NJA Downgrades

[brokeflyer]

Takeoff performance better with any of the small citations over the Learjets?

Please

Thats laughable.

i think he meant t/o and landing distance.

re-read his post

 

[rajflyboy]

Lear 60 is known for bad landing performance. The rest are good.

The Lear has 2 wheels on each main. Cessna still can't figure that out yet.

 

[Hawker dude]

Lear 60 is known for bad landing performance. The rest are good.

The Lear has 2 wheels on each main. Cessna still can't figure that out yet.

Maybe you just suck as a pilot and that is why you need the extra wheels. hhhmmmm...

Just remember in your flair to add a "scosh" of power before you touchdown.

 

[hammer2]

Maybe you just suck as a pilot and that is why you need the extra wheels. hhhmmmm...

Just remember in your flair to add a "scosh" of power before you touchdown.

I'll remember that on a 4000' runway.

 

[ghostrider64]

First a lesson to ALL that weren't here during the war years at NJA, NEVER AND I MEAN NEVER base your beliefs on information that is PUBLICLY RELEASED BY THE COMPANY. Spouting of sales numbers and projections then assuming they are real is a huge error.

Now to the OP numbers etc....

I would suggest management could put EVERY fleet into permanent disposal. I suggest that because ALL subsequent orders have ceased that there are more than enough airframes on the property today to cover our flying for at least 5 years without adding a single NEW plane. By that time new models will be available to REPLACE existing fleets.

Take for example the beloved G200, the new model is currently in development the G250, this is an obvious REPLACEMENT AIRCRAFT.

While I have no firm knowledge of staffing and or hard numbers, I do know the rosey OUTLOOK is just that, an outlook that might be true but certainly not NEAR TERM.

I for one am saving my pennies and expecting another storm. Prudence would be suggested in others doing the same for the NEAR TERM.

 

[DAS at 10/250]

A modest cut may not bring problems, but massive downgrades would be downgrading the pilots who fought for the '05 contract and know every last place an airplane may have a problem on a preflight.

That's awesome. Basically, you don't give a sh!t about post '05 hires, but fu<k with pre-'05'ers and we'll STFD.

Thanks "brother".

 

[jtf]

DAS, I am a post '05 hire so I care quite a bit. I waited until the '05 contract and then I came. I wish I would have came earlier, but at least I do still have a job here. I can't say that I trust that it will last. I learned all about having a B plan after two furloughs in '01 and I have a plan now should the egg shells I'm walking on crack.

Can you honestly tell me the company shouldn't have furloughed the pilots that they did? It sucks, but it was necessary and the majority of the pilots understand. Management f'ed up big time and way over hired. Something needed to be done and it was. Along with the furloughs, quite a bit of upper management (the decision makers that exasperated the problems or who were just dead wood anyway) have been replaced or just plain removed also. The new management now says the company is on the way to a profitable year so I have a feeling things will get pretty ugly if they decide to chop some more and downgrade a ton of pilots. My posts on this subject have not disputed that it might happen to a small degree, but to dispute the very high numbers that were quoted at the beginning of the thread. Can you tell me it is necessary for the company to downgrade 471 (or whatever the number was) pilots now? The majority of pilots would say it isn't necessary and would fight back. I don't think it would get to the point of STFD, but I don't think profits would be realized and management would know exactly why. Good luck moving on and if coming back is what you want, I hope it is sooner rather than later, brother.

 

[DAS at 10/250]

DAS, I am a post '05 hire so I care quite a bit. I waited until the '05 contract and then I came. I wish I would have came earlier, but at least I do still have a job here. I can't say that I trust that it will last. I learned all about having a B plan after two furloughs in '01 and I have a plan now should the egg shells I'm walking on crack.

Can you honestly tell me the company shouldn't have furloughed the pilots that they did? It sucks, but it was necessary and the majority of the pilots understand. Management f'ed up big time and way over hired. Something needed to be done and it was. Along with the furloughs, quite a bit of upper management (the decision makers that exasperated the problems or who were just dead wood anyway) have been replaced or just plain removed also. The new management now says the company is on the way to a profitable year so I have a feeling things will get pretty ugly if they decide to chop some more and downgrade a ton of pilots. My posts on this subject have not disputed that it might happen to a small degree, but to dispute the very high numbers that were quoted at the beginning of the thread. Can you tell me it is necessary for the company to downgrade 471 (or whatever the number was) pilots now? The majority of pilots would say it isn't necessary and would fight back. I don't think it would get to the point of STFD, but I don't think profits would be realized and management would know exactly why. Good luck moving on and if coming back is what you want, I hope it is sooner rather than later, brother.

