ASA JCBA: Longterm reserve pilot relief provision

[Nevets]

Never been through a merge JCBA before. But I agree with all your previous points. Or, the new JCBA will be an average of the two. XJT's brought down, ASA's brought up to meet in the middle. Example, I believe ASA's ready reserve is 8 hours? Correct me if I'm wrong. XJT's is 4 hours. New JCBA will be 6 hours.

I hope that XJT pilots would veto any TA that is an average of the two contracts by voting it down. In other words, I hope we vote down anything that isn't an improvement to our current contract. In fact, I hope the JNC doesn't even reach an agreement like that or that our MEC would approve it to begin with.

Yeah, I know, there is a lot of hope in that statement.

 

[dojetdriver]

I hope that XJT pilots would veto any TA that is an average of the two contracts by voting it down. In other words, I hope we vote down anything that isn't an improvement to our current contract. In fact, I hope the JNC doesn't even reach an agreement like that or that our MEC would approve it to begin with.

Yeah, I know, there is a lot of hope in that statement.

I "hope" so too. I '"hope" they can take the BEST of both contracts, and up EVERY section to a truly "industry leading" CBA. But you can sh1t in one hand and hope in the other and see which one fills up first. After the crap fest we've seen at XJT with BOTH management AND our MEC since, oh, I don't know, early Sept 2008, who knows?

 

[JoeMerchant]

Without a resolution to the "portfolio" issue and some meaningful brand scope, I don't want to have an "industry leading" contract....Do we really want to become the next Comair?

Now if ALPA wants to get real about meaningful brand scope, then we can work on really raising the bar...absent that, I'm content with middle of the pack....

 

[dojetdriver]

Also you are wrong about your bucket comment. If you are on reserve for more than 4 days in a row you are put into the 4 day bucket so yes you can pick up a 4 day trip.

How do you interpret this part of LOA 8?

e. A reserve pilot may only pick up a trip that has the same number of duty days as the available duty days left in the pilot’s current block of duty days. For example, a pilot with a block of 4 days of reserve availability may only pick up a 4-day trip.

 

[79%N1]

My gosh, did you get displaced to the left seat? Otherwise, bid back to the right seat and enjoy the 3 day trips or your choice of 4 days.

That's not the point, and you know it. Again, someone bashing someone that wants to improve conditions in the future. My gosh, why do we bother with new contracts? Aren't we hoping to improve things? Maybe the issues you are concerned about we should just gloss over, because, after all, nobody is making you work here, right?

 

[Cpt Oveur]

Improving the reserve system should be a top priority, I agree. However, I won't listen to a captain on reserve say to people in the crew lounge how bad things are.
The reserve system should work exactly as its written in the contract, and when it doesn't, speak up! Our reserve rules are crap, it affords way too much flexibility on the part of the company.

However, want what you bid, bid what you want.

 

[79%N1]

Right! So in discussing it, we are hoping to bring to light the short comings and attempt to brainstorm some possible solutions. So, the lecture on how 'well, you bid it so don't complain' is ridiculous! If that is the case, nobody has any right to complain about ANY pay, work rules or QOL issues!

 

[Cpt Oveur]

No, it's all about expectations. I'm guessing you upgraded in the midst of a large hiring wave and you didn't get enough people under you in your seat at your base; so now you're looking for more.

ASA and XJet are negotiating a contract now, and the EXPECTATION is significant improvements for both premerger pilot groups. Whether it be best practice or reforming each group's collective bargaining agreement, I think each group owes it to themselves to receive significant improvements. Jerry Atkins is no fool, and he knows it will not be a concessionary contract for either group. Pilots absolutely have the right to complain about falling short of their expectations or their written contract if it is not upheld, I quite agree. Don't sit there though and say "Well I've been on reserve for X years and I think I'm entitled to a line." Sorry, your complaint will fall on deaf ears...

 

[79%N1]

Wait just a second!! I never said I'm entitled to anything. In fact, I said I agree with Joe M, but that guys who never sat reserve for practically a day have no right to tell guys stuck on it for years to suck it up, cause it used to be so much worse!

 

[dojetdriver]

Now if ALPA wants to get real about meaningful brand scope, then we can work on really raising the bar...absent that, I'm content with middle of the pack....

I can understand your point about being "middle of the pack", as well as the COMAIR correlation. But I can't agree that that's whats best.

But if that's what happens, it can mean that the majority of the pilots on the new list will have gone through a concession.

I don't know about anybody else, but after going through 2 concessionary contracts and a total of 4 pay cuts, I'm just not up for that Joe, YMMV.

