Looking for Hawaiian A321 Pay Rates

[waveflyer]

Disparate fleet as in (not Boeing). Not a deal breaker by any means, but certainly a consideration. HNL hub operation that is perfect for an Airline named Hawaiian, but much less ideal for an Airline like Southwest even if we were considering adding Asian Destinations. As has already been stated, you would have to continue to run Hawaiian as it's own brand in order to be successful in the islands. I also don't think our management is interested in running multiple brands on a permanent basis. Most of the other reasons have already been talked about by Dan and Jim.

I comprehend it dan just fine- I just have a different view.
To me a purchase is all about differences that compliment each other

I'm in the maybe, but probably not category and I don't know why that's getting pushback

I'm not trying to spool Dan up, I just view it as likely as many other possibilities

 

[BentOver]

This is what happens when an airline, that has never left the CONUS, gets their first semi foreign destination.. I say semi foreign because you may need a passport but really it's just across the border.....:beer:

In other news.... Hawaiian's just gained more inter-island market share with the dissolving of GO! Airlines.....Mokulele has code share agreements with Go! for smaller islands... So who knows how this will affect Mokulele... either way it should equate to atleast a few hundred more pax a day for HA...

Also Airbus has started final assembly for the first A320NEO ( or is it A321NEO?)

Here's to hoping Hawaiian can pick up some before the 2017 scheduled date.....

 

[Dan Roman]

I comprehend it dan just fine- I just have a different view.
To me a purchase is all about differences that compliment each other

I'm in the maybe, but probably not category and I don't know why that's getting pushback

I'm not trying to spool Dan up, I just view it as likely as many other possibilities

Wave, I'm not spooled up at all. I'm enjoying this as it's about Hawaiian. The one airline I happen to know a little about and I don't hold your wistful speculation against you. i stress that my pointing out the realities of why a merger is highly unlucky is not a slam against SWA and I don' t fault your seeing things through SWA colored glasses. But you ask why the pushback? Let's say Skywest said they were going to buy SWA and made all theses promises that they were going to have this great domestic airline and grow etc etc., how would you feel?

 

[HAL]

Also Airbus has started final assembly for the first A320NEO ( or is it A321NEO?)

Here's to hoping Hawaiian can pick up some before the 2017 scheduled date.....

It's an A320NEO that's coming out first. The 321 won't be out until late 2016, and HA is one of the first customers. We won't get it any earlier than we're contracted for.

HAL

 

[fr8doggie]

It's an A320NEO that's coming out first. The 321 won't be out until late 2016, and HA is one of the first customers. We won't get it any earlier than we're contracted for.

HAL

Gary Kelly already sold those slots to B6 and purchased more 737MAX slots with the proceeds.

 

[HA25]

I comprehend it dan just fine- I just have a different view.
To me a purchase is all about differences that compliment each other

I'm in the maybe, but probably not category and I don't know why that's getting pushback

I'm not trying to spool Dan up, I just view it as likely as many other possibilities

Wave, you knew me better as FMS-Speed, I changed my name after being hired at HAL. I can tell you having finally gotten to meet "Dan" after reading his posts on here for years That he's the last guy to wind up about anything. A more laid back, chill tempered person you'll never meet. With his HAL regulation beard and disarming smile he's exactly the face I want on my airline. Don't mistake his defense of our "good thing" as an insult against yours. This company provides for some of the best flying anyone can do (I know a thing or two about this with 7 airlines behind me now)... Guys don't necessarily jump at the idea of a merger here like at some other smaller carriers.... Cause while we're small in some respects, we're huge in others... One of the oldest, safest, airlines... The pilots here have always toted or even set the bar for wages and work rules...we never just rode on someone's coat tails... We have a lot to be proud of, don't confuse that for an attack on you.. But just remember, while WN was still tuning their business plan and growing into a "Major" Hawaiian was flying DC8's and L1011's all over the world...

