Does JetBlue have career FO's?

[skykid]

All right I'll agree with that. It just seems that sometimes there are those at United that pretend that these hiringpractices either didn't not exist or they minimize it greatly.

Where do you get your information? How many times have you walked into United Ops in ORD and looked at all the folks in there?

I don't deny that United had an intern program. A handful of motivated pilots used that program to get hired with 2,000 hours instead of 3,000 or more. GOOD FOR THEM!!! Wish I'd been that smart. If it makes you feel better to believe United hired a bunch of folks with only C150 time, believe it - whatever gets you through the day.

I met a guy when I was in the process of getting hired at United that didn't know I had anything to do with the company. He referred to United as "Yo-nited." When I asked about what that meant, he said Yo-nited was only interested in hiring a certain type of person. Come to find out, he had his application in for years and wasn't getting called. Had to be somebody else's fault, huh. Sound familiar?

 

[MRYFLYER]

Skykid,

You hit the nail on the head. Too many feel they were not hired at UAL because UAL was hiring "others". However, when you look at the group that makes up the major hiring portion of the late 80's early 90's most are avg. white males. However, that does not justify their arguement that it was somebody elses fault they were hired.

I recently had an ex millitary academy F/O that was hired in the early 90's. He was turned down his first time through the process and after spending several days in close company with this gentleman I believe I understand why he was not hire the first time he interviewed. While he was an excellent stick and rudder guy his attitude and demeanor did not convey well. Did the interviewer see this same thing the first time he tried?

 

[Guitar rocker]

As far as United.... in the late 90's Pilots of all types would give their left arm to work there. United's ranks are filled with saome of the most experienced Pilots in the world.... period. Pilots everywhere owe them for the indusrty leading contract that they were able to obtain.... even if it wasn't sustainable.... it gives some sort of reference of what Industry leaders means.

To deny any of this is ridiculous and insulting to anyone with any sort of industry knowledge. If you read Skykids post above... it sums it up so accurately.

Ciao!

Most experienced in the world? What? Are you kidding me?

What other major US airline had a college intern program like that of UAL? Or hired minorities over a law suit that UAL lost? Or had minimums on their application looking for 250TT with no turbine/PIC required?

I know that UAL hired some pretty good folks too, dont get me wrong there and yes, there are some really good guys there as well. But as an example, I flew in the JS on a 727 from ORF-ORD about 8 years ago or so. The co-pilot did not know how to get pick up the clnc to ORD and the cptn had to take care of it. It blew me away....and no, it's no joke. Doesnt matter what race or minority the person was, it's just that how could we say that such an individual was experienced? Another chk I know got hired at UAL with 800TT and 15 multi.....how is that fair to place an individual with that type of experience in a 727 with 150 people in the back? If the public only knew who was up front there in some cases. Was airlining on an A320 from IAD to BOS....co-pilots english was NOT good at all. I decided to listen to your channel 5 is it? Oh boy, that was so embarrassing.....I have never heard a controller chew out a pilot quite like that but he was really screwed up.He actually did the PA and that is what made me want to actually listen to that ATC channel. Was terrible.

I really wouldnt say that UAL has the most experienced pilots out there based on the above.

 

[koko nw]

[
I really wouldnt say that UAL has the most experienced pilots out there based on the above.[/quote]

Please tell me your kidding? You actually think people believe your jumpseat "stories' and it some how validates your thesis above?

 

[MRYFLYER]

But as an example, I flew in the JS on a 727 from ORF-ORD about 8 years ago or so. The co-pilot did not know how to get pick up the clnc to ORD and the cptn had to take care of it.

We have been using PDC for well over 15 years at ORD. At 8 years ago the 727's all had the newer touch screen ACARS so that means the S/O was the person getting the clearance from the box and not a radio. So as they say on Mythbusters.....Busted!

 

[Guitar rocker]

We have been using PDC for well over 15 years at ORD. At 8 years ago the 727's all had the newer touch screen ACARS so that means the S/O was the person getting the clearance from the box and not a radio. So as they say on Mythbusters.....Busted!

Nope, it was FO...he couldnt do it. Period.

 

[Guitar rocker]

[
I really wouldnt say that UAL has the most experienced pilots out there based on the above.

Please tell me your kidding? You actually think people believe your jumpseat "stories' and it some how validates your thesis above?[/quote]

You can believe it or not, makes zero difference to me.

Tell me there koo koo, what other major US airline had 250TT required time on their app and hired a lot of just recip types? Why is it that so many other airlines required 1000 PIC turbine time?

Fact is, like I said, ofcourse you guys have plenty of experienced guys....throw in some of the college and low time wonders in that total, and now you dont have "the most experienced" guys/gals out there. Simple as that. I do admire your attempts to back up the inexperienced you have....but it doesnt work. Try again.

 

[FDJ2]

Tell me there koo koo, what other major US airline had 250TT required time on their app and hired a lot of just recip types? .

You seem to be an expert on UAL hiring, could you please tell us what the average age and experience was of a UAL new hire? Pick whatever year you have the data on that. Also how many 250TT pilots did UAL hire in the 1990s and how many total pilots did UAL hire during that time frame? How many pilots are on the UAL senioroty list, how many are white males, African Americans, Hispanic or women?

 

[Blue Dude]

We have been using PDC for well over 15 years at ORD. At 8 years ago the 727's all had the newer touch screen ACARS so that means the S/O was the person getting the clearance from the box and not a radio. So as they say on Mythbusters.....Busted!

