No MDA pilots take Republic deal..

[stb]

Causes Republic July 19, E-170 class to cancel.

Saw this on another web site.
If this is true, one pilot group is taking a stand of "One for All" against management.

Any MDA pilots confirm or deny?

 

[mnalpha]

i heard they asked for 10cap and 10fo to sign up, and tride to bribe them with being check airman etc.

Nice job guys

 

[LittleDeuce]

Mda

i heard they asked for 10cap and 10fo to sign up, and tride to bribe them with being check airman etc.

Nice job guys

I can confirm that it is true. They went down the entire seniority list and all but 3 said no.

 

[SlapShot]

Pardon my ignorance, but why did everyone say no?

What is ALPA telling you guys will happen now that you have turned Republic down?

 

[LearLove]

LOA 91

ALL OR NONE!!!!!!!!




and thats all I have to say about that.

 

[stb]

What is ALPA telling you guys will happen now that you have turned Republic down?

ALPA has the deer in headlights look; no stance on the issue.

USAirways Mgmt. cant believe that 20 pilots didn't jump on the deal offered.
If 100% pilot group can't go to Repulsive then none will go mentality has caused some unforseen problems.

MDA pilots have retained outside council against ALPA and USAirways.

Two MDA pilots have been elected to the PHL LEC yesterday and called for a special meeting concerning MDA/REP.

Finally a group, (US DOH 1987 to ALG/PDT) of pilots on the same page trying to stop the race to the bottom.
Who says mainline and wholly owned pilots cant work together?

This should get interesting.

 

[DiverDriver]

Since I don't know what was being offered to begin with could you summarize that too? Is Republic just taking over Mid-Atlantic or what?

 

[ASH]

Hey STB, Republic has done nothing to warrant the name calling. It is not a whipsaw, it is unionized, and is offering MDA jobs. By the way, it was only a 1 year training contract, not two. And why is check airman a "bribe", it's a friggin opportunity, that didn't have to be offered. They don't take, we just staff with our own pilots.

Please save your derogitory remarks for airlines that have earned the label.

Republic has done nothing wrong, but try to get the best deal possible, just like many airlines have done in the past. If you could only see what MDA was asking for, you would not be so quick to speak. I have every respect for the MDA guys. They have been through alot. So come on over at $80.00 an hour as a check airman. Welcome

STB, spread some goodness.

 

[stb]

Since I don't know what was being offered to begin with could you summarize that too? Is Republic just taking over Mid-Atlantic or what?

This is what was posted on an earlier thread.
July 1, 2005

To All MidAtlantic Pilots:

As we move forward with the sale of our EMB 170 aircraft to Republic Airways, we will begin transitioning pilots to Republic Airways shortly. An initial pilot training class is being planned July 18, 2005 and will be offered in seniority order to all MidAtlantic pilots per Letter of Agreement # 91. The first class will be comprised of 10 Captains and 10 First Officers. This first group will complete approximately two weeks of indoctrination training followed by either two or three simulator sessions. Once training is complete, you will participate in proving run flights with the FAA in advance of Republic Airways completing their FAA certification. After this phase, most will have the opportunity to qualify for a Check Airman position.

Further information concerning Republic Airways is attached as well as placed on the ALPA website and theHub. We will begin calling pilots July 5, 2005 and will be closing the first class by July 8, 2005. Captains accepting employment at Republic Airways will receive Captain's pay in accordance with their MidAtlantic longevity. First Officer's pay will be at Republic Airway's First Officer top-of-scale pay.

I would like to take this opportunity to thank all of you for your exemplary service to US Airways and to MidAtlantic Airways in particular. Your "can do" attitude was an integral part of the successful start up of a new division with a new aircraft type. We know your job has not been an easy one and we appreciate all your efforts in making MidAtlantic a successful division for our Company.

In the coming days, more information should become available concerning the transition to Republic Airways. As soon as we know more, we will share that information with you.

Stay tuned and thanks again for your continued efforts.

Sincerely,

LyleHogg
Senior Director-Flight Operations

J4J PARTICIPATING CARRIER INFORMATION
CARRIER
Republic Airways
INDOCTRNCITY STL
SIMTRNCITY YUL/CLT/MCO
TRN START TIME 1st DAY 0800
CONTRACTUAL TRN NOTIFICATION REQUIREMENT
PAY FOR TRN
Minimum Guarantee 75 hrs (no per diem)
HOW MANY DAYS FOR TRN 3 weeks
TRNSITE
ADDRESS
STL
FSI 4619 LeBourget Drive, St. Louis MO 63134
TRANS TO TRN (HOME TO TRN)
Company will provide transportation to and from Training
Are pilot required to sign a TRN Contract
YES (2 YEAR)
Amount: $15,000 (prorated)
PAY RATES (effective 10/1/05)
CAP 1 $56.26
F/O $35.20
C/P 2 $59.57
C/P 3 $63.62
MINIMUM MONTHLY GUARANTEE
Minimum Monthly Guarantee 75 hours
J4J AIRLINE DOMICILES
DCA, PIT & IND
EQUIPMENT
EMB 170
TOTAL # AIRCRAFT
25
WHILE IN TRN
STL
Double Tree Bridgeton Road, St. Louis MO
HOTEL EXPENSES
Hotel accommodations based on double occupancy during initial training.
TRNS FROM HOTEL TO TRN
Hotel Van
MEDICAL BENEFITS
30 day waiting period
NOTE: COBRA option available



That offer is REPULSIVE!

