ABX update

[LarryinTN]

I'm a member of APA 1224 but I'm not on the MEC.

Just to avoid confusion...

APA 1224 is a Teamster's Local. As such, we have no MEC. MEC's are used by ALPA, not the IBT. What we have is an executive board (e-board) that functions similarly to an ALPA MEC.

My impression is that an IBT e-board has more autonomy than does an ALPA MEC. Perhaps someone else can expand on that point.

 

[xspud]

Thanks, LJ. I do like to be precise about definitions and I was sloppy using "MEC". I've been ALPA in previous lives and I'm getting old, so it just slipped out. That's why I included the disclaimer in my post!

I also would like to learn the differences between the ALPA & IBT leadership structure.

 

[erichartmann]

Thanks, LJ. I do like to be precise about definitions and I was sloppy using "MEC". I've been ALPA in previous lives and I'm getting old, so it just slipped out. That's why I included the disclaimer in my post!

I also would like to learn the differences between the ALPA & IBT leadership structure.

The IBT is comprised of seperate Local Unions. 1224 is such a local. A local union may represent employees of more than one company, and administer more than one contract.

IBT locals are largely autonoumus units affiliated to the IBT (International Brotherhood of Teamsters) The local pays a "head tax" to the International from the dues it collects from its members. The International in turn provides resources the Local generally cannot afford on its own. These consist of but are not limited to training in various areas, including contract administration, negotiations etc.

An IBT local is run by the Executive Board (E-board). This consists of a President, Vice President, Secretary Treasurer, Recording Secretary, and three Trustees. The duties and responsibilies of the officers are spelled out in the IBT Constitution & Bylaws as well as the Local's Bylaws, which may differ or be more stringent than the IBT C&B but not more lax. ( If you do not have a copy of each they can be obtained from the local; ask). An E-board is elected to serve for a 3 year term in a strictly controlled secret ballot election. They cannot be recalled simply becasue the membership decides they don't like the policies they persue. They can be brought up on charges and removed from office for malfeasence, either individually or as a group. If it occurs as a group, a trustee will be appointed by the IBT to run the local until the problems are resolved and new E-board is elected and the trustee believes they are competent to run the local. The E-board are the only officers of the local.

There are various other official positions within the local which may be either appointed by the E-board or subject to election by the membership. It depends on how the bylaws are written. In the case of 1224 for example, stewards may be either elected or appointed. Generally the E-boards of 1224 have prefered to have elections rather than appoint. That said, they sometimes, in the past, have appointed people to positions if the people expressed an interest and a need was percieved to exist. These positions consist of the aforementioned Stewards, as well as various Committee Chairs and the committe members. If the E-board is doing its job the vaious commitees and the stewards act in a coordinated manner.

Originally the pilots at ABX were under the jurisdiction of Local 957 in Dayton. We were to small a group to be self sustaining as stand alone local. Local 957 was, in Teamster parlance, a general local with about 5000 members. It consisted mostly of truck drivers. Eventuallywe made up about 1/10 of their membership and paid about 1/3rd of the dues they collected. We had no presence on 957's E-board and some difficulity in getting those things we felt we needed. When we had reached a point where we felt we could support our own local, and we applied for a charter from the IBT to establish a new Local Union to represent the flight deck crewmembers at ABX.

 

[erichartmann]

Thanks, LJ. I do like to be precise about definitions and I was sloppy using "MEC". I've been ALPA in previous lives and I'm getting old, so it just slipped out. That's why I included the disclaimer in my post!

I also would like to learn the differences between the ALPA & IBT leadership structure.

The IBT is comprised of seperate Local Unions. 1224 is such a local. A local union may represent employees of more than one company, and administer more than one contract.

IBT locals are largely autonoumus units affiliated to the IBT (International Brotherhood of Teamsters) The local pays a "head tax" to the International from the dues it collects from its members. The International in turn provides resources the Local generally cannot afford on its own. These consist of but are not limited to training in various areas, including contract administration, negotiations etc. The "head tax" is a small portion of the total dues collected. The majority of the dues remain with the local for disbursement as the local sees fit. It is important that a local have enough income from dues to support the local's operations; i.e. legal representation etc. The Internationl generally does not get involved with "local" issues unless there are wider implications.

