Comair to furlough 500??!!

[Full of LUV]

Management is right, Good goes around

You are correct.




Chautauqua pilots have been granted flying that would have prevented furloughs at Comair immediately after their contract. This raises a very large flag.

A distinction needs to be made between Comair/Delta and CHQ/Delta. Delta refused to fly 50-70 seat aircraft, which is why Comair saw them. Delta furloughed in the larger aircraft, but the Delta pilots refused the aircraft that would have saved their furloughs. Comair pilots have never refused an airframe, but have watched as pilot groups under bid them for the same aircraft. This after a sacrificing three months for a contract that was to help the entire industry. What have CHQ, and now Mesa done? They pat Comair pilots on the back, say nice job...and then yoink, thanks for the flying we'd never have gotten the chance to take from you had you not gone on strike. I'm not entirely convinced that the term "struck flying" should cease to represent routes after the strike ends.

Chautauqua's contract is crap, but I understand how they got duped into signing it (republic). What is inexcusible is actively going after flying that is being conducted by an airline that struck to receive the contract to fly it. While other airlines refused to fly Comair routes during the strike, Chautauqua waited until the strike was over, and then took 'em. I've heard way too many CHQ pilots in the terminal bragging about their quick upgrades, and considering what other pilot groups have sacrificed (and are continuing to sacrifice greatly) for them to sneak in and reap the benefits, I don't blame the looks and lectures they get.

Brag about your upgrade all you want, but I'd be careful. One of these people you're bragging to may be about to lose his job because he trusted you to do what it took for the good of the profession, not for the good of your ego.

WOW! I know of two furloughed Delta pilots who claimed the never "refused to fly" 50-70 seat aircraft.

I think you might be referring to the fact that as RJ's were just rolling out, ALPA wouldn't have condoned flying the aircraft for regional wages and by the time ALPA national figured out that the RJ wasn't just to replace the props, but also half of the mainline, the cat was out of the bag and all ALPA could do was negotiate some scope clauses just to put a lid on the explosion of regional jets that REPLACED mainline.

Nobody refused to fly anything, people were just willing to fly for a cheaper price, and still are, and just as water finds the lowest spot, companies will find the lowest costs, it just takes more time for some companies than others.

Oh and BTW, my buds also say that it was COMAIR who refused to hire furloughed (replaced) mainline for the few who really needed a job without giving up that last shred of hope for a recall, not CHQ, not ASA, not SKW.

Huh, management has one thing right, I guess Good does go around.

 

[wmuflyguy]

Make that 98... You and I are both gone. And from the looks of it, not a minute too soon.

While CMR rode the wave for a few years, and stood tall with a 'ground breaking' RJ contract; their about to see a 'back breaking' contract, thanks to a BK Judge.

Lawson's move to snub the DAL boys in '02 is going to haunt CMR pilots for years to come. Bad play, bad play. I know more than one DALPA pilot thats laughing his *ss off at CMR right now.

The sad part is the people who will be furloughed weren't there in '02 and had nothing to do with whatever happened.

 

[Nindiri]

Lawson's move to snub the DAL boys in '02 is going to haunt CMR pilots for years to come. Bad play, bad play. I know more than one DALPA pilot thats laughing his *ss off at CMR right now.

Assuming for the moment that Lawson truly "snubbed" DAL pilots, how exactly is it haunting them now? What would be different? Furloughs would be coming regardless of what they did, so what difference would it have made?

Also, I would hope that DAL pilots had more class than to laugh at people losing their jobs. Not to mention brains; only an idiot would laugh at another condemned man as both of them went to the gallows, so to speak.

Honestly, though, I've met plenty of both DAL and CMR pilots, and none of them showed any hatred for the other like I see here on this board.

 

[Plug]

You are correct.




Chautauqua pilots have been granted flying that would have prevented furloughs at Comair immediately after their contract. This raises a very large flag.

A distinction needs to be made between Comair/Delta and CHQ/Delta. Delta refused to fly 50-70 seat aircraft, which is why Comair saw them. Delta furloughed in the larger aircraft, but the Delta pilots refused the aircraft that would have saved their furloughs. Comair pilots have never refused an airframe, but have watched as pilot groups under bid them for the same aircraft. This after a sacrificing three months for a contract that was to help the entire industry. What have CHQ, and now Mesa done? They pat Comair pilots on the back, say nice job...and then yoink, thanks for the flying we'd never have gotten the chance to take from you had you not gone on strike. I'm not entirely convinced that the term "struck flying" should cease to represent routes after the strike ends.

Chautauqua's contract is crap, but I understand how they got duped into signing it (republic). What is inexcusible is actively going after flying that is being conducted by an airline that struck to receive the contract to fly it. While other airlines refused to fly Comair routes during the strike, Chautauqua waited until the strike was over, and then took 'em. I've heard way too many CHQ pilots in the terminal bragging about their quick upgrades, and considering what other pilot groups have sacrificed (and are continuing to sacrifice greatly) for them to sneak in and reap the benefits, I don't blame the looks and lectures they get.