Well, not to defend Guitar, because I don't know what he did or did not see. But he did say ORF to ORD, so it's quite possible that 8 yrs ago you couldn't pick up a PDC in ORF (not ORD). There's still a number of airports where that's still the case and you have to do it the old fashioned way. So, not busted.

 

[MRYFLYER]

Well, not to defend Guitar, because I don't know what he did or did not see. But he did say ORF to ORD, so it's quite possible that 8 yrs ago you couldn't pick up a PDC in ORF (not ORD). There's still a number of airports where that's still the case and you have to do it the old fashioned way. So, not busted.

I read his post as ORD ORF. In any event I highly doubt his J/S version. However, I do have a question for him. With such an event occuring prior to pushback would it not have been proper for him to remove himself from such a dangerous flight? Also, it sounds as if GT has since this experience set foot onboard a UAL flight. Appears he is taking his life in his hands by doing so according to his version of the facts.

We all have people with accents. I have heard "Comb-Air" just recently, various versions of english and some really Pi$$ Poor southern "Annnnglish" by a LCC pilot in the past couple of weeks.

Even with the controversial hiring that now has most of those employees with 15 years seniority, UAL has been fortunate to not have had a hull loss from a crew issue in many many years. Have there been near misses? Sure. But of the other carriers in our peer group we have excelled in saves versus hull loss. This is a stat that does not come easily when flying to diverse sections of the world with human factors playing a large role in long haul flying and the accident rates.

I hope GT does not have to endanger himself in the future with a seat of the pants flight on the good ol' U.

 

[Guitar rocker]

You seem to be an expert on UAL hiring, could you please tell us what the average age and experience was of a UAL new hire? Pick whatever year you have the data on that. Also how many 250TT pilots did UAL hire in the 1990s and how many total pilots did UAL hire during that time frame? How many pilots are on the UAL senioroty list, how many are white males, African Americans, Hispanic or women?

No, no expert on your hiring at all. It doesnt matter if someone was African American or a woman that got hired with little time...it's just the fact that it happened and your airline allowed it to happen. Dont question me about the 250TT....that was YOUR deal, not mine.

As for how to break down your seniority list......you have it, why dont you look and tell us? All I can tell you is that everytime I reluctantly have to airline on UAL, I see plenty of those that were "more qualified" running around the terminals at ORD/DEN and some of your other destinations as well.

 

[Guitar rocker]

I read his post as ORD ORF. In any event I highly doubt his J/S version. However, I do have a question for him. With such an event occuring prior to pushback would it not have been proper for him to remove himself from such a dangerous flight? Also, it sounds as if GT has since this experience set foot onboard a UAL flight. Appears he is taking his life in his hands by doing so according to his version of the facts.

We all have people with accents. I have heard "Comb-Air" just recently, various versions of english and some really Pi$$ Poor southern "Annnnglish" by a LCC pilot in the past couple of weeks.

Even with the controversial hiring that now has most of those employees with 15 years seniority, UAL has been fortunate to not have had a hull loss from a crew issue in many many years. Have there been near misses? Sure. But of the other carriers in our peer group we have excelled in saves versus hull loss. This is a stat that does not come easily when flying to diverse sections of the world with human factors playing a large role in long haul flying and the accident rates.

I hope GT does not have to endanger himself in the future with a seat of the pants flight on the good ol' U.

It's not that I feel unsafe at all. But from a professional standpoint, one does have to wonder when we all hear poor english over the PA and over your ATC channel....I think there are some occasions when it might be best that your ATC channel is turned off as in the above case.

Remember, I wouldnt consider it dangerous if someone doesnt know how to pick up an IFR clearance from ORF - ORD (just to clarify for those who cant read it correctly) but at that level, wouldnt yah think that this would be a no-brainer? I mean, maybe it isnt, I dont know how your GOM reads. I'm sure that he's a pro at it by now.

MrFLYER, I wish that I would have recorded that event just for you and I would have proudly posted it right here.

Like I said, I am not bagging on the majority of people at UAL.....just the minority (no pun intended) and what happened there at Martin Luther King BLVD (where yah all did your hiring) and where so many good people who paid their dues got turned down to make way for the VERY less qualified....

 

[FDJ2]

No, no expert on your hiring at all. It doesnt matter if someone was African American or a woman that got hired with little time...it's just the fact that it happened and your airline allowed it to happen. Dont question me about the 250TT....that was YOUR deal, not mine.

Sorry Guitar Rocker, but I don't work at UAL, I was just questioning your knowledge of UAL hiring, since you seem to be so opinionated on the subject. Apparently you know very little about hiring at UAL, but you do like to shoot from the hip and opine without any real information.

 

[Guitar rocker]

Sorry Guitar Rocker, but I don't work at UAL, I was just questioning your knowledge of UAL hiring, since you seem to be so opinionated on the subject. Apparently you know very little about hiring at UAL, but you do like to shoot from the hip and opine without any real information.

I simply know what the application called for. I know some folks who got hired at UAL with little time and likewise, know some others with plenty of time who got turned down.....as we probably all do. I would really like to know how an interviewer could justify their choice of candidate though....one with little time over so many with experience. If you cant see that, then you must be missing something up there.

 

[dgs]

Shall we change the title of this thread to "United hiring practices?" It doesn't have much to do with JetBlue at all.