 

[HighSpeedClimb]

Just curious, weren't they also in BK 3 times, or was it more, and had the State of Hawaii bail them out with a loan Guarantee of $25M. Just sayin. Every airline has its prob whether now or in the past, and definitely in the future. It gets old when airline pilots tout how great their company is. Just be glad you're flying and pulling in a paycheck because at the end of the day that's all that matters, not how cool your destinations are or the equipment you fly.
Btw... Nobody is Drooling to merge or acquire anyone.
Good luck ya'll

 

[HA25]

Just curious, weren't they also in BK 3 times, or was it more, and had the State of Hawaii bail them out with a loan Guarantee of $25M. Just sayin. Every airline has its prob whether now or in the past, and definitely in the future. It gets old when airline pilots tout how great their company is. Just be glad you're flying and pulling in a paycheck because at the end of the day that's all that matters, not how cool your destinations are or the equipment you fly.

Such a defeatist attitude... Be glad? You kidding me?? I've spent the better part of two decades not being glad... Including a stint at the big AA... I'm never glad, I always want more and always am looking for better for myself.. Glad..pft.

2 BKs in better than 85!years... The 2nd one a total farse to get better rates on leases from Boeing, and the pilots got thrown under the bus by the BK courts for added measure. The company was profitable at the time if that BK... There was no bailout.

Btw... Nobody is Drooling to merge or acquire anyone.
Good luck ya'll

Lies

 

[FlyinGuy]

Just relax......HA will have a fence so you won't be displaced to BWI for at least 18 months!!


Just pulling y'all's chain b4 you go and blow a gasket.

 

[Dan Roman]

Just curious, weren't they also in BK 3 times, or was it more, and had the State of Hawaii bail them out with a loan Guarantee of $25M. Just sayin. Every airline has its prob whether now or in the past, and definitely in the future. It gets old when airline pilots tout how great their company is. Just be glad you're flying and pulling in a paycheck because at the end of the day that's all that matters, not how cool your destinations are or the equipment you fly.
Btw... Nobody is Drooling to merge or acquire anyone.
Good luck ya'll

While you are obviously mistaken about the 3 BK's and State bailout, I have to agree that it is a little embarrassing to be blatantly touting HA, I do it here when misinformation is posted (like you just did) and also in defense of anyone who posts they think their airline could buy us. Your drooling comment is wrong too. The point of my posts is because some SWA pilots have been posting about buying Hawaiian. We have been hearing for years how DAL wants to buy HA. The truth is, it's all simply generated by pilots "drooling" over buying HA. I work here, I hear pilots "drooling" over buying HA often.
I also agree with your observation that what or were you fly shouldn't define you. We have a good deal here. As you said, none of us can predict the future, but ours is as bright as anyones (and are just as vulnerable) we all live in glass houses. But the majority of Hawaiian Air pilots are here because of the unique lifestyle flying for HA can offer and we don't want to see that go away.


Thanks HA25! :beer:

 

[waveflyer]

Wave, I'm not spooled up at all. I'm enjoying this as it's about Hawaiian. The one airline I happen to know a little about and I don't hold your wistful speculation against you. i stress that my pointing out the realities of why a merger is highly unlucky is not a slam against SWA and I don' t fault your seeing things through SWA colored glasses. But you ask why the pushback? Let's say Skywest said they were going to buy SWA and made all theses promises that they were going to have this great domestic airline and grow etc etc., how would you feel?

So Skywest is to SWA as SWA is to HAL?

I think you just failed your fedex interview my man


Do you think you have some HAL colored glasses?

When I say it's a possibility - it's bc of the financials
And on that end - the Skywest example is kinda silly right?

 

[Dan Roman]

So Skywest is to SWA as SWA is to HAL?

I think you just failed your fedex interview my man

I just used that as an example of an airline you would not want to merge with, but is, in fact very successful at what they do. Skywest pilots saying they want to merge and come fly your 737's would be a similar deal to SWA pilots saying they want to merge and come fly our airplanes.
SWA doesn't bring anything to the table that we would want. Again, not a slam. It's just apples and oranges is the point.

 

[HA25]

So Skywest is to SWA as SWA is to HAL?

I think you just failed your fedex interview my man

Career expectations my friend... career expectations. That's been behind EVERY SLI arbitration in recent memories and why HAL pilots will not be MIA in 2015.. mark my words. A 12+ Year CA at HAL (pretty much all of them) will have the same expectations as any DAL, UAL, AA, or Southwest pilot for that matter.. We have guys who've been here 30 years and 2... not one of them will get stapled behind anyone at any carrier if/when we get bought/merged.