An IBT local is run by the Executive Board (E-board). This consists of a President, Vice President, Secretary Treasurer, Recording Secretary, and three Trustees. The duties and responsibilies of the officers are spelled out in the IBT Constitution & Bylaws as well as the Local's Bylaws, which may differ or be more stringent than the IBT C&B but not more lax. ( If you do not have a copy of each they can be obtained from the local; ask). An E-board is elected to serve for a 3 year term in a strictly controlled secret ballot election. They cannot be recalled simply becasue the membership decides they don't like the policies they persue. They can be brought up on charges and removed from office for malfeasence, either individually or as a group. If it occurs as a group, a trustee will be appointed by the IBT to run the local until the problems are resolved and new E-board is elected and the trustee believes they are competent to run the local. The E-board are the only officers of the local.

There are various other official positions within the local which may be either appointed by the E-board or subject to election by the membership. It depends on how the bylaws are written. In the case of 1224 for example, stewards may be either elected or appointed. Generally the E-boards of 1224 have prefered to have elections rather than appoint. That said, they sometimes, in the past, have appointed people to positions if the people expressed an interest and a need was percieved to exist. These positions consist of the aforementioned Stewards, as well as various Committee Chairs and the committe members. If the E-board is doing its job the vaious commitees and the stewards act in a coordinated manner.

Originally the pilots at ABX were under the jurisdiction of Local 957 in Dayton. We were to small a group to be self sustaining as stand alone local. Local 957 was, in Teamster parlance, a general local with about 5000 members. It consisted mostly of truck drivers. Eventuallywe made up about 1/10 of their membership and paid about 1/3rd of the dues they collected. We had no presence on 957's E-board and some difficulity in getting those things we felt we needed. When we had reached a point where we felt we could support our own local, and we applied for a charter from the IBT to establish a new Local Union to represent the flight deck crewmembers at ABX.

 

[LarryinTN]

The IBT is comprised of ...

Z? Is that you?

 

[penguin22]

News

http://biz.yahoo.com/bw/061213/20061213005922.html?.v=1

"ABXA today announced that Randy D. Rademacher, an experienced airline executive with a strong financial background, has been elected to its Board of Directors.
Rademacher, 50, is a former president of Comair Holdings, the parent company of Comair from 1999 until 2005"



also interesting to note all the insiders buying stock at market prices last few weeks:
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/it?s=ABXA

 

[penguin22]

also interesting to note all the insiders buying stock at market prices last few weeks:
http://finance.yahoo.com/q/it?s=ABXA

LOL !
except Manisbusan maybe should find a new broker! LOL!


17-Nov-06MANIBUSAN DENNIS A
6 shares DirectPurchase at $1000 per share.

LOL, got to be a typo...

 

[erichartmann]

Z? Is that you?

Nope. And even if I were Z the answer would still be nope. If I wanted to broadcast my name I'd use it instead of a screen name.

 

[Bitter]

Any positive news at Abx? Or is it still doom and gloom?

 

[erichartmann]

Any positive news at Abx? Or is it still doom and gloom?

I guess that depends on your perspective (seniority). From my POV it's more wait and see vs doom and gloom.

I think DPWN/DHL plans to wind up with one carrier operating domestically in the U.S. and perhaps to and from as well. They don't have complete control though, and I think there are a number of contingency plans out there. It's worth noting that both Astar and ABX are in contract negotiations with their pilots. The outcome of those negotiations (costs, work stoppage/disruption, etc) will IMHO have a major impact.

ABX looks like a company that is trying to position itself for the future. It's hard to say what Astar is doing because they are privately held and don't have the public reporting requirements ABX has.

These are not good times in the aviation business if you are wedded to job security.

 

[xspud]

I guess that depends on your perspective (seniority). From my POV it's more wait and see vs doom and gloom.