Sorry, I shouldn't have assumed. I guess I just made an as@ out of myself.:0 I thought (my first mistake) that your next post would tell of pre-05 woes and how you couldn't get hired anywhere else and then had to come to NJA and wait three months for an upgrade.

As a "united" pilot group though our VM participation was pretty pitiful.

The only thing that the company screwed up on the furloughs was the fact that they should have done it a year earlier. And I think the company absolutely should downgrade if they're over the 60/40 split. Now, if the CBA will allow them is another thing.

I don't plan on coming back and I'm not bitter at the company or the pilot group. The company did what they had to do (finally) and the pilot group did what their seniority allowed them to. I didn't realize how much I really hated riding the airlines to work until I stopped doing it though.

Hopefully aviation is behind me now and I can just stick to coming here and jumping on people like you that I shouldn't have.:beer:

 

[imacdog]

First a lesson to ALL that weren't here during the war years at NJA, NEVER AND I MEAN NEVER base your beliefs on information that is PUBLICLY RELEASED BY THE COMPANY. Spouting of sales numbers and projections then assuming they are real is a huge error.

Thanks for the advice, I'm happy to hear the pre-'05 folks at NetJets are the only people in aviation to ever have management lie to them.

 

[CRJFlyer]

Thanks for the advice, I'm happy to hear the pre-'05 folks at NetJets are the only people in aviation to ever have management lie to them.

That's how alot of those guys feel. It's pretty sad really. I've never seen so many Cpts. of the heavy ultra/encore/sover./X who's shi.t didn't smell sweeter.

I could always tell who was former airline and came to NJA in the 2001-2005 period. They were laid back and knew what the deal was (read:they weren't arrogant pricks).

true story: had a 2-3 day overnight in Phoenix. The 2nd night, the Cpt. I was with, tells the desk guy (on the midnight shift) to tell the morning newspaper guy to not drop the paper down so hard by his door! Because it woke him up! I just had to walk away in shame for being associated with the idiot.

 

[FLYLOW22]

That's how alot of those guys feel. It's pretty sad really. I've never seen so many Cpts. of the heavy ultra/encore/sover./X who's shi.t didn't smell sweeter.

I could always tell who was former airline and came to NJA in the 2001-2005 period. They were laid back and knew what the deal was (read:they weren't arrogant pricks).

true story: had a 2-3 day overnight in Phoenix. The 2nd night, the Cpt. I was with, tells the desk guy (on the midnight shift) to tell the morning newspaper guy to not drop the paper down so hard by his door! Because it woke him up! I just had to walk away in shame for being associated with the idiot.

I bet you are a bad pilot.

 

[fischman]

I bet you are a bad pilot.

I'm not. I am awesome.

 

[CRJFlyer]

I bet you are a bad pilot.

Opinions vary

 

[FLYLOW22]

I'm not. I am awesome.

Any good pilot drinks Stag...

and uses VNAV.

 

[marqmarq]

I believe jtf was referring to runway lengths for takeoff and landing.... the straight wing citations can use shorter runways, especially in 135 situations...

 

[RP170]

Not sure if this was already posted in this thread but there is apparently a meeting scheduled on April 19 between the union and company discussing staffing. Prepare for the worst and hope for the best. At least it isn't on a Friday.

 

[AZaviator]

Not sure if this was already posted in this thread but there is apparently a meeting scheduled on April 19 between the union and company discussing staffing. Prepare for the worst and hope for the best. At least it isn't on a Friday.

We saw what happened the last time one of those meetings took place :erm:

 

[RP170]

We saw what happened the last time one of those meetings took place :erm:

Yep. This is so frustrating AZ. If both of us only would have taken those class dates at Allegiant in 07 huh? Shoulda woulda coulda. I'm beginning to fear that my career in aviation is now over due to going to the "last job you'll ever have" company known as NetJets. It was the last job we'll ever have alright, aka career suicide.

 

[grounded92]

Amen on the career suicide

Hello,

Just thought I would post a negative, frustrating post here. Has anybody else had a interviewer bash the NetJet "culture".

During a recent interview I asked if any other NJ guys had applied. The reply I got was- no, because most NJ guys are to lazy, or to good, to apply for most jobs. (not a direct quote, but as close as I can remember) No I didn't get the job, despite being exceptionally over-qualified.

I know NJ had a terrible reputation prior to the 2000s. However, I would have thought the rep would have improved since then, especially with the ibb and pilots participation in the voluntary measures. Maybe I was wrong.

Good luck all,

B

 

[brokeflyer]

well i doubt about the lazy part. NJ pilots are by far the most active in aviation. As far as the "too good" part?, that is true. they are the best in aviation and the reason they dont apply to other aviation jobs is because no other job can afford to pay for their superior skills.