 

[stb]

If you could only see what MDA was asking for, you would not be so quick to speak.

From Learlove's post, they want what was already agreed upon by LOA 91.

ASH, if it make's you feel better how about Mid-Titanic.

 

[PCL_128]

PAY RATES (effective 10/1/05)
CAP 1 $56.26
F/O $35.20
C/P 2 $59.57
C/P 3 $63.62

That offer is REPULSIVE!

You can say that again. $56/hr for an EMB-170 Captain? A two year training contract? Double occupancy hotel rooms in training?

Who does the union representation at Republic? This is pathetic.

 

[ASH]

From Learlove's post, they want what was already agreed upon by LOA 91.

ASH, if it make's you feel better how about Mid-Titanic.

NOT TRUE.

They came in demanding SUPER SENIORITY, based on their US AIRWAYS DOH!!!!!!!

They did not even let us counter-offer, they said it will just go to arbitration then. They were not even wanting to make a deal, or meet half-way, so this is what you get.
And the training contract has been amended, it is only 1 year. Their are other things on that letter that have been changed also.
It was grace that we offered anything. THIS IS AN ASSET PURCHASE

Hope you enjoy the car salesman coming with your car when you buy it, oh, wait he's till back at the dealership isn't he?

 

[Truckdriver]

PAY RATES (effective 10/1/05)
CAP 1 $56.26
F/O $35.20
C/P 2 $59.57
C/P 3 $63.62

Holy S#it!! This actually makes my pay rate at XJT look good! So will Republic just use CHQ pilots to fly them and the MDA pilots will be greeting us at Wal-Mart if they don't take the job? How much worse are these rates than the what the MDA guys are getting now?

 

[SlapShot]

They were probably aware of what you offered the Shuttle America pilots and just figured it would be quicker to just let it go to arbitration.

 

[sf3boy]

You can say that again. $56/hr for an EMB-170 Captain? A two year training contract? Double occupancy hotel rooms in training?

Who does the union representation at Republic? This is pathetic.

That is pathetic. I make that as a junior Saab captain in our most junior base. The hotel and training contract just add to the insult. Way to keep the Airline Pilot Profession classy, guys. Keep saying no to crap, everyone.

 

[BaronDrvr]

... How much worse are these rates than the what the MDA guys are getting now?

According to AirlinePilotPay...

MidAtlantic CA Pay Republic CA Pay
1st - 60 1st - 55
2nd - 61 2nd - 58
3rd - 63 3rd - 62
5th - 67 5th - 66
10th - 77 10th - 77

And from what I read on the earlier post, MDA CA's will begin their pay based on their years of service already with MDA, so I would imagine that the 1st and 2nd pays would not be applicable.
And for the FO side, the FO pay would already start out at the max. amount possible for FO's and that would be 34/Hr.
Once again, according to AirlinePilotPay.com

MidAtlantic FO pay
1st - 20
2nd - 30
3rd - 33
4th - 35

Im pretty new to this game, and these all do seem low for 70 pax but in comparision to what pay scale MDA already had, I dont see that big of difference.

 

[flyinglow]

Might as well say before someone does. SHittytaco is a good ariline and good group of pilots, we just fly the airplanes, and management makes the decisions. We can't help what they do. But I guess now I can upgrade in 15 months instead of 18, wow this is cool (Sarcasim Intended) What a joke of a industry. Just get it over with already and bring some Chinese over and let them fly for peanuts.

 

[sweatro]

ASH,

You are a tool. That offer sucks a$$. As does your $hitty contract that pays FO the same for all equipment.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

I admire the MidAtlantic pilots who must have finally decided that they have been tossed around by US Airways enough.

Not sure I would've had the stones to make the same decision. I wonder if such a small group can change the course of ALPA.

We may be witnessing the very first paragraph in the next chapter of "Flying the Line".

 

[StarChecker]

They were probably aware of what you offered the Shuttle America pilots and just figured it would be quicker to just let it go to arbitration.

Oh you mean the $20,000 raise and employment with a growing all-jet operator? Ya that's terribly unreasonable...

 

[Popeye0537]

I'm tired of this crap that CHQ is the bad guy.....US Air needs money, we have it. We purchased the aircraft and offered the MDA pilots a position within the company. Come over or don't, I don't give a $hit....What else ya got lined up??? NOTHING

When I got furloughed in 95 I had no one handing me a job....And you guys wanna bitch about $56 bucks an hour!!!??? What will you be making at home sitting on your couch?

