Colgan new aircrafts

[suupah]

Just give it up dude. These guys are ignorant and scared. Scared that if they try to form some type of organization that there gona get sliced up. There now suffering from SPS(shiny PROP Synd) and thats the begining of dangling that piece of carrot... Enjoy the carrots coligans!

dude, back off. you have no idea what you are talking about when you say that.

 

[funnyman12]

Maybe we'll get some CRJ-700 carrots too....mmmm i would love to fly for NWA....i'd fly a CRJ for $48/hour, maybe less if it was outstation basing!!! heck yeah =)

 

[suupah]

Maybe i'll just dangle deez nutz in front of you

 

[1.3XVso]

Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 775
Civ/Mil: civilian
A/C Flown: cessna172, piper warrior, seminole
Ratings: comm, cfi, mei
Curr Position: SPS!!!!
Total Time: 859
Posts: 775

Nah i'm alright.. Save it and dangle them to PT then go to the hangar and dangle them and place it where frost is forming.

 

[suupah]

Props are made of carbon fibers dude, they ain't shiny unless they are covered with ice.

chicks dig beta

 

[playinskys]

Pinnacle will continue to grow under NWA as well as others. Us at colgan will continue to grow as turbo-prop drivers. Can everyone stop acting so scared and get a life rather then sit on here and dream. In most cases nightmares. Do you pinnacle pilots want to fly turbo-props? Remember you are a publicly traded company that makes money, why would stock holders want that to change? Cash out -- NO, both companies will continue to grow. Colgan Air pilots and mgmt won the Continental Bid, we just could not afford to bank role it. Pinnacle Corp (stockholders, etc...) who ownes you had the money. You pinnacle guys talk like Colgan is expanding it will cost you. All of the hard work you have put in.. What are the pinnacle shareholders supposed to do with the money. Give it aways to their employees just because they have money laying around. It is a business, and you are the employee, they are the employer! So kick back drink a beer and be happy that our company is growing. This means more money for both the colgan and pinnacle side. We both are making money for the same man now. He will choose to spend it the way he wants to. Considering it is the mans money.

 

[Lear70]

Oh jeez... I go on a trip and look at what I miss in less than 12 hours.

Guess you didn't take the suggestion to shut your yap and not gloat. 'Cause that's EXACTLY what you sound like here.

What exactly is "Pinnacle Flying"???? Which is yours and which is ours? By your reasoning, it seems, that everything additional or new we do AFTER the sale to your PARENT company (not your airline) is YOUR flying.

First, let's get something straight here. I don't work for PCL anymore. I've been at AirTran for almost a year now. I WAS a PCL pilot and was involved heavily with the MEC for almost my entire time there. I know the contract backwards and forwards, and am here to tell you that you are INCORRECT on trying to separate Pinnacle Airlines Corp from Pinnacle Airlines Inc.

That's a distinction that the management of PCL is trying to make in order to SCREW the Pinnacle pilots.

Are YOU, a Colgan pilot, ALSO trying to screw Pinnacle pilots? Sounds like you're bordering on it by justifying your own good fortune.

Or is it just the pretty stuff like the Q400? I haven't heard anyone get upset about the additional SAABs we just purchased to do the EAS stuff out of West Virginia. Is that YOURS too?

It is ANYTHING that is purchased and operated by Pinnacle Airlines, its subsidiaries, or its successors.

Hint: that's straight out of the contract section on Scope.

If you got those Saabs under COLGAN contracts BEFORE Pinnacle purchased it and took over, then they're yours. If PINNACLE, in ANY shape or form (corp, inc, whatever), purchased those frames and is operating them ANYWHERE, then that flying belongs to PCL pilots.

If this shoe were on the other foot, you'd be screaming bloody murder. Pretty hypocritical.

Continental has been on Colgan specifically to get bigger Turboprops for almost 2 years now. We just haven't had the money to buy them.

You still don't.

It's PINNACLE money. Not Colgan money.

So stop comparing us to GoJets, etc. They are not the same situation. Your scope langauge is weak too, which is ALPA's fault, and it's not going to help. ALPA knows it too, otherwise they would have had something to say LONG ago. The reason they keep working on it, is because there isn't a leg to stand on. This is the union you want us to join? Works well for you?

Works better than not having one. 90% of the terminations get overturned and they get their jobs back. Couldn't do that without a union.

And I won't compare your airline to GoJets.

However... YOUR PERSONAL attitude is EXACTLY what a GoJet pilot thinks. Rationalize it all you want.

Incidentally, the Scope language isn't weak at all,,, be patient, Phil will end up backing down, just like he has in countless wrongful termination court cases with high 6-figure settlements.

pinnacle guys,

Wait and see what happens on the colgan side before you judge

I hope your buddy VTChaz isn't representative of your group. So far, he's done nothing but rationalize his position that he thinks you're somehow entitled to airplanes that Pinnacle Airlines is purchasing.

