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MedFlyer said:Not really a comparable situation as Air Canada has a near monopoly and the Canadian gov't would never have allowed them to liquidate.
But for more accurate comparisons...take a look at UAL and USAirways. Do you see them buying up lots of new planes? No. They've deferred deliveries for many, many years into the future. Even healthier carriers like AA aren't buying up planes. AA will take delivery of 2 777's and then nothing until 2010.
If AA can't afford planes for that long, what makes you think DL (a far weaker airline) can?
DL's credit rating is so poor that attractive financing just isn't going to happen. And a CH11 filing won't help the matter...DL will be viewed as a deadbeat. Why should Boeing cut a deal with DL for new 737's when more stable carriers like Airtran and Southwest are buying them up rapidly?
satpak77 said:Curious what these would be. Besides the major capital cities of South America, the other cities (Cali, Medellin, Chihuahua, etc) are flown by American or Continental themselves (non-codeshare) or their regional partners.
CAL prob has the most Mexico coverage and AA the most South America coverage
Wonder what "new market" Delta is going to tap into.
michael707767 said:Originally Posted by N2264J
Try as you might to redirect the argument, your hypothetical misses the point. We were prevented by our own union from the opportunity to even attempt to protect ourselves from the serious hole in the mainline scope clause concerning "permitted aircraft." We were locked out.
so you say. My sources say otherwise.
Heavy Set said:Both West Jet and Jets Go (now defunct) were driving down fares in Canada at the time but Air Canada still got exit financing and ordered new aircraft. It's not unusual because the aircraft already had established routes to fly and international routes tend to be pretty profitable.
I would bet that Embraer would be interested in providing big discounts if Delta made a big order of E170s/E190s just like Air Canada did... Didn't Grinstein or someone senior say he was impressed with the Embraer product?
General Lee said:Come on now. Dilusional is how I describe your recap. RJDC people are lazy people who want larger airplanes at their regional, so they don't have to leave their airline to go up (the natural progression), and so they can keep their earned vacation time (4 weeks in MYR) and keep weekends off. IF they actually tried to submit a resume to a major (like CAL--hiring 60 a month---go for it) they may actually have to START OVER, as an FO (oh my gosh), and might have to do walkarounds, in the rain! They haven't had to do that since they upgraded on the Bandit in 1983.
Larger aircraft should go to mainline, and then the regional guys should want to move UP to mainline. The RJDC is full of lazy people.
Bye Bye--General Lee
New orders usually take place upon exit. At that time the companies have secured usually billions in exit financing and have layed out a plan for the judge and the exit financiers(majority owners), where new a/c purchases can be part of the overall strategy. If the company can persuade the judge that a wider pilot scope is necessary to the new business model, then he could be willing to allow a new contract if DALPA refuses to budge off their present position. The companies arguement needs to show that the new scope is necessary to compete with existing carriers.Heavy Set said:Both West Jet and Jets Go (now defunct) were driving down fares in Canada at the time but Air Canada still got exit financing and ordered new aircraft. It's not unusual because the aircraft already had established routes to fly and international routes tend to be pretty profitable.
I would bet that Embraer would be interested in providing big discounts if Delta made a big order of E170s/E190s just like Air Canada did... Didn't Grinstein or someone senior say he was impressed with the Embraer product?
N2264J said:The Comair and ASA MECs were denied a seat at the table when mainline scope was being negotiated. They were denied the opportunity, by our own union, to seek job security provisions with the entity that controls all the flying-Delta Air Lines.
N2264J said:The RJDC is full of people who are demanding equal rights and protections within our own union. Your comment smacks of bigotry.
AAflyer said:Opps, That will probably bring Surplus1 out to explain it to me.