NJA Downgrades

[barnyard]

How many of these weak decision-making pilots really exist at NJA?

50% of the PICS of the fleet I came from.

Yup, every other tour I was paired with a barely competent tool box.

 

[pilotyip]

advantage

Yip, you're one of the few who realized that.

Some of our guys are getting hired in places, but with employers being able to pick and choose, an NJA seniority number does seem to hinder with some companies.

An NJ guy is going to be with us for a long time, if guy stays 3 yrs, it works out of us. Plus they all made Captain.

 

[platinum750]

Sorry boys, I work hard (not the porn star way). I can sit upright for awhile without assistance. Go work somewhere else and embellish your accomlishments. Gear up and how bout some coffee

 

[RP170]

Sorry boys, I work hard (not the porn star way). I can sit upright for awhile without assistance. Go work somewhere else and embellish your accomlishments. Gear up and how bout some coffee

Please fill me in as to where I can find a job Your Royal Highness.

 

[platinum750]

7-11 -----------

 

[OPECJet]

7-11 -----------

Got turned down. Said pilots drank too much coffee and they were afraid we'd steal it.

 

[Outta Here]

Call it what you will. There is a fine line here. We as pilots as a whole are "Get R Done" types. When the sh!t hit the fan as far as the econmy went and the industry toowe went into save the owners mode. Now we might have created a problem by showng how far we are willng to go. Go figure pilots have been screwing themselves snce the 30's. His has nothing to do with the number of furloughs we have though it's not aiding them either. Take it for what's it's worth. I have been filling reports out and will contiue to do so...

 

[NachoMamma]

You, on the other hand, have made it apparent your love for NJA. Most of us 495 feel the opposite.

Of course you do! You're furloughed. It's completely understandable that you'd feel that way (not trying to be a dick here). The same goes for being bitter. No one, at least not me, is going to fault you for that. However, spewing hate and animosity toward NJ does two things. 1. Absolutely nothing to improve your situation. 2. Degrades your character to the point of appearing to be just another low class, disgruntled, fool.

I've lost jobs too before and I'm well aware of the psychological effect it has on your moral and self esteem. It might make you feel a little better to vent once in a while, but continuously spewing out hateful, bitter insults...especially poorly thought out ones, just makes people dismiss you that much sooner. Add to that the "I hope I never come back" crap, and now we're back to roughly age 6. Again, there are alot of folks on these boards who know what you're going through...you aren't the first and won't be the last, but at least try and get a grip dude. Maybe take a step away from the boards for a while...you'll feel better.

 

[Outta Here]

It's obvious there a few of here showing your maturity in this industry. When it comes to getting furloughed a good quote to keep in mind is "those who have and those who will". I find you are and you know who you are, are taking your frustration out o. Who ever will listen by bashing NJA pilts and guys who you have flown with. Sayig 50 percent of guys you have flown with are tools. Have you never flown anywhere else EVERYplace has tools but not that high of numbers nor does this place. I am going to be frank here GET OVER IT. I know it SUX. I have been there and may be there again who knows. It was not the pilots who got us here it was a few few key desision making guys that screwed this place up. The pilot group got the contract we have today that made you want to come here. My advise, this too will pass. No need to respond if it's negative because I DONT CARE!!!!

 

[av8trinabarrel]

Come on CRJ, quit being so bitter about this.....you know and I know that there are plenty of jobs out there to choose from. Its funny how its always the captains of the world who claim that they have been furloughed before and we know how you feel blah blah blah. We have every right to be pissed at this f'n company. I have moved on and out of aviation, so I really don't care anymore about the drama in CMH.

Take it from somebody in your shoes, it will get better and there is definitely life after Santulli. This job market and furlough thing hurts more than macho nacho and the rest of the employed crowd at NJA will ever know. Keep your chin up dude (and the rest of my fellow furloughed aviators looking for work)!

 

[jppt2000]

Come on CRJ, quit being so bitter about this.....you know and I know that there are plenty of jobs out there to choose from. Its funny how its always the captains of the world who claim that they have been furloughed before and we know how you feel blah blah blah. We have every right to be pissed at this f'n company. I have moved on and out of aviation, so I really don't care anymore about the drama in CMH.

