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Airtran 717 vs. 737

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27 driver

Well-known member
Joined
Jun 12, 2005
Posts
828
I just was offered a spot a Airtran. I have heard that the class will be split between the 71 and the 73. I was just wondering if some of the Airtan folks could shed some light on which is the better choice. I am more concerned with QOL, commutable trips, least reserve time, etc. I am not as concerned with the lay overs and destinations. Any help is appreciated.
Thanks:beer:
 
27 driver said:
I just was offered a spot a Airtran. I have heard that the class will be split between the 71 and the 73. I was just wondering if some of the Airtan folks could shed some light on which is the better choice. I am more concerned with QOL, commutable trips, least reserve time, etc. I am not as concerned with the lay overs and destinations. Any help is appreciated.
Thanks:beer:
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The growth is in the 737 fleet. You will probably spend less time on reserve on that fleet. With that said, you will fly longer flights (transcon) vs. short hops here and there. I say go for the 737 if offered...
 
That being said about the 737 above, I'll give you a spiel for the 717. It's more technologically advanced and is very automated; I love it. For the same time away from home on a trip, you'll probably fly more in the 717 (maybe 4 legs a day for a total of 6.5 hours versus a one leg day on the 737 for 4.5 hours), so that equals more pay on the 717. The 737 type rating would be nice to have since not many other airlines have 717s. But as far as I know, the AirTran plan is to become an all 737 fleet someday, so you'll fly the 737 sooner or later. I'm enjoying my time in the 717 for a few more years until our leases run out, but I'm sure I'll enjoy the 737 just as much. Your seniority based on age in your hiring class will let you choose your jet. Expect 737s to go first. There's a two year seatlock when you train on your equipment, then you're free to move. Hope this helps. Either way, welcome to the youngest all boeing fleet!
 
CrewDog97 said:
That being said about the 737 above, I'll give you a spiel for the 717. It's more technologically advanced and is very automated; I love it. For the same time away from home on a trip, you'll probably fly more in the 717 (maybe 4 legs a day for a total of 6.5 hours versus a one leg day on the 737 for 4.5 hours), so that equals more pay on the 717. The 737 type rating would be nice to have since not many other airlines have 717s. But as far as I know, the AirTran plan is to become an all 737 fleet someday, so you'll fly the 737 sooner or later. I'm enjoying my time in the 717 for a few more years until our leases run out, but I'm sure I'll enjoy the 737 just as much. Your seniority based on age in your hiring class will let you choose your jet. Expect 737s to go first. There's a two year seatlock when you train on your equipment, then you're free to move. Hope this helps. Either way, welcome to the youngest all boeing fleet!
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Thanks man, this is what I am looking for. Right now I am leaning towards the 71 because of the numbers. There are quite a few more 71's than 73's right now. I know that will be changing over the next few years. With my demented way of thinking that translates into more line choices and less reserve time. My logic may be flawed though. Any thoughts.
 
I am on the 717. I have been online since Aug. and should have a build up line in March....so about 5-7 months on RSV. I love the airplane....very automated. The stews are great. Most are young and have great attitutes. So far the company is good to work for, I live in base which greatly improves QOL. I am gone from home about 6-7 nights a month with about 85 hours credits. Welcome.

MVR
 
There will probably more 717 FO's upgrading over the next couple years than 737 FO's. Most 737 FO's are waiting for 737 CA which is taking longer now since most vacancies for 737 CA are being filled by 717 CA.

Over the last 6 months, I would guess a 717 FO would be moving up 8-12 numbers a month due to senior 717 FO upgrading. Also, I would say overall the 717 FO's are younger, and a large percentage of these younger guys have there resumes out there and are looking for jobs like CAL and DAL.

The senioirity progression on 737 FO side is based on increased number of aircraft which puts for FO's behind you. There is alot less seniority progression due to senior FO's upgrading and attrition on the 737.
 
Just curious, I know some people possibly getting an interview call in the next week or two. What is the timetable for call for interview until actual interview to walking into class?

What date did you interview to be hired in the February 25th class?
 
when i interviewed, they called me the very next day with the job offer, but a friend of mine just interviewed and they told her they'd call her within two weeks if not sooner (but a guy in her class got the call the next day). class dates should follow shortly after that, i think, usually within a few weeks to a month. hope this helps!
 
Just curious, when I get on board today what a/c type would get me the earliest CA upgrade in a few years? Is all movement in the 71 due to upgrades to the 73, there can not be many retirements, right? Movement in the 73, I guess, is mostly acquisitions.

Other question. What are the odds for starting and ending trips from STL when I would go for the 71?

Are the layovers better on the 71 or 73?
 
It doesn't matter what airplane you are on as a FO. You can bid a CPT vacancy on either airplane based on seniority (you hire date and age). My guess would be that the B717 ends up being a quicker upgrade for guys down the road. The B717 has been more junior for the last 12 months. Before that, it seemed to go back and forth month to month, depending on which airplane had more CPT vacancies that month.

Alot of movement on 717 FO side recently as 717 FOs upgrade to both airplanes. There has been quite a few 717 CA vacancies over the last 6 months that have been filled by senior 717 FO's and very few (2 I think) 737 FO's. Hope this info helps.
 
maxblast72 said:
Just curious, I know some people possibly getting an interview call in the next week or two. What is the timetable for call for interview until actual interview to walking into class?

What date did you interview to be hired in the February 25th class?
Click to expand...