And to those Shuttle guys bitchin about being intergrated.....boo hoo, It sucks that you have to go from the right seat of a Saab to the right seat of an E-jet with a pay increase. Jesus

Go ahead and flame this....I don't give a rats a$$

 

[Mike15601]

Perhaps the MDA guys are having problems going to an airline that dosnt even have a certificate for the 170 yet. Question, why such a quick offer for Check Airman positions and proving run help? Does Republic not have any Pilots who can do this?

 

[FR8mastr]

NOT TRUE.

They came in demanding SUPER SENIORITY, based on their US AIRWAYS DOH!!!!!!!

They did not even let us counter-offer, they said it will just go to arbitration then. They were not even wanting to make a deal, or meet half-way, so this is what you get.
And the training contract has been amended, it is only 1 year. Their are other things on that letter that have been changed also.
It was grace that we offered anything. THIS IS AN ASSET PURCHASE

Hope you enjoy the car salesman coming with your car when you buy it, oh, wait he's till back at the dealership isn't he?

Let me try and explain a little.

Mda is operated as a seperate unit under the Airways certificate. it is called officially the EMB 170 division of US AIRWAYS. While MDA shares many items and services with Airways, we have our own dispatchers and schedulers. (those folks work from the same place as ML) Republic is buying all aircraft, the simulator, the Door trainer, and other associated 170 items. IE all of the 170 operation. After this deal is done the US Airways dispatchers ect. will not control the 170, republic will. Sounds like a change of control to me! But hey maybe that is not enough for you. Try this on, LOA 91 also states that the change of control provision will also apply upon the sale of 36.5% of the aircraft. I am not a math major but all of the aircraft is more that 36%. So just because your management and ours claim this is just an Asset sale does not make it so.

Besides all that, no matter what the outcome, you at republic will have 100% of the aircraft as soon as the Airways pilots can get out. I can almost say to a man that will happen just as soon as humanly possible. So worst case your new hires or the guys that havent even been hired yet might have to fly in the right seat for a year or two before upgrade. If somebody told me I would get 25 more aircraft in two years or less, that would be good news, that is what you are getting! This does not count the 3 from Brazil or all the flying you are getting from United.

 

[FlamingFUPA]

Let me try and expain a little.

Mda is operated as a seperate unit under the Airways certificate. it is called officially the EMB 170 division of US AIRWAYS. While MDA shares many items and services with Airways, we have our own dispatchers and schedulers. (those folks work from the same place as ML) Republic is buying all aircraft, the simulator, the Door trainer, and other associated 170 items. IE all of the 170 operation. After this deal is done the US Airways dispatchers ect. will not control the 170, republic will. Sounds like a change of control to me! But hey maybe that is not enough for you. Try this on, LOA 91 also states that the change of control provision will also apply upon the sale of 36.5% of the aircraft. I am not a math major but all of the aircraft is more that 36%. So just because your management and ours claim this is just an Asset sale does not make it so.

Besides all that, no matter what the outcome, you at republic will have 100% of the aircraft as soon as the Airways pilots can get out. I can almost say to a man that will happen just as soon as humanly possible. So worst case your new hires or the guys that havent even been hired yet might have to fly in the right seat for a year or two before upgrade. If somebody told me I would get 25 more aircraft in two years or less, that would be good news, that is what you are getting! This does not count the 3 from Brazil or all the flying you are getting from United.

Thank you for the above response. It was exactly what this thread needed some calm without the bashing. I think the pilots at CHQ are very excited about this but are tired of being the pariah for what their management has done.

 

[Popeye0537]

Im not a math major either, but doesn't US have more than 25 aircraft? MDA is opperated under US's certificate, so how do you get 36.5% when you take into account all of US's aircraft?

IF MDA were on a seperate certificate I could see the "change of control" argument, but seeing that you operate as a portion of US airways I don't see this as such. I could be wrong, I'm sure there is more going on then we know.

 

[FR8mastr]

Control of the 170 Division of US AIRWAYS

 

[Mike15601]

On a side note:I was a J4J at MESA. About 120+ J4J's signed up. In the 16 months I was there about 110 were off to greener pastures. Quite a few went to Cathay Pacific. Others to Net Jets, Net Jets International, Fed Ex. South West, DHL, Air Tran, Jet Blue, Contract 737's in China, corporate, etc..etc. Pretty much the whole spectrum of aviation. You can see the attrition rate was very high. We have seen similar rates at MDA with about 5 to 7 leaving per month. My point being is that everyone is looking for better jobs and if they do come to Republic they will not be there for long.

 

[Popeye0537]

Right control of the 170 division....Not the 757,767,A330 etc. Does LOA 91 specify grouping of aircraft?

 

[SlapShot]

And to those Shuttle guys bitchin about being intergrated.....boo hoo, It sucks that you have to go from the right seat of a Saab to the right seat of an E-jet with a pay increase. Jesus

How about going from the left seat of the Saab to the right seat of the ERJ with a pay cut? Our most senior guy would be the most junior captain on your list and the rest of us would be integrated below that.

 

[FurloughedAgain]

Thats not a very good comentary on the quality of jobs at Mesa... or potentially at Republic, is it?