Says you. As of now there are no changes being made we don't like.

Oooohhhh... NICE. No changes that YOU DON'T LIKE.

In other words: "I'm getting mine, I don't give a sh*t if you don't like it."

Nice. True colors shown.

Actually, the majority of them aren't. It's just a few guys on here. Most of the Colgan pilots are smart enough to see what is really going on here. I'm not worried about what our Colgan brothers will do.

I really hope that's true.

Other than VTChaz, most of the guys are taking a more neutral stance.

I only care because I hate seeing ANY pilot group getting screwed, especially one where I still have many friends at (fewer and fewer each month, but still several there).

I still sit here and wonder if any of the more *ahem* vocal Colgan guys saying "It's our growth, fu*k off", have really, truly stopped to think how they would react if the roles were reversed.

Methinks they'd be pretty p*ssed off as well.

 

[suupah]

Lear, don't worry man, the majority of colgan pilots think bigger picture. we know that everything that happens with this ripples not only in our regional careers but later one when there could quite possibly be a ex pinnacler on the hiring board.

even aside from prudent steps taken for our personal careers it is important to most colganites to do what we can to improve the work environment for the industry as a whole.

We'll do what we can and I just ask the pinnacle guys to not take out there frustrations on the pilots here at Colgan.

My prediction is, it is probably going to get ugly first because the process of rectifying situations take lots of time.

 

[Lear70]

Lear, don't worry man, the majority of colgan pilots think bigger picture. we know that everything that happens with this ripples not only in our regional careers but later one when there could quite possibly be a ex pinnacler on the hiring board.

even aside from prudent steps taken for our personal careers it is important to most colganites to do what we can to improve the work environment for the industry as a whole.

We'll do what we can and I just ask the pinnacle guys to not take out there frustrations on the pilots here at Colgan.

My prediction is, it is probably going to get ugly first because the process of rectifying situations take lots of time.

Nicely put, sir.

The majority of PCL guys know very well that this is all the work of Nonconnah, and nothing you guys did.

As long as no one rubs it in their faces, everyone will get along fine. It's the "screw you, we're finally getting ours, even if it is your company's name on the signature lines" mentality that aggravates people.

Thankfully most of your guys have been really cool about it.

 

[suupah]

Nicely put, sir.

The majority of PCL guys know very well that this is all the work of Nonconnah, and nothing you guys did.

As long as no one rubs it in their faces, everyone will get along fine. It's the "screw you, we're finally getting ours, even if it is your company's name on the signature lines" mentality that aggravates people.

Thankfully most of your guys have been really cool about it.

no offense to the pinnacle guys, but i think that some of the attitudes from the colganeers is coming from a defensive stance because they feel like they are being attacked.

I think both sides need to cool their jets until more info comes out. Right now the Colgan pilots are not in a position to do anything. In six months that may change. We'll just have to wait and see.

 

[vtchaz]

Read Your Scope!

It is ANYTHING that is purchased and operated by Pinnacle Airlines, its subsidiaries, or its successors.

Hint: that's straight out of the contract section on Scope.

Yup, the Key Word is Pinnacle Airlines...Not Pinnacle Airlines CORP!!! There is a HUGE difference. If you guys don't know the difference, no wonder your management is so easily able to screw you at every turn.

I didn't write your scope, I just know how it is being interpreted by management and how it will be by any court, if you bring a lawsuit. I'm sure ALPA knows it too. Again, we didn't write it, from what you say, you did.

I have said time and time again that I wish nothing bad for either pilot group and what we want is what you want...to keep the companies separate, us operating Turboprops, you the jets. To say or imply that I am attacking or wishing anything negative on 9E pilots just tells me that you haven't actually read my posts very carefully.

I just want you all to be realistic about where you stand and stop telling us what to YOU think WE should do. I think most Colgan pilots don't feel a bit of remorse about flying Q400s. That is and always was OUR flying, period.

 

[better up here]

no offense to the pinnacle guys, but i think that some of the attitudes from the colganeers is coming from a defensive stance because they feel like they are being attacked.

no they just have nothing better to do...

hey, i'll make you guys an offer...i'll trade seats in my prop, Q or other, for your jet seat...deal?

 

[funnyman12]

I would fly pcl's rj's for half of what the pcl pilots get paid cause i love jets!!!

 

[suupah]

if they put an extra wax on the jet and maybe throw in an ipod with Top Gun sound track loaded on it, i just might fly the danged thang for free!

 

[funnyman12]

maybe pinnacle will buy next gen 787 dreamliner if we fly it on the saab pay scale....that would be sweet!!!

 

[Lear70]

Yup, the Key Word is Pinnacle Airlines...Not Pinnacle Airlines CORP!!! There is a HUGE difference. If you guys don't know the difference, no wonder your management is so easily able to screw you at every turn.

