Delta realignment

[Otto]

Letting off steam...

I have talked to GL a little bit through emails, he is not the type to wish anyone getting furloughed ill will. What many at mainline had been saying after 9-11 was "we are starting to get it, WE are ALL in this together", however with explosive RJ growth, it was muted, and a more divisive line was drawn.

Does everyone GET it know. NO ONE is immune, and WE are ALL in this together. Why is this such a hard concept t grasp.

AA

Opps, That will probably bring Surplus1 out to explain it to me.

Okay, maybe it was kind of an a$$hole thing to say. I'm sorry, I'm just frustrated over this whole thing right now. My apologies to the General. I've just gotten the feeling lately that some at Delta have blamed the financial mess they're in right now on spending too much money for RJ's, essentially blaming Comair for their downfall. That's too simplistic and only a small part of a very complex equation. Some have thought it's about time we share the pain. I was trying to point out that those at Comair who are the loudest and most obnoxious (hell there are some I can't stand myself) are for the most part senior...the one's who will be least affected by this so called "right-sizing". So if anyone feels the least bit giddy about this, remember it's the innocent's (new hires...most who don't even know what RJDC means) who will take the blow.
AA, you are certainly right...we are all in this together. When do we draw the line and say enough is enough? When do we say it's better to let a carrier fall then to allow some bankruptcy imposed pay rates to become the new industry standard? I'm not going to blame ALPA for everything but I do find their leadership in these times EXTREMELY LACKING. Okay, I'll stop my venting.

 

[N2264J]

So if anyone feels the least bit giddy about this, remember it's the innocent's (new hires...most who don't even know what RJDC means) who will take the blow...I'm not going to blame ALPA for everything but I do find their leadership in these times EXTREMELY LACKING.

At first blush, the 5000 block hours Comair is losing appears to be what Freedom and Shuttle America are picking up. So to recap for those of you who may not be supporting the RJDC:

a) ALPA would not allow the CMR or ASA MEC's to negotiate scope with the entity that controls all the flying-Delta.

b) The mainline scope clause, engineered by ALPA, allowed "permitted aircraft" to be distributed in any way around DCI which seems to be having the effect of driving this flying off the property and inducing whipsaw.

We believe our union has a fiduciary responsibility to look out for us.

 

[General Lee]

I'm sure the General will be grinning with satisfaction now that it looks like Comair will have to furlough. Nevermind the fact that the individuals affected here weren't even at the company when the pilot group supposedly decided not to "help out" Delta furloughees (as if we had that power). A sad day indeed. So who's got their resume out?

That is ridiculous. I have watched many of my own friends get furloughed, and it wasn't fun at all. I would never wish unemployment on anyone. I have been watching developments closely just like everyone else.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

I dont think GL will be that happy since most of us guys and gals getting the letter got hired this year and we were not around for the DELTA/ASA/CMR hiring fiasco. UBA757

That is correct. My beef is mainly with the senior guys, like Lawson and Ford and their RJDC mess. I have no ill will towards any other Comair pilot, and especially not towards any new hires, which likely could be affected here. The recent rumors I have heard seems to point at some of the unprofitable 50 seaters and routes, and that isn't any pilot's fault. And look, some of our planes are going away too, like the 762s, which can be mx hogs. AA flyer got it right----we are all on this crazy ride together.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[General Lee]

At first blush, the 5000 block hours Comair is losing appears to be what Freedom and Shuttle America are picking up. So to recap for those of you who may not be supporting the RJDC:

a) ALPA would not allow the CMR or ASA MEC's to negotiate scope with the entity that controls all the flying-Delta.

b) The mainline scope clause, engineered by ALPA, allowed "permitted aircraft" to be distributed in any way around DCI which seems to be having the effect of driving this flying off the property and inducing whipsaw.

We believe our union has a fiduciary responsibility to look out for us.

Come on now. Dilusional is how I describe your recap. RJDC people are lazy people who want larger airplanes at their regional, so they don't have to leave their airline to go up (the natural progression), and so they can keep their earned vacation time (4 weeks in MYR) and keep weekends off. IF they actually tried to submit a resume to a major (like CAL--hiring 60 a month---go for it) they may actually have to START OVER, as an FO (oh my gosh), and might have to do walkarounds, in the rain! They haven't had to do that since they upgraded on the Bandit in 1983.

Larger aircraft should go to mainline, and then the regional guys should want to move UP to mainline. The RJDC is full of lazy people.


Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[Birdstrike]

...RJDC people are lazy people who want larger airplanes at their regional, so they don't have to leave their airline to go up (the natural progression)...

But is it really the natural progression any more?

 

[Boeingman]

Uh oh is right.

[/left]


Uh, oh. The last time I heard the term "right size" used was at USAir, where I went from 737 Captain to the street in just 2 years.

Red

I was thinking the same thing when I read "right sizing". Last time I heard those words we went into bankruptcy. They must hire the same script writers for the propoganda division and smoke and mirror department's at all these carriers.

 

[General Lee]

But is it really the natural progression any more?

Not really anymore, but some airlines still have it---like COEX and CAL. IF the regionals keep getting larger aircraft, it will stop.

Bye Bye--General Lee

 

[michael707767]

a) ALPA would not allow the CMR or ASA MEC's to negotiate scope with the entity that controls all the flying-Delta.

b) The mainline scope clause, engineered by ALPA, allowed "permitted aircraft" to be distributed in any way around DCI which seems to be having the effect of driving this flying off the property and inducing whipsaw.
.

first of all, even if CMR and ASA had scope, do you believe it would be ironclad, or would there be economic or force majuer clauses just like there were in the mainline scope? I think you are fooling yourself to think your scope would have protected you anymore than mainline scope has protected us. Certainly not if BK is declared.

second, the mainline scope does address where the flying goes. I forget the number but isn't it 50 percent of all DCI flying will be done by ASA and CMR. Beyond that it does not address where those aircraft go. Nor should it in my opinion.
last, I do not wish a furlough on anyone, least of all the junior most CMR pilots who don't have anything to do with any of these arguments.

 

[ATR-DRIVR]

Not sure what it means for Delta pilots in CVG or for CMR, but CVG taking a 26% cut in flying.........




Delta Air Lines Strengthens Domestic Hubs, Offers Customers More InternationalAdditionally, Delta will replace service in nine markets currently served non-stop from Cincinnati by Delta Connection carriers ASA and Comair with connecting service through the Atlanta hub.


This is not going to be good....."connecting through ATL" . I guess they don't see the delays DAILY. That is going to send business flyers to another carrier who does not go through ATL.