I interviewed on Jan 2'nd and got the call on Mon the 8'th for a Feb 25'th class.
 
Secret Squirrel said:
We were told by JL in class that the 717's are on lease until 2018, so they are not going away anytime soon.
Click to expand...

I believe the B717's are on 18 year leases which means the initial one would expire in 2018. The last 717 every built (which we have), was delivered in May of 2006, so an 18 year lease on that one wouldn't expire until 2024.
 
maxblast72 said:
I believe the B717's are on 18 year leases which means the initial one would expire in 2018. The last 717 every built (which we have), was delivered in May of 2006, so an 18 year lease on that one wouldn't expire until 2024.
Click to expand...

not quite, the 2006 annual report states the leases run until 2022.

We lease 79 B717 aircraft through various lessors, under leases with terms that expire through 2022. We have the option to renew the B717 leases for periods ranging from one to four years. The B717 leases have purchase options at or near the end of the lease term at fair market value, and two have purchase options based on a stated percentage of the lessor’s defined cost of the aircraft at the end of the thirteenth year of the lease term. Each of the leases contains return conditions that must be met prior to the termination of the leases. Forty-one of the B717 leases are the result of sale/leaseback transactions. Deferred gains from these transactions are being amortized over the terms of the leases. At December 31, 2006 and 2005, unamortized deferred gains were $59.7 million and $62.4 million, respectively. We also lease facilities from local airport authorities or other carriers, as well as office space under operating leases with terms ranging up to 12 years. In addition, we lease spare engines and certain rotables under capital leases.
Click to expand...
just because the leases run that long doesn't mean they will keep the airplanes. if nwa wants them to replace the dc9-30's and -50's i am sure it could be negotiated.
 
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That is a good point. I think the B737 definitely has a better CASM than our B717, and the margin is growing larger as the cost of fuel goes up.

Other than Northwest airlines (who has a good working knowledge of DC-9 products), I can't imagine any other airline out there wanting B717's so we might be stuck with them for a long time (unless Boeing wants to get creative for some more B737 sales).
 
maxblast72 said:
That is a good point. I think the B737 definitely has a better CASM than our B717, and the margin is growing larger as the cost of fuel goes up.

Other than Northwest airlines (who has a good working knowledge of DC-9 products), I can't imagine any other airline out there wanting B717's so we might be stuck with them for a long time (unless Boeing wants to get creative for some more B737 sales).
Click to expand...

I only mention NWA due to the fact that they may be obtaining our 25 717's and the 87 (79 leased, 8 owned) at AAI (who has a stated desire to be a one fleet 737 operation) makes a logical target. 112 717's to replace 115 DC-9's. The DC-9's are owned and could be scavenged for part's that could be used on the 717's (I have no idea how feasible that is though).
 
whoa...slow down, now!

the only reason NWA has -9s is that they're paid for. once NWA (or more likely, Delta) decides to park the 9s, there is nothing that says they will replace it with the same airframe. Especially if there's a 73 replacement on the horizon. (with the possible exception of some Chinese-owned MD-90s, as I understand).

as for using -9s for 717 parts...I'm no expert, but I bet that's like canning a '71 'vette for 2008 Z06 parts.
 
Other question. What are the odds for starting and ending trips from STL when I would go for the 71?

Are the layovers better on the 71 or 73?[/quote]

Fly4,
All our trips start and end in ATL. I don't think we're overnighting that many airplanes in STL yet, but I know some guys who commute out of there and they say it's ok. I guess we have quite a few ex-TWA and TWA express guys who commute from there.

As for the layovers, it depends on what you like. My old body doesn't like to leave the Eastern time zone and I rarely do on the 717. After a while in this industry, a city is a city. I just want a decent hotel with good food and brew. With the exception of some western layovers, I don't think they differ that much.
 
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goahead said:
Speaking of commutes, which area (FL, TX, NY, mid west etc...) would be the easiest to commute from????
Click to expand...

I commuted from Chicago and it was a breeze. There were seven FL flights a day and nine on Delta Connection (Republic, Shuttle, ASA) out of MDW. Lots more out of ORD.

DFW wouldn't be bad, BWI good, basically any city where both AirTran and Delta fly to from ATL.
 
njcapt said:
I commuted from Chicago and it was a breeze. There were seven FL flights a day and nine on Delta Connection (Republic, Shuttle, ASA) out of MDW. Lots more out of ORD.

DFW wouldn't be bad, BWI good, basically any city where both AirTran and Delta fly to from ATL.
Click to expand...
Thanks
 
I'd be careful about DFW, though. ASA has a bunch of people who still commute out of there, and the loads are always tight. The JS is rarely available.
 
This may be basic; remember that it is always better to JS on your own company's aircraft. With that in mind, try to commute from someplace that we have a descent presence (banking on that 1 or 2 flights/day might not be the best idea).
 
maxblast72 said:
Just curious, I know some people possibly getting an interview call in the next week or two. What is the timetable for call for interview until actual interview to walking into class?

What date did you interview to be hired in the February 25th class?
Click to expand...

Got the interview call on a Tuesday, interviewed the following Tuesday (interviews Tu - Fri), job offer the Monday after that. I took the very next class which was a week after that. So I was sitting in class, 2 weeks to the day from the morning I got the call for the interview. I was interviewing for the class that started yesterday but I took the earlier class as there were a couple of openings. That put me about 20 or so numbers ahead of where I would have been had I taken the first Jan class.

I couldn't be happier. What a great bunch of people.

Good luck.
 

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