Both Mesa GO! pilots fall asleep during flight

[go!ng for broke]

Quote: Was it a co-ed crew? Were they sleeping, or "Sleeping"? Lots of rumors floating around. Only in Hawaii, brah.

look out TROJAN, JO is going to SUE YOU!!

I heard "15 minites not miles on TV this morning.

 

[topdawg]

Beats me. I don't fly Hawaii.

What's more common:

"Local reporter completely screws up an aviation-related story"

-or-

"Pilots fall asleep and fly past destination."



Either is possible. One is far, far, FAR more likely.

Unless you were in the cockpit, you don't have the facts, neither does the press, and there are literally dozens of other things that might have been taking place.

I'm embarrassed that any pilot would take an aviation-related story reported by the nightly news at face value.[/quote

I was on board that flight deadheading home. The FA had to bang on the door to wake them up.

 

[Coool Hand Luke]

The mystery of what actually happend is solved: http://youtube.com/watch?v=k8gKL1UYOXE

 

[go!ng for broke]

As the resident "Mesa apologist", I feel I must point out a few things:

• 15 nm off course in a jet traveling 6-7 miles a minute, while not exactly professional, isn't very far off course.
• 15 miles "out to sea" [GASP!] - - I think anyone who's flown in JFK, IAD, ATL, PHL, etc. would consider 15 miles an insanely short downwind. 15 miles "out to sea" is nothing . . . especially when your entire flight was just conducted . . . "Out to Sea".
• And they were "lost com" for 25 minutes? Again not professional, but it happens all the time; equipment, ATC failed-handoffs, crew dialing in the wrong freq, etc. Big deal.

No passenger in the back could possibly tell "there's something wrong with this flight path"; even if he did, wouldn't the prudent thing be to ask the flight attendant? This sentence is MORONIC . . . why would the press even include this, unless the flight path truly was unusual (LIKE, OH, INVERTED FLIGHT MAYBE?)

Like ALL aviation stories reported by the press, this story contains 1% fact and 99% twisted, "sexed-up" hyperbole and conjecture. I know MAG is the favorite whipping boy here . . . just remember, YOU could someday wake up and find YOUR flight in the newspaper being grossly mis-reported . . . .

Lost com and a bit of navigational carelessness most likely . . .

Asleep for a 9am flight? Hardly.

(However, I will plead the fifth on what I "heard" routinely happened on the 12am-2:30 am flights out of LAS when I was at MAG. Thank god, I surrendered by badge and my board a long time ago)

Dude Any flip'n flying hawaii local who travels every day, week or month knows the plane goes down well before the island runs out. What is a 20,000ft spread anyway?? Traffic? Too bad he was not wearing the same rose colored sun glasses you are. I think the FAA have a little more than a twisted story. YA

 

[go!ng for broke]

Beats me. I don't fly Hawaii.

What's more common:

"Local reporter completely screws up an aviation-related story"

-or-

"Pilots fall asleep and fly past destination."



Either is possible. One is far, far, FAR more likely.

Unless you were in the cockpit, you don't have the facts, neither does the press, and there are literally dozens of other things that might have been taking place.

I'm embarrassed that any pilot would take an aviation-related story reported by the nightly news at face value.[/quote

I was on board that flight deadheading home. The FA had to bang on the door to wake them up.

Watch It. They now know you

 

[plucky]

As the resident "Mesa apologist", I feel I must point out a few things:

• 15 nm off course in a jet traveling 6-7 miles a minute, while not exactly professional, isn't very far off course.
• 15 miles "out to sea" [GASP!] - - I think anyone who's flown in JFK, IAD, ATL, PHL, etc. would consider 15 miles an insanely short downwind. 15 miles "out to sea" is nothing . . . especially when your entire flight was just conducted . . . "Out to Sea".
• And they were "lost com" for 25 minutes? Again not professional, but it happens all the time; equipment, ATC failed-handoffs, crew dialing in the wrong freq, etc. Big deal.

No passenger in the back could possibly tell "there's something wrong with this flight path"; even if he did, wouldn't the prudent thing be to ask the flight attendant? This sentence is MORONIC . . . why would the press even include this, unless the flight path truly was unusual (LIKE, OH, INVERTED FLIGHT MAYBE?)

