Both Mesa GO! pilots fall asleep during flight

[V1 Rotate]

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ASH1002/history/20080213/1925Z/PHNL/PHTO

 

[skyguy40]

I was talking to the FAA yesterday and ask questions regarding long duty times because of safety. Why are we having so much trouble lowering the max time you could be on duty. As he agreed that it has gone on too long and he was on our side, he said Washington told them to back off from this issue as these are hard economic times and the Airlines would not be able to handle this hardship. His advice was to support ALPA. They are the only voice we have. So there you have it. It cost too much to be that safe.

 

[SpyFlysDOTs]

Purely for entertainment, as that is why some of us come to these parts, right?

http://golfdevil.co.uk/hawaii.wav

 

[Trash8Mofo]

deleted

 

[dash8driver]

(Remember, No one got hurt, no equipment was damaged, and no loss of separation occurred. People will be punished. Big. Frikin. Deal.)

nice....isnt this the same excuse the FAA and ATA makes when they dont want to change a reg or fix a problem?

while its true that the people that weren't there do not know every single detail of what happened, it doesnt mean that you cant have a pretty good idea or even be right about what happened. most people here have a pretty good idea of how these planes work, the system and the work environment...pretty reasonable conclusions can be drawn.

unless HAL9000 was running the plane and it wouldnt let Dave descend or talk on the radio for the last 70 miles or so.. i think its safe to assume that they were doing something other than paying attention. especially on a message board by and for industry workers who speak from a base of experience.

the controllers in hilo only see one type of approach.. everything comes in the same way every day, day in day out. they are pretty good at calling you out on a deviation that are obviously not a part of the same old boring routine. that flight path was pretty far beyond somewhere where a controller would be asking you "WTF".

as far as the pax not knowing anything because they are in the back... this is not true. have you heard of the eskimo ndb? this is kind of the same thing. these passengers fly the same routes so many times, i'm sure some have more time on that route than some go! pilots. they know about when they should be descending... and they certainly know they are supposed to be closer to the ocean than what 21,000' looks like when they are flying past pepeekeo point or hilo.

we all know rest is an issue.. and mesa is one of the most abused in this regard. alpa will give them their defense.... trying to cover it up and pretend like nothing happened wont help fix this problem it only benefits the management.

before you call me a mesa-basher.. let me tell you this: some of my best friends are/were mesa pilots!

 

[CitationUltra]

How in the heck do both pilots fall asleep on a 40 minute flight at 9 am? Very odd.

You get what you pay for.

 

[go!ng for broke]

http://kgmb9.com/main/content/view/4222/76/


http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/02/20/eveningnews/main3854375.shtml


Have a very very nice evening

 

[dash8driver]

http://kgmb9.com/main/content/view/4222/76/


http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/02/20/eveningnews/main3854375.shtml


Have a very very nice evening

wow..there was another incident the day before. maybe HAL-9000 wont let the pilots fly the plane or talk on the radios.


Dave Bowman: Open the pod bay doors, HAL.
HAL: I'm sorry Dave, I'm afraid I can't do that.
Dave Bowman: What's the problem?
HAL: I think you know what the problem is just as well as I do.
Dave Bowman: What are you talking about, HAL?
HAL: This mission is too important for me to allow you to jeopardize it.
Dave Bowman: I don't know what you're talking about, HAL?
HAL: I know you and Frank were planning to disconnect me, and I'm afraid that's something I cannot allow to happen.
Dave Bowman: Where the hell'd you get that idea, HAL?
HAL: Dave, although you took thorough precautions in the pod against my hearing you, I could see your lips move.

 

[dash8driver]

alright.. who's gonna photoshop a go! airplane and replace "go!" with "zzzzz!"? or "gone to sleep!"?

 

[RJP]

This has become BIG NEWS. Even CNN is showing this on their front page.

 

[XPOO]

No Skywest management ball-licker has any business criticizing the pilots of any airline. Back to your cubicle!

Yawn, more of the same rhetoric. Wake me up when you either say something you don't say on a daily basis, or when we reach Hilo, ok?

 

[Soverytired]

Gentlemen,

I acknowledge the fact that Mesa's current contract is terrible. And while most long-time Mesa pilots and long-time Mesa bashers like to finger the "Freedom-A" guys for their s-contract, I think that was more of an excuse not to do the hard thing, which was to push for a strike when they had the chance.

So yes, Mesa pilots dropped the ball, big-time, last time. I think they can, and will, do a lot better this time. I've made no secret about my disdain for labor in general and ALPA in particular, yet even I was CHOMPING AT THE BIT to burn the place down with a debilitating and costly strike just for payback.

Payback for what? Well, utterly unsafe but perfectly "legal" schedules that invite the kind of "sleepy pilot" stories we're seeing today for one thing. Stories where pilots, not management, will take the fall.

So get on board and start backing your Mesa brothers. 1600 pilots aren't just going to quit because you don't like competition. Deal with the fact that the best thing that can happen for every regional pilots everywhere is unfettered support and cooperation with these pilots who are fighting for a better contract.

They can raise the bar. They need your help. If they strike, you'll be paying extra dues for your "strike assesment" anyway; why see that money go to waste as you pay with one hand yet tear down the pilots receiving it with the other?

 

[Soverytired]

nice....isnt this the same excuse the FAA and ATA makes when they dont want to change a reg or fix a problem?

while its true that the people that weren't there do not know every single detail of what happened,


we all know rest is an issue.. and mesa is one of the most abused in this regard. alpa will give them their defense.... trying to cover it up and pretend like nothing happened wont help fix this problem it only benefits the management.

before you call me a mesa-basher.. let me tell you this: some of my best friends are/were mesa pilots!

You're no Mesa-basher. As a mighty DHC-8 driver (13 ft diameter props!), I have to assume you're alright!

There are reports that this happened to another Mesa/Go flight within the past week. "This" being a "lost comm" situation.

That right there speaks volumes. What is more likely . . . 2 different crews fell asleep twice in the space of a week, or SOMETHING WAS BROKE ON ONE OF THE RADIOS of one of the 3-5 planes flying in Hawaii? Those CRJ200's in Hawaii aren't exactly the pride of the Mesa inventory, either.

I have no inside information; however, I'm beginning to think that it's far more plausible that these two crews just had a wiggy radio and did not brief, plan, and fly proper "lost comm" procedures.

Remember the saying "An airplane may disappoint, but will never surprise, a good pilot." Short flights or high traffic density arrivals/departures are a nightmare for lost comm scenarios, and I could see pilots being caught flat footed. No excuse, of course. NONE. But I'm afraid it happens . . . be honest, could this ever have happened to you on one of your no-so-sharp days?

Oh . . I don't think ALPA will defend them. Just my opinion. If they slept, I have no doubt that they had legal rest. ALPA can't defend careless and reckless behavior. Hope I'm wrong, of course, but I suspect these guys are toast, lost comm or nappy-time, your choice.

 

[Poahi]

...
So get on board and start backing your Mesa brothers. 1600 pilots aren't just going to quit because you don't like competition.

Soverytired,

You are wasting your time. Many of these pilots you are directing your plea for support to have no interest in safety, brotherhood or even a better contract for Mesa. They are an organized group whose only purpose is destroying Mesa. Your job and your desire to improve the QOL at Mesa interferes with their concerted effort to drive Mesa out of business. Make no mistake, they would throw you under a bus if it would further their cause.

It's a sad situation and is getting worse every day.

 

[Junkflyer]

So this crew couldn't just continue to their filed destination? Maybe look for some light signals? Hilo is not exactly what you would call a busy airport.