Take it from somebody in your shoes, it will get better and there is definitely life after Santulli. This job market and furlough thing hurts more than macho nacho and the rest of the employed crowd at NJA will ever know. Keep your chin up dude (and the rest of my fellow furloughed aviators looking for work)!

Wow, how inspiring!
I don't think anyone here supports the last management regime's decision to hire folks away from stable employment.

 

[rajflyboy]

I'm hearing more "Sputtering" from the mouth out of OSU land. And not good news.

 

[RideandDrive]

I'm hearing the same thing from decent sources.

 

[grounded92]

Found a Gem in this steaming pile

Perhaps if people are afraid to fatigue because they're scared of filing a report, they shouldn't be making command decisions in the first place.

Great point! Unfortunately there are few ways to address weakness in the left seat, or right seat for that matter. But that brings up the a general question.

Why are pilots' salaries directly connected to the seat they sit in. This practice forces all pilots into a command role despite the fact that different personality types are better suited to lead while some prefer a support role. We blast weak captains all the time but I promise some of those crappy captains were great co-pilots and would love to go back to that role.

When i taught at FSI I had a type-b pilot who was probably also an introvert. I'm guessing introvert because this pilots mind processed information slower but more completely. Anyway, this pilot sticks out because they were fantastic support (perhaps the best I have seen) from the right seat where there was a little bit of time to finish the mental processes. However, when flying and commanding from the left this pilot looked lost, weak and indecisive. Night and day.

This pilot took a captain upgrade because that is the only way to get the money. I have heard thru the grapevine how terrible this pilot performs on the line. But remember ot all pilots are captains, some are terrific co-pilots.

 

[grounded92]

Just finished cleaning out my shorts and rinsing my shoes

Come on CRJ, quit being so bitter about this.....you know and I know that there are plenty of jobs out there to choose from. QUOTE]

Missed the rolling eyed smiley face the first time! Soiled myself real good!

Prior to this furlough I had been out of work a total of maybe 3 days in my whole working life. This job market is a new age, stinky sh#thole of mess. At another time perhaps the furlough wouldn't have been so bad, but this market is worse than the news makes it out to be!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Willy21]

I'm hearing the same thing from decent sources.

Any chance you will expand on what you source said?

 

[rajflyboy]

Any chance you will expand on what you source said?

any chance that the folks that are paid 1.6 % out of every pilots pocket will some day communicate??

 

[RP170]

any chance that the folks that are paid 1.6 % out of every pilots pocket will some day communicate??

Nah....they are still in the honeymoon phase with Sokol. Remember, he is such a great guy and they are confident will turn the business around. Sure, NetJets is profitable now but it was mainly accomplished on the backs of the employees with more to come. The place is no different than any mismanged airline at this point.

Meanwhile, Avant, Flex, and Citation Air have unveiled new card programs and marketing strategies all geared towards a struggling NetJets. What has been done at NJA in response? Nothing but cuts, cuts, and more cuts. Looks like the typically airline CEO mentality to me.

Better count on about 10 years for any hopes of a recall. I'm moving on with my life. Just chalking this one up as the worst career decision I ever made when I chose to come work at the pyramid scheme known as NJA instead of taking the offer I had from Allegiant (or even staying where I was) a few years ago.

 

[B19 Flyer]

Wow, how inspiring!
I don't think anyone here supports the last management regime's decision to hire folks away from stable employment.

Pilot staffing is governed by the work rules in the contract and not just by some whimsical hiring projection. It's done by cold hard facts.

NJ is by far, the highest pilot per airframe in the fractional industry. NJ managment had to hire pilots that no other fractional would have based on contract rules.
The additional pilots pulled away from stable employment was based on the contract vs. projected flying. As a result, NJ was "fat" by hundreds of pilots and most importantly, could not cut back because of the contract.

Now it's all coming home to roost... don't blame management, blame the inability of the NJ to adjust as a result of the union contract. These furloughs are union related, not the result of poor management by the company. Place the proper blame where it belongs.

Union 101. Squeeze the golden goose till it can no longer lay eggs.