Like ALL aviation stories reported by the press, this story contains 1% fact and 99% twisted, "sexed-up" hyperbole and conjecture. I know MAG is the favorite whipping boy here . . . just remember, YOU could someday wake up and find YOUR flight in the newspaper being grossly mis-reported . . . .

Lost com and a bit of navigational carelessness most likely . . .

Asleep for a 9am flight? Hardly.

(However, I will plead the fifth on what I "heard" routinely happened on the 12am-2:30 am flights out of LAS when I was at MAG. Thank god, I surrendered by badge and my board a long time ago)

THe FA was banging on the door. This is how the Passengers got a little freaked. Also saw Mauna loa behind the shoulder. Not good.

 

[Poahi]

There are few things faster than:


1.The pilot grapevine in Hawaii

2. The FAA racing to the media to pat themselves on the back and

3. The local media rushing go get a story out with reckless disregard for the truth.

There is more to the story....

 

[Bako Cap]

Does Mesa have an ASAP program?

 

[Poahi]

No, and management resists any attempt to start one.

 

[HighSpeedClimb]

http://flightaware.com/live/flight/ASH1002/history/20080213/1925Z/PHNL/PHTO/tracklog
If you go to Google Earth and put in the coordinates 19.70-155.00 Which is the last track for them at 21,000 ft you can plainly see they were sleeping. You make right traffic to runway 26 into Hilo from the North to the South. These guys were past the airport higher than a kite!!


FAA probing whether go! pilots fell asleep on flight

[FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana][SIZE=-2][FONT=Trebuchet MS, Verdana][SIZE=-2]By Rick Daysog
Advertiser Staff Writer[/SIZE][/FONT]
[/SIZE][/FONT]
[FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]
The Federal Aviation Administration has opened an investigation into whether two go! airlines pilot fell asleep during a flight from Honolulu to Hilo last week.
[/FONT][FONT=Times New Roman, Times, serif]
Go! Flight 1002 was headed for Hilo Airport around 10 a.m. last Wednesday morning but overshot the airport by 15 miles before heading back to land safely.
FAA spokesman Ian Gregor said today that the federal agency has opened an investigation of the pilots' actions during the 29-minute flight.
"We're investigating whether the pilot and co-pilot of a Feb. 13 go! airlines flight fell asleep while the plane was in the air between Honolulu and Hilo," said FAA spokesman Ian Gregor.
Joe Bock, a spokesman for go! declined comment, said the company is conducting its own investigation.
Gregor said the FAA plans to interview the pilots on the flight. Under FAA rules, the pilots could be subject to a warning, suspension or license revocation depending on the findings of an investigation.
A radar track of the flight provided the Web site www.flightaware.com, which shows that the flight remained at 21,000 feet as it flew past Hilo before returning to the airport.
Air traffic controllers, which had been tracking the plane by radar, were unable to reach the plane for 25 minutes, according to a report by KGMB-TV.
Go! is a unit of Phoenix-based Mesa Air Group, which has been a subject of complaints from its own pilots union about crew shortages and aircraft problems. Last year, the Mesa unit of the Air Line Pilots Association protested against the company, saying the shortages were hurting morale and were impacting the company's operations.
[/FONT]

 

[BLing]

What happened to the article?

 

[Jack Mehoff]

At least JO can still say that he hasn't killed anyone this year. So thank god its still more dangerous to take a shower then fly on mesa.

You Stay classy JO

 

[Papps]

Gota sleep sometime...

 

[Soverytired]

I was on board that flight deadheading home. The FA had to bang on the door to wake them up.

Really?

Well then, I should think you have an ethical responsibility to contact the FAA, advise them that you are an ATP rated pilot, and you observed some abnormalities on your flight, and that you are very concerned that basic safety procedures seemed to be lacking on that flight.

Oh . . . I wouldn't deadhead on Mesa anymore if I were you either. Seriously. I wouldn't fly on an airline that I had just reported to the FAA as dangerous.

You know what would be REALLY gutsy? Put on your pilot uniform and head down to the local news station and tell them what you observed. The flying public has a right to know, and Joe Doofus doesn't carry as much weight as Mr. Deadhead.

