distant memory someday quicker than you realize. Ranch didn't buy Hawaiian just to sit on it and none of us have forgotten that we have guys on furlough and we want to get you back as bad as you want to get back.[/QUOTE]

I agree with everything you said regarding RC. They have the ability to basically do whatever they want. The problem I see, is that expanding is risky, especially if not done right. RC is making money right now, while a lot of others are losing it hand over fist. Throwing 8 717's into the desert in hopes to feed their own flights sounds like a risk I doubt they will be willing to take. (I know I wouldn't if it were my money) The competition is flooding the market to Hawaii, and I think we have waited too long to effectively increase service to the west coast, and beyond (at least this year). The summer is over, and the ammount of seats to Hawaii from the mainland is at an all time high. You said that stupid expansion helps no one, and I couldn't agree more. That is why I think that you will see very little happen at Hawaiian for a while. Now as far as going east bound, who knows. I've heard that the Australia flights are still losing money. Is that true? All I know is what I hear. But the "big announcement" rumor that has effectively been floating around since the time I was hired has not come true yet, so it amazes me that everyone still takes the bait. The most depressing thought I've had so far is this: If they staff the airplanes at 5 crews per plane, then it will effectively take 10 aircraft to recall everyone. As far as 767's are concerned, the best I imagine we will do is get 1-2 in the next year, and maybe another 1-2 the following year. Thats 40 pilot's over the next two years. Retirements don't seem to affect staffing (I still don't quite understand why), and the 6-8 717's we are looking at sounds like pie in the sky. I'm almost done complaining, and I know you're aching to write a response, but just hold on another second. IMHO, barring something big happening, and changing the climate of the industry, the last of the furloughed pilots won't be back for another 3-4 years maybe 5. I hope to god I'm wrong, because I don't know how much longer I can nonsched, without my wife divorcing me, and my kids forgetting who I am. Dan Roman, everyone knows your reputation at HAL. You are a very happy go lucky person, and personally I think that's great. I wish I were a little more positive, and a little less depressed. There is no real point to my ranting, only to give a counter point to your view as to what the future holds. My challege to Hawaiian Air now is to prove me wrong, get a sh1t load of airplanes, and call all of us back. I hope all is well back on the line, and give my regards to everyone. PS gone on any surf trips recently? PPS, ran into a friend (HAL classmate) yesterday, who is now at Evergreen. He is on his third trip around the globe, and hasn't been home in 18 days. What's worse, is that he thinks they will send him around the horn one more time before releasing him.

"With my luck it'd be raining whore's, and I'd catch a lesbian"

Teddy Moore

 

[Dan Roman]

Loved Teddys quote!! tell him I said catch 2 and everything will be all right!

Ted was always one who I have tremendous respect for. Class act if there ever was one and probably one of the best examples I've ever seen as to how to be an ALPA Pilot. Just a great guy. I think what says it all... Ive never heard anyone say anything bad about him, he is respected by everyone. Tell him I said HI.

He and I spent a lot of time together in everything from Electra's, Dash 7's to DC-10's. We were probably the Ying and Yang of optimism/negativism at HAL. Two more opposite people you would be hard pressed to find when it came to our perception of Hawaiian. Yet we always repected our polar opposite viewpoints. Which Ive always been a big believer that my viewpoints are just that, mine. Reality is the combination of everyones.

Old fart story to follow: We were furloughed from Hawaiian when they sold the cargo operation in Macon. Half of Hawaiians pilots were furloughed and everyone said we would never be recalled. Hell, most of us thought the people in Hawaii could care less about us "Cargo guys". Well not Johnny Sunshine (even back than I got that name!). I thought, with deregulation, it was only a matter of time before Hawaiian would get long haul aircraft and fly beyond Hawaii. Everyone else was saying we would never get back, Hawaiian has MD-80's and will reduce the amount of pilots it needs inter-island, etc. etc. Well 2 1/2 years later we all got recalled. Here's were it get good. 6 months later I got a furlough letter! I was unhappily married at the time, Hawaiian was on shaky ground (1982) and I said F^* this, I'm going to an airline with a future! (PEOPLExpress). Opps! 2 years later I came back with my tail between my legs (180 numbers more junior) and nothing in my possesion but a few surfboards (but free of a very poor marriage and thankfully we never had kids, so it was easy). After I left Hawaiian, they went from planning to furlough me to a major expansion. My prediction came true but I wasn't there because I let a lousy marriage and a temporary situation cloud my judgement about Hawaiians future. Frankly it worked out great and my standard line is I would much rather have my present seniority and my present wife, than my old seniority and my old wife. Believe me, I wouldn't trade my present life for all the seniority in the world. I'm living proof that seniority doesn't equat to happiness. You have to make the best of were ever your at and everything works out. I know it's a terrible clique, but it is the journey not the destination. My story is to point out that anything can and will happen. None of us know what will happen, but I can say this, for the last 25 years, the doomsayers at Hawaiian have always been more wrong than right. Looking back, the down times have been just as valuable to me as the up times.
The fact is, your about 20 numbers out and we have about 40 retirements coming up over the next couple of years. Hawaiian has never been better run and they have never had the financial horsepower behind them that they now enjoy. They are very activly looking for GOOD oppurtunities to expand(the wet leases for ANA to Japan are still a possibility too). IMHO, the entire industry is just starting a major earthquake, we are just seeing the initial tremors. Hawaiian is very well positioned for what ever happens and Ranch knows what they are doing. My story is to point how quickly things can change, my advice is to make the family your highest priority, surfing second and don't give up your number! (and when your home come visit me in Pupukea and get some free Avocados!).