Brag about your upgrade all you want, but I'd be careful. One of these people you're bragging to may be about to lose his job because he trusted you to do what it took for the good of the profession, not for the good of your ego.

Holy crap you are a hypocryt! You sit there and bash the CHQ pilots for the very same thing 61% of your pilot group did. WTFO! Now your crying in your beer because Delta is putting the wood to you. You have now confirmed the fact that most CMR pilots are self-rightrous Nepoleanites. Instead of waving your finger at other pilot groups try waving it at your own.

 

[wmuflyguy]

You have now confirmed the fact that most CMR pilots are self-rightrous Nepoleanites

Another brilliantly thought out comment, that has very little basis

 

[bvt1151]

Holy crap you are a hypocryt! You sit there and bash the CHQ pilots for the very same thing 61% of your pilot group did. WTFO! Now your crying in your beer because Delta is putting the wood to you. You have now confirmed the fact that most CMR pilots are self-rightrous Nepoleanites. Instead of waving your finger at other pilot groups try waving it at your own.

It's spelled "hypocrite".

Read the first paragraph for a distinction between CHQ and CMR. Delta did not want to fly "small jets" because of what it would do to their pay. Comair grew in an aircraft a third of the size of Delta's next profitable aircraft (MD-88). CHQ grows in the same aircraft class at the direct expense of other pilots. Reference Eagle/MDA/ACA/Air Wisconsin/CMR.

Granted I wrote that post immediately after hearing confirmation of the furloughs, but the premise remains, without the emotion. Airways 145 flying is the only flying for CHQ that hasn't come at the expense of other pilot groups. That's business, but make sure you're aware your fourth stripe is a result of being the lowest bidder, and I'd suggest keeping your mouth shut around pilot groups who are furloughing to give you that fourth stripe.

 

[goodpilotithink]

Holy crap you are a hypocryt! You sit there and bash the CHQ pilots for the very same thing 61% of your pilot group did. WTFO! Now your crying in your beer because Delta is putting the wood to you. You have now confirmed the fact that most CMR pilots are self-rightrous Nepoleanites. Instead of waving your finger at other pilot groups try waving it at your own.

All though any one following the industry should know this i will explain for your benefit.
The Comair pilots struck for 89 days and won an industry leading contract. This was in 2001. Soon afterwards, the CHQ. and MESA pilot groups signed contracts that were , uh, crappy, for a lack of a better word. They did this because their mgt. told them it would bring lots of shiny new jets to their propertys.
Now, in 2004, Comair mgt. came to the Comair pilot group wanting concessions so we could get more shiny new jets. We told them no, and the shiny new jets went to CHQ., SKYW, and ASA.
In the mean time. SKYWEST pilots agree to fly aircraft up to 99 seats for LESS than we get paid to fly aircraft with 50 seats.
So, the Comair pilots now start to get the picture. 2005.
The Comair pilots see that after raising the bar, then attempting to hold there ground, the likes of SKYWEST, CHQ, MESA, pilots are more than willing to fly dirt cheap, and if we are to prosper, we have to change. We must now compete . The old standard of one pilot group raising the bar so the next pilot group could negotiate an even BETTER contract is gone.
Yes, the Comair Pilots struck for 89 days, and won a good contract. And now that we have beed forced to rethink our approach some one like you calls us names?

Good grief.

 

[goodpilotithink]

Make that 98... You and I are both gone. And from the looks of it, not a minute too soon.

While CMR rode the wave for a few years, and stood tall with a 'ground breaking' RJ contract; their about to see a 'back breaking' contract, thanks to a BK Judge.

Lawson's move to snub the DAL boys in '02 is going to haunt CMR pilots for years to come. Bad play, bad play. I know more than one DALPA pilot thats laughing his *ss off at CMR right now.

Yea, I knew it! The Delta pilots are now furloughing our Pilots because of what we did. Oh the shame.

Get a life idiot.

 

[Sir Muttley]

CMR pilots are self-rightrous Nepoleanites.

Spelling Police: righteous, Napoleon (as in Napoleon Bonaparte) Napoleonite

Grammar Police: Stated more appropriately: "CMR pilots are self-righteous Napoleons"

If it's so easy for Plug to call other pilot groups childish names, then it should be just as easy for Plug to do a spelling and grammar check. Plug, just because the points you try to convey in your posts sound uneducated does not mean you are obligated to make them appear that way!

 

[generaltso]

All though any one following the industry should know this i will explain for your benefit.
The Comair pilots struck for 89 days and won an industry leading contract. This was in 2001. Soon afterwards, the CHQ. and MESA pilot groups signed contracts that were , uh, crappy, for a lack of a better word.

Wasn't there some kind of event in between the Comair strike and the CHQ contract? An event that changed this industry forever?