(Or you could just make stuff up anonymously on a web board that 50 people read)

 

[relief tube]

How did they fit both of their plywood boards up there in the cockpit?

LMAO!

Only the best at Mesa. First the porn thing and then this.

SHUT THEM DOWN!!!

 

[RJP]

Flame On T-Rex....

Oh . . . I wouldn't deadhead on Mesa anymore if I were you either. Seriously. I wouldn't fly on an airline that I had just reported to the FAA as dangerous.

(Or you could just make stuff up anonymously on a web board that 50 people read)

Or you could just make threatening comments about jumpseating on Mesa anonymously on a web board that 50 people read.

I'm convinced you're paid by JO to do nothing but sit on this site and defend all the F**KUPS.

Cheers to you for keeping up the fight though.

 

[check6]

Does anyone feel like we need more rest?

Maybe they were legitimately tired. Of course. A 35 minute leg doesn't really seem like it would wipe many out.

I hate to defend MESA, but in reality, the issue of "rest" is becoming a major concern.

I read an article recently about the Shuttle America runway runoff situation and how the captain said he might have not received enough rest.

I'd like to speculate that we have had more accidents because a lack of rest rather than a lack of experience.

 

[Hikoushi]

All the silly rumors, fun as they may sound, must be pure BS. However..... come on. The likelihood of a awake professional crew, on a VFR day, overflying a sea-level airport at 21000 ft., out of contact with ATC for 25 minutes on a route they probably fly almost every workday, at a regional that only serves 5 airports that are all less than an hour from each other, is almost ZERO unless something very wrong is happening in the front office.

If they really were asleep, Mesa's ALPA folks should use this event to negotiate better scheduling and duty rigs, etc. ALPA national should take it as evidence to Congress, and lobby for a reworking of the 121 duty time regs.

But, maybe someone here knows, are there even overnights at go!? Isn't the last plane on the ground at 9 or 10 or something? If so, do they regularly schedule the crews to finish late then start early the next morning at minimum rest? None of the other airlines in Hawaii do that. They all do an AM and PM shift, and you will NEVER fly an AM the day after a PM.

Now, if go! follows the same minimum rest practices as the rest of Mesa, it's pretty easy to see how tired these guys could be. Fly 8 legs, get 8 hours rest / 6 hours of sleep, wake up, fly 8 more legs. Is that how it is? Then come on Mesa ALPA, grow a pair! Get off your asses, put a stop to this fatigue BS, and protect these pilots' jobs!

Now, if it's NOT like that, scheduling at go! works the same way as all the other folks in Hawaii, and this crew had only personal reasons to be that tired, then good luck to the flight crew when the inquisition comes, and thank God they didn't kill anyone or themselves.

Either way, this incident is yet another nail in the coffin. Anyone at Mesa, take this as yet another sign to get the hell out now, before the guillotine drops. Every day you "stick it out" at Mesa is a seniority number at a better carrier that you lose to someone else who has more initiative than you. Think about it. Flee now!

 

[WSurf]

LMAO!

Only the best at Mesa. First the porn thing and then this.

SHUT THEM DOWN!!!

Don't forget "Go around is no Option" and the FO that got busted stealing a pax IPOD while going threw Security.

 

[Soverytired]

Not defending the "screw-ups" here. Remember though, you don't have the facts, and neither do I. IF they truly behaved in a "careless and reckless" manner, they'll be punished by both the FAA and the company.

(If they're very lucky and well connected, ALPA might even put up a token fight for them.)

The real issue, of course, is why isn't every post on here discussing why this shouldn't be the poster-child for implementation of ALPA's published guidelines on a regulatory level?

Oh . . because some here would rather take the alleged actions of two pilots and smear a pilot group of 1600 card carrying ALPA pilots instead. And yes . . . I'll defend those 1600 pilots in a heartbeat against this kind of cripe.

You think JO cares what other pilots think about Mesa pilots? Puh-lease. "Meat in the seat", and no more. I think the Mesa pilot group for the most part ROCKS. And admittedly, I might be a bit too quick to run to their defense.


(Remember, No one got hurt, no equipment was damaged, and no loss of separation occurred. People will be punished. Big. Frikin. Deal.)