PS You asked about surf trips. took three quick ones to the east coast of Australia. Entered a couple of longboard events (Noosa festival of surf and Cresent Head). Australia ROCKS!!!! Point breaks, beach breaks and reef breaks everywere! The name spots are crowded, but there are numerous uncrowded quality waves. The people our awesome, my family loved it, Australia is heaven on earth for a surfer.
I keep hearing conflicting stories, but according to the station manager there, sometimes the loads are very heavy and sometimes very light, but we are making good money on belly freight when the loads are light. The flight may be twice as long as the west coast but the tickets average a lot more than twice as much. From what I hear we may be doing more down there (under).

 

[mdanno808]

Ted says hello to you, and hopes you're well. He has never had anything bad to say about you either. I know things are going to get better, and that sooner or later we will all be recalled, and believe me, I have no intention of giving up my number. I have just been worn down by the last few years, and can't wait to go back to a good job. It is really easy to move up in life, and really hard to get kicked down a few rungs. I hope everyone is doing well, (I can't believe Rojo. If there is anything any of us can do, please let us know) and the next time you here someone bitching about their job over there, you tell them how lucky they are. I can honestly tell you that they could be somewhere a lot worse. Take care, and I hope to see you on the line soon.

 

[HAL]

D.R., et.al.,

Thanks for the dose of optimism. However I'm in the same boat as mdanno, and doubt there will be much expansion for a long time.

I just looked over the retirement list and according to that, the next 40 retirements will be gone by January of 2009, which is a little more than 'a couple years'.

I know a lot of HA pilots have been furloughed over the years, but the vast majority have been for short periods of time. Even D.R. said of his furlough that "2 1/2 years later we all got recalled". It is coming up on 2 1/2 years for me, and I'm just a couple people from the top of the list (and mdanno is actually 50+ from the top). The bottom guys will be hitting 3 years in a few months. When was the last time that a quarter of the pilots were out on furlough and stayed there for 3+ years without recalls? That sense of optimism keeps fading every time I look at what HA is doing: No recalls, no expansion, no movement.

It is a good company and a great place to fly. I think we're all just wishing that they could capitalize on it and do what we know they can; become a world-class airline instead of sitting on their a$$es and waiting for the 'right moment'.

On a lighter note I was flying a LAS-BOS redeye last night, and somewhere over Chicago I was shocked to hear the "Hawaiian" callsign. I had to listen to the reply to be sure I wasn't just asleep and dreaming. It took a moment, then remembered that I saw the Raiders/Patriots game on TV before leaving LAS, and that must have been the Raiders charter returning. Sorry about the loss guys!

HAL

 

[Erndogg]

On a lighter note I was flying a LAS-BOS redeye last night, and somewhere over Chicago I was shocked to hear the "Hawaiian" callsign. I had to listen to the reply to be sure I wasn't just asleep and dreaming. It took a moment, then remembered that I saw the Raiders/Patriots game on TV before leaving LAS, and that must have been the Raiders charter returning. Sorry about the loss guys!

Hal That was flt 913 from PVD-OAK. Tough loss, but I like what I see from the offense. As far as the D goes-It might be a long year!!
We got KC on the 18th looking foward to a good game.

 

[cantgivenomo]

Well Aloha pilots are looking at some more serious concessions. Not only does their pay suck, the company is asking them for their pensions and work rules. The beatings never, ever end.

 

[dash8driver]

Well Aloha pilots are looking at some more serious concessions. Not only does their pay suck, the company is asking them for their pensions and work rules. The beatings never, ever end.

were you expecting anything different?

as they say...the beatings will continue until morale improves.




.

 

[mdanno808]

Hey Dan Roman or Erndogg, did HAL release the price they hedged their fuel at?

 

[Dan Roman]

40-42% @ $1.60. I forget for how many years it lasted, Earndog?

 

[mdanno808]

What's the current cost of jet fuel?

 

[Dan Roman]

Non hedged fuel was a little over $2.00 a couple weeks ago, not sure if it spiked the same as car gas did over here.

Intersting article in the advertiser a fuel weeks ago. It said that last year the oil companies increased the profit margin on kerosene (jet fuel and home heating oil). If they had kept it at the same profit margin as the preveous year the airline industry would have been in the black. The amount of INCREASED profits on jet fuel was almost the exact same amount as the airline industries cumulative loss's. I guess it helps having everyone in the presidents cabinet having a connection to the oil industry.