 

[DHPFLYN]

How do you interpret this part of LOA 8?

Seriously?? Been on reserve almost 4 years. I have had no problem picking up 4 day trips when I am good for five days or more. Like I said read your contract. When was the last time you were on reserve?? If you are on reserve now I bet scheduling loves you.

Reserve Pilot Categories and Assignments
a. A reserve pilot will be placed into a category (“bucket”) each day
according to the number of available reserve days that are remaining in
his current block of reserve days.
b. A reserve pilot with 5 or more reserve days available in a block will be
placed into the 4-day bucket.​

 

[dojetdriver]

Seriously?? Been on reserve almost 4 years. I have had no problem picking up 4 day trips when I am good for five days or more.

Well, hats off to ya for pulling it off. Just makes the discussion come full circle. I guess CC is full of it, I'll repeat it;

Interesting, you ever emailed contract compliance on this issue? I've tried to grab a 4 day while starting 5 days of reserve and been turned down because I was in the "5 day bucket". Fired it off of CC, they agreed, unable. I guess your mileage is different. But that wouldn't be the first time compliance was wrong about something.

Like I said read your contract. When was the last time you were on reserve?? If you are on reserve now I bet scheduling loves you.

I'm currently on reserve. Not sure where the disconnect is with you. Work on your reading comprehension skills.

I guess if you wanna cry and be a little b1tch about it, you figured out how long an ARC sit is yet? But hey, you don't wanna read the MOU's and LOA's and you want to sit for 5 hours, have at it brother. Enjoy that fifth hour. I'll bet scheduling loves you. As for me, they don't. After them jerking around a few call out times lately, them saving the tapes and sending them to the ORD chief, the ORD chief agreeing with me, well....I'm pretty sure there's no love between them and me. Sorry to disappoint you.

 

[DHPFLYN]

Well, hats off to ya for pulling it off. Just makes the discussion come full circle. I guess CC is full of it, I'll repeat it;





I'm currently on reserve. Not sure where the disconnect is with you. Work on your reading comprehension skills.

I guess if you wanna cry and be a little b1tch about it, you figured out how long an ARC sit is yet? But hey, you don't wanna read the MOU's and LOA's and you want to sit for 5 hours, have at it brother. Enjoy that fifth hour. I'll bet scheduling loves you. As for me, they don't. After them jerking around a few call out times lately, them saving the tapes and sending them to the ORD chief, the ORD chief agreeing with me, well....I'm pretty sure there's no love between them and me. Sorry to disappoint you.

Crying? I don't think so. I will be enjoying Thanksgiving off. I would love to know how long you have been sitting at home when you had 5 days on reserve ant not picking anything up. I guess that is why you are on ARC so much.

Jerk around call out times? Why would you even accept anything with a jerked around call out time? I am sure you are going to tell me you didnt. I bet you flew first and then called the union. Thank god you fought it if they were screwing with you because that has to stop.

 

[dojetdriver]

I would love to know how long you have been sitting at home when you had 5 days on reserve ant not picking anything up. I guess that is why you are on ARC so much.

I NEVER said I don't get used on most reserve days. Just like I NEVER said I want the JCBA to be concessionary. Where you're getting this stuff, I don't know.

Take a look at ORD CA open time, especially since the non displacement displacement bid and staffing increase. Many days there are an excess of CA's. NONE of those pairings fit into my call out time, or bucket availability. IF (rarely) there is something in there, a line holder usually exercises the CBA provision to grab the trip. So AGAIN, I don't go reserve days NOT being used.

Jerk around call out times? Why would you even accept anything with a jerked around call out time? I am sure you are going to tell me you didnt. I bet you flew first and then called the union. Thank god you fought it if they were screwing with you because that has to stop.

Sorry to burst you're bubble, but OF COURSE I didn't accept it. Hence the marking of the tape. You know that had it been the other way around, and a request was made to pull the tapes, the sched sup would have pulled the "uh, well, we can't find the tapes" B.S. Didn't even need to call the union about it. Like I said, the CP agreed with what I said.

Sorry, try again.

 

[WWEfan]

No amount of improvements will matter unless we achieve real scope protections and guarantees. It amazes me how many of our pilots don't understand that.

 

[JoeMerchant]

No amount of improvements will matter unless we achieve real scope protections and guarantees. It amazes me how many of our pilots don't understand that.

Well said...It's like starting a marathon by sprinting...You won't make it to the end, but you will be out ahead for a little while.

Many of us simply want to protect the jobs we have...I don't care about anything else in the contract. Without a job, who cares what the pay rate is.