How to get the union on property!

[Hawkered]

No. It's like insurance. Unions offer a process of checks and balances so that you and your livelihood don't get lost in the corporate shuffle. We have paid for that insurance with our dues. If you don't have that same insurance..you wont be protected in a buy out.

None of you have to join the union yet, but if we had a merger, our scope clause and craft protections will not allow you to fly any of our aircraft unless you become a dues paying union member.

 

[Humphreybogart]

Bogart---I won't chime in and say anything about CS, because I don't work there. All I ask is you don't chime in and say anything about Flops. There was no raise coming to us---period! Don't speak about what you don't know!

I'm just going by what my friends at FLOPS and other FLOPS pilots told me on the road. A big announcement was comming on January 31. Not trying to stir any rumors here.

 

[theo]

No. It's like insurance. Unions offer a process of checks and balances so that you and your livelihood don't get lost in the corporate shuffle. We have paid for that insurance with our dues. If you don't have that same insurance..you wont be protected in a buy out.

None of you have to join the union yet, but if we had a merger, our scope clause and craft protections will not allow you to fly any of our aircraft unless you become a dues paying union member.

Seems like that is what the mafia calls it "insurance" when they are out getting "protection" money from the poor store owner in the Godfather!

 

[Guitar rocker]

much of the fractional and corporate industry has reaped the rewards from our fight. With that in mind, why should we have all quit??? We have made it better, havent we???

Rocker, you made it better at NJ. It was already good at CS, so quit patting yourself on the back. Just remember one thing, if a company wants to be ugly to its employees, it doesn't matter if you're union or nonunion, they have ways to get what they want. I speak from experience. Now let the name calling begin!

Wait a minute junior, we made it better at NJA, but also at Flex and other corporate outfits too. Obviously as YOU have pointed out, we had zero impact on your pay.....it was all just coincidence! Yah, not one of us at NJA can possibly pat themselves on the back for what YOU got! Do YOU really have experience in anything???? I like the, "I speak from experience" thing...........you must be referring to your most recent CFI or 711 days...which were probably only a few short months ago.

As you said, "JUST REMEMBER ONE THING," a company with a union is going to have a much harder time trying to make things "ugly" for someone. One without a union, can make it "ugly" at the drop of a hat.........thats what happens when there are no rules to go by. We had a situation where it got real "ugly" for someone........our union pilots got him back on the payroll. Who do you guys have that can speak for one of your own like THAT?

 

[Guitar rocker]

Seems like that is what the mafia calls it "insurance" when they are out getting "protection" money from the poor store owner in the Godfather!

Theo, are you that stupid so as to not understand what Hawkered is getting at??? Guess the only way for you to possibly get it through that thick skull of yours if for your company to be bought out and lets see where you fall then. Your poor store owner and Godfather thing are truly pathetic. Cant you at least listen to someone elses point???

 

[netjetwife]

In all honesty, where, other than FLOPS, is their a "battle" in the fractional industry? Nj got what they wanted, CS got what they wanted (without having to fight for it I might add), and FLEX is seeing a raise as well. There is one frac company that is being dumped on. It's really too bad for them and I feel bad for them. Like I said before, I have some friends at FLOPS. On the company side, FLOPS management was going to give them some sort of compensation in reflect of what the rest of the industry was doing, but when they found out about the union inquiries, they took it away. So maybe without the union thing, they would have gotten their just due. The thought of the union screwed it up for the FLOPS people. NJW, please step down from the union soapbox and look at things through open eyes. No union here.

By a "battle" ...do notice the use of quotations marks to signal it is a symbolic meaning...I was referring to the "fight" at Flex and Options, whose pilots are trying to join 1108. We've heard you loud and clear (I'm seeing that parrot named Bogart squawking in my mind's eye..) Bogart. Don't be so paranoid. I wasn't speaking of CR. However, should the name come that pilots there decide they'd also like to join their counterparts in 1108, I will support their cause, as well.

SELF-DETERMINATION IS A WORKPLACE RIGHT

 

[604driver]

By self-determination does this mean the union wants an open shop at Flex?

 

[netjetwife]

The particulars of organizing, I leave to 1108 and the leaders among the different pilot groups. By self-determination I meant the right to have a voice in the job details--work rules, pay, and QOL issues-- that for most frac pilots are currently left solely up to the discretion of the company. The pilots should have a say in their career--beyond the choice of "take it or leave it".

 

[jetwash]

So maybe without the union thing, they would have gotten their just due. The thought of the union screwed it up for the FLOPS people. .

The company had no intention to give the Flight Opts pilot a raise.

They could have come out in October when the NJ TA was published but they didn't. It was not until they figured out that the union was a real possibility that they came up with a plan to try to delay as much as possible that is why they said an announcement would be out in 31 January.

You would not have heard the word raise without first hearing the word union at Flight Options.

We owe thanks to our organizers and IBT 1108 as well as the NJ pilots. They did more than Flight Options management did to bring up the issue of pilot raises.

 

[dime line]

Jetwash......well said

 

[netjetwife]

I see hope for the pilots at Options. Just look at how far the NJ pilots came! Even if they did have to drag management kicking and screaming all the way to a fair contract It is possible and the pressure of the new industry standard should make it easier for the other frac pilots who choose to follow the example set by StrongUnion.

Watching the tide rise ,
Netjetwife

 

[gunfyter]

STRONG UNION

makes flying

More $Rewarding$​

 

[Spyguy]

No. It's like insurance. Unions offer a process of checks and balances so that you and your livelihood don't get lost in the corporate shuffle. We have paid for that insurance with our dues. If you don't have that same insurance..you wont be protected in a buy out.

None of you have to join the union yet, but if we had a merger, our scope clause and craft protections will not allow you to fly any of our aircraft unless you become a dues paying union member.

I am not arguing for or against union on this thread, but I would like to point out an error in the statement above. You nor any scope clause can force anyone to join a union or not work, unless you are planning on changing laws. From what I understand, you can not make someone join a union, but they still have to pay the same dues, but no union protection. It's called the right to work.

 

[FracCapt]

I'm just going by what my friends at FLOPS and other FLOPS pilots told me on the road. A big announcement was comming on January 31. Not trying to stir any rumors here.

Our CEO stated recently at a company meeting that they had come up with a new compensation package, but Raytheon immediately shot it down. No way, no how, not gonna happen. He then stated that "we're seeing what we can do". Screw that.

Raytheon is good at this game....they've been doing it for many, many years with all types of employees and unions. The only way to beat them at this game is to stand firm and vote in the Union. If you don't like it.....well, who cares? You have no dog in this fight.

 

[XPGuy]

[/b]

I am not arguing for or against union on this thread, but I would like to point out an error in the statement above. You nor any scope clause can force anyone to join a union or not work, unless you are planning on changing laws. From what I understand, you can not make someone join a union, but they still have to pay the same dues, but no union protection. It's called the right to work.

Yes and no. You can make a company a "union shop" - all employees pay the union dues whether they want to or not, but if they want to opt out of the union, they pay a "tribute" to the union, but are not "in" it... now, why would you want to "donate" 1.5% of your pay to a union and then not get the protection that comes with it? I guess if you are that adamant to not be a member of one, that's fine.

Wouldn't it be ironic that someone did that, and then the company gets bought, or worse, that pilot bends up an airplane - the union will NOT help that individual.

So, you are right, I guess, but boy, that person would not be very smart throwing away the insurance he's already paying for.