I didn't write your scope, I just know how it is being interpreted by management and how it will be by any court, if you bring a lawsuit. I'm sure ALPA knows it too. Again, we didn't write it, from what you say, you did.

Oh, so now you're a legal expert, too.

Wow...

Here's another hint: the contract doesn't say Pinnacle Airlines, Inc, nor does it say Pinnacle Airlines Corp. It just says Pinnacle Airlines. Which COULD be interpreted TO INCLUDE BOTH.

Especially since the holding company (Pinnacle Airlines Corp) was formed BY Pinnacle Airlines AFTER the contract was written. Making Pinnacle Airlines CORP a "successor".

Nice try at your "interpretation"; I can punch holes in it all day long and I'm not an attorney. Imagine what the ALPA attorneys who get paid to do this for a living can come up with.

I have said time and time again that I wish nothing bad for either pilot group and what we want is what you want...to keep the companies separate, us operating Turboprops, you the jets. To say or imply that I am attacking or wishing anything negative on 9E pilots just tells me that you haven't actually read my posts very carefully.

That's interesting, since every PCL pilot who comes across these threads seems to hear the same thing I am.

To say or imply that you AREN'T wishing anything negative for PCL pilots just tells me you're either stupid (unlikely), naive (possibly), or choosing to turn a blind eye to the realities of what happens when management deliberately tries to find a loophole to screw you out of something you bargained for in good faith (most likely).

ME ME ME is about all that's coming out of your mouth. As long as it's good for you, you have no problem with it. Problem is, that's bad for the PCL pilots.

If you can't see this will be dangled as a carrot for earlier contract settlement (in the company's favor) at PCL, then you need to learn to think in broader scope.

I just want you all to be realistic about where you stand and stop telling us what to YOU think WE should do. I think most Colgan pilots don't feel a bit of remorse about flying Q400s. That is and always was OUR flying, period.

At least ONE of you understands that what goes around comes around (and I don't hear a bunch of guys standing up behind you yelling the same thing).

He has the voice of reason and is taking a "let's just hang out and see what happens" stance rather than a "that flying is OURS!" stance. Very respectable.

 

[IslandDriver]

You are all right at 9E...a union drive has begun at CJC. But I hear it is not ALPA. The feeling is that we may need protection from the 9E pilots and ALPA...so some are pushing for Teamsters.

Management at Colgan is not going to do anything to stop a union drive. Some who have talked personally with the Colgan's have been told that they imagined a union drive might come out after the sale. Mary F. said right in the first conference call that it would be up to us.

I say stop all the BSing and send us a ballot and get it over with and see what happens.

But as vchaz said the prop flying at CO has been earned by CJC pilots...not 9E pilots.

 

[Smarta$$]

Question? Are those 9E guys complaining on this web board the same guys that walked through DTW and MSP with a smile on their face as they replace Mesaba's flying with their fancy new CRJ's. Are these also the same 9e guys that while Mesaba pilots were fighting for their jobs just a few months ago couldn't get anything in writting from the 9E ALPA union that they would not fly struck work...even the NWA pilots publicly came out in support for Mesaba. Are these the same 9E guys that wouldn't take a Mesaba pilot with the same deal Mesaba gave 9E pilots back in the late 90's...yes you know what I'm talking about.
Now your whinning and crying because you feel your getting screwed by Colgan pilots. TOO BAD you've been doing it for years to the Mesaba Pilots now you get to enjoy yours.
Also how do you think NWA will respond to this. NWA has always wanted 100% control of their feed. Do you think your still getting those 17 CRJ with no pilot contract and now this.
I would be very concerned with how NWA responds to this...especially since they now own 100% of Mesaba and Compass will get off the ground.

Perhaps the pilots of 9E will see first hand what it's like too how bad it really can get.

Sorry guys but you deserve it.

Um, very wrong on many accounts. Tool.

 

[Ridgeback]

Are YOU, a Colgan pilot, ALSO trying to screw Pinnacle pilots? Sounds like you're bordering on it by justifying your own good fortune.


It is ANYTHING that is purchased and operated by Pinnacle Airlines, its subsidiaries, or its successors.

CAREFUL I believe those 140 some CRJs are OWNED by Northwest airlines flown on routes OWNED by Northwest airlines.

Are YOU, a 9E pilot, ALSO trying to screw Northwest pilots? Sounds like you're bordering on it by jusifying your own good fortune.

Now wait I know that your at Airtra, but please think about what you are saying. Your acusing this guy of the same thing you were happy to be part of at 9E.

 

[PCL_128]

CAREFUL I believe those 140 some CRJs are OWNED by Northwest airlines flown on routes OWNED by Northwest airlines.

Are YOU, a 9E pilot, ALSO trying to screw Northwest pilots? Sounds like you're bordering on it by jusifying your own good fortune.

The NWA pilots willfully gave up their scope protections on aircraft with less than 55-seats a very long time ago.