 

[HA25]

So Skywest is to SWA as SWA is to HAL?

I think you just failed your fedex interview my man

btw wave.. you still trolling the politics forums here? dealing with all of those reactionaries? You know part of the reason I was fired by Mike was constantly defending you over there, don't you?

 

[waveflyer]

Fired by mike?
Wow

Hey man - congrats on HAL brother
Your description of dan is exactly what I'd imagine actually-
Hawaiian pilots I've known are seriously cool

Yeah- I just can't get into the nonav chat there anymore- just doesn't float my boat

 

[Dan Roman]

Although....if I had to go from my present position at HA to the left seat of a SWA 737 it would probably be as big a bummer as going from SWA to SkyWest would be. Keep in mind my perception of SkyWest is, for the senior pilots, a very good job and they consider it a career.
As high speed climb alluded too, it's kind of silly to define yourself by what you fly, but your job is the vehicle that allows you to create whatever lifestyle you have.

 

[Dan Roman]

Career expectations my friend... career expectations. That's been behind EVERY SLI arbitration in recent memories and why HAL pilots will not be MIA in 2015.. mark my words. A 12+ Year CA at HAL (pretty much all of them) will have the same expectations as any DAL, UAL, AA, or Southwest pilot for that matter.. We have guys who've been here 30 years and 2... not one of them will get stapled behind anyone at any carrier if/when we get bought/merged.

Actually, since the SWA topic is on the burner, we would have a much stronger "career expectations" card to play. We are the only ones with a HNL base obviously so all the flying out of Hawaii would be "our" career expectations". We have enough AirBuses on firm order that the company has officially put out that they will have a seniority list of just over a 1000 pilots by 2020 (currently 620 or so?) plus I'm guessing a couple hundred retirements by then. Finally, all the widebody flying is "our" career expectation. I have to wonder how the SWA folks would take that? Probably not well, so here's another reason why the merger would be foolish.....even more damage to the "culture" than merging with AirTran did.
Wave, you guys need to stick to what you have been successful at and not try and steal what others have been successful at.

 

[waveflyer]

Career expectations my friend... career expectations. That's been behind EVERY SLI arbitration in recent memories and why HAL pilots will not be MIA in 2015.. mark my words. A 12+ Year CA at HAL (pretty much all of them) will have the same expectations as any DAL, UAL, AA, or Southwest pilot for that matter.. We have guys who've been here 30 years and 2... not one of them will get stapled behind anyone at any carrier if/when we get bought/merged.

They won't?

Then you understand what the air tran uproar was about.
AT wanted to be ahead of our 30 year guys bc their relative seniority puts them there

 

[HA25]

Fired by mike?
Wow

Hey man - congrats on HAL brother
Your description of dan is exactly what I'd imagine actually-
Hawaiian pilots I've known are seriously cool

Yeah- I just can't get into the nonav chat there anymore- just doesn't float my boat

best thing ever happened to me too... I got sick of baby sitting a bunch of trolls.. most of those chumps don't even fly professionally, you know that? Mike didn't care, was more interested in post counts and hits.. I told him he's lost a lot of real pilots to the other forum, but after I banned TMMT for something out of line he yanked my mod and re-instated him.

on the HAL / WN topic.. srsly.. I have a lot of respect for the WN guys.. went form being the ugly girl at the end of the bar after a long night of drinking in 2001 to a top paid narrow body pilot group... frankly doing more to hold up the bar than the us guys at the Legacies over the past 13 years.. But then, you guys were also the ones behind all of this high productivity pushing that frankly we're still trying to undo... I don't know about you all, but I didnt' become an airline pilot to work 20+ days a month like my land lover friends.. Yes, I do want to work 12 days and get paid for 85 hours.. so sue me!

 

[HA25]

They won't?

Then you understand what the air tran uproar was about.
AT wanted to be ahead of our 30 year guys bc their relative seniority puts them there

it's not about seniority... its' about pay/workrules/benefits.

HAL captains make A LOT more than Airtran captains, far better retirement, medical, etc ... and with far better schedules.. Expectations are more than my equipment,. This is why USAir East 330 captains will be grossly disappointed ... $150/hr doesn't go far in the "Expectations" dept.