 

[Pervis]

Pilot staffing is indeed in the contract. Just not the CBA, but rather our owner contracts. Wrong again.

 

[jonjuan]

Pilot staffing is indeed in the contract. Just not the CBA, but rather our owner contracts. Wrong again.

No it's not. Yet another urban legend that has zero basis in fact. I have seen a contract and it's nowhere to be found. Prove us wrong. Also no where on the Marquis contract. Once again, someone' lying to you.

 

[rajflyboy]

Pilot staffing is governed by the work rules in the contract and not just by some whimsical hiring projection. It's done by cold hard facts.

NJ is by far, the highest pilot per airframe in the fractional industry. NJ managment had to hire pilots that no other fractional would have based on contract rules.
The additional pilots pulled away from stable employment was based on the contract vs. projected flying. As a result, NJ was "fat" by hundreds of pilots and most importantly, could not cut back because of the contract.

Now it's all coming home to roost... don't blame management, blame the inability of the NJ to adjust as a result of the union contract. These furloughs are union related, not the result of poor management by the company. Place the proper blame where it belongs.

Union 101. Squeeze the golden goose till it can no longer lay eggs.

You appear to be forgetting the years of 150 million dollar profits after this contract was signed.

 

[jonjuan]

You appear to be forgetting the years of 150 million dollar profits after this contract was signed.

You mean during the peak period of spending by corporations and weatlthy individuals? What do you think njas profits would if they had signed the contract in 2008? Also, with the same contract in place, where are the profits now? Heck, every frax was profitable in 2005,2006. I also suppose flops will be profitable now, especially with wages (and magically pricing) 30% less than that of nj.

 

[fischman]

Pilot staffing is governed by the work rules in the contract and not just by some whimsical hiring projection. It's done by cold hard facts.

NJ is by far, the highest pilot per airframe in the fractional industry. NJ managment had to hire pilots that no other fractional would have based on contract rules.
The additional pilots pulled away from stable employment was based on the contract vs. projected flying. As a result, NJ was "fat" by hundreds of pilots and most importantly, could not cut back because of the contract.

Now it's all coming home to roost... don't blame management, blame the inability of the NJ to adjust as a result of the union contract. These furloughs are union related, not the result of poor management by the company. Place the proper blame where it belongs.

Union 101. Squeeze the golden goose till it can no longer lay eggs.

Wrong again B19.

The only thing in the CBA that governs staffing levels at NetJets is 5 pilots per airplane (which I HIGHLY doubt the company could function at that low staffing level.)

The company can hire or furlough at will. Nothing the union can do about it. If you're going to spew crap like you're an authority, at least do your homework so you don't look foolish.

Butt handed to you.

 

[rajflyboy]

I guess we all sit back and drink coffee and wait until the meeting next week.

And then we wait for the company Text Message that will come with the facts.

 

[gret]

Wrong again B19.

The only thing in the CBA that governs staffing levels at NetJets is 5 pilots per airplane (which I HIGHLY doubt the company could function at that low staffing level.)

The company can hire or furlough at will. Nothing the union can do about it. If you're going to spew crap like you're an authority, at least do your homework so you don't look foolish.

Butt handed to you.

When you are in a hole, stop digging!

In case you haven't notice, you are trying to lead, but nobody is following.

 

[jonjuan]

When you are in a hole, stop digging!

In case you haven't notice, you are trying to lead, but nobody is following.

LOL- so, what's the opposite of awesome?

 

[rajflyboy]

I think most of us would be happy if the information flowed from the proper channels. Unfortunately this just isn't the case. Honestly it hasn't been the case for a couple of years.

 

[Flex-ible]

The only thing in the CBA that governs staffing levels at NetJets is 5 pilots per airplane (which I HIGHLY doubt the company could function at that low staffing level.)

.

I think Flex aims for something like 4.3 per plane. If it were 5, I might still be there!

 

[fischman]

When you are in a hole, stop digging!

In case you haven't notice, you are trying to lead, but nobody is following.

I'm just stating facts. I realize the truth is not common on FI.com. If you don't like it, feel free to put me on your ignore list.