I concur with that. I'm not impressed with DHL so far, so not everything I've written is positive. But I hope that I'm far from "doom & gloom" and I don't sense that attitude at ABX. Even for those of us who haven't had the opportunities and QOL that we hoped for, it's still a great job. The only guys who've had a truly bad deal are the ones on furlough.

There will have to be some movement after the first of the year due to 767's coming on line. That will actually generate some news. For now, only conjecture.

 

[goastar]

>The outcome of those negotiations (costs, work stoppage/disruption, etc) will IMHO have a major impact. <

This may have an impact in the short term, which I really have no doubt that ABX will be the surviver. You have the ground and air tied up. What concerns me is the long term. A few changes in ownership rules and it won't be long that ABX will be competing with the likes of a DHL Aero Express. That may be said for most airlines, but even more so for ACMI carriers. The next 5 or so years could be interesting. The boys at aero express are already talking about going to 75 school down in Mijami.

I hardly think DHL is a wait and see for anything. I believe its a time to gear up the resume and find something else while you have an income kind of job. I used to laugh of your talk of the Airborne golden days, but you boys were right DHL came in and hosed up a good thing. Good luck, as for me the resumes are flowin.

 

[penguin22]

Any positive news at Abx? Or is it still doom and gloom?

Are you furloughed?
If so, here's my perspective, FWIW, with emphasis on the short term outlook, since that what would affect you directly.

I wouldn’t call it doom and gloom either, but as erichartman says I’m sure its different if you’re still furloughed, or on the bottom. But there’s no way I see any more pilot furloughs coming. We’ll be recall/hiring eventually, not furloughing. The question is when.

Here’s key points to watch for, IMO
How quickly will the remaining DC8s get parked? There’s still 16 active captains and 22 FOs that will eventually get moved to 767 or DC9. Worst case, of course, would be if they all get parked real soon. But I’ve even heard rumors that DHL is considering putting a couple DC8s thru C check (that decision supposedly sometime next month), which means of course they’ll hang around for quite some time.

Where do the additional 767s get put into service? (5-6 more, I think) If its in the DHL network, they can be crewed with maybe half the staffing required for putting them on some of these charters. We’re short 767 crews now. If they go to charters we’ll be REALLY short of 767 crews. If this Japan operation thats rumored happens we’ll be REALLY REALLY short of 767 crews. Meanwhile, 767 training continues.

I’ve read lots of concern about getting rid of the DC9s, but that’s not gonna happen anytime soon. DHL will have to have a replacement first, and there’s no sign of one coming right now, whether its ABX or anybody else. Put that in the long term concern column. Short term, they’re safe.

Put it all together, and here’s the worst/best case scenarios…
Worst case: Remaining DC8s get parked right after Christmas rush. Additional 767s go to DHL.
Those 36 DC8 pilots will have to go to 767/DC9. Recall and hiring gets pushed off until that’s done. Call me crazy, but I still don’t see pilot furloughing with that (unlikely) scenario.

Best case: DC8s just keep hanging around, maybe DHL pays to C-check one or two. (the most likely DC8 scenario IMO) This Japan 767 operation gets fast-tracked. In that case, I’m gonna bet we see recall/hiring in the first quarter 2007, certainly in the first half of next year.

BTW, anybody else notice mgmt seemed to have changed their tune? We’re no longer hearing ‘we’re adequately staffed’. Now they’re admitting they were ‘caught short’ of pilots. FWIW

 

[abxaviator]

4 DC-8 Captains and 4 DC-9 FO's to start 767 class next month.

 

[penguin22]

4 DC-8 Captains and 4 DC-9 FO's to start 767 class next month.

Yes and my numbers above ("There’s still 16 active captains and 22 FOs that will eventually get moved to 767 or DC9") didn't include that bid.

Thanks for clarifying

 

[xspud]

A few changes in ownership rules and it won't be long that ABX will be competing with the likes of a DHL Aero Express.

Anything is possible, of course, but I'm not sure I agree that would be the outcome. My impression is that DHL's modus operandi has been to buy the carrier that's in place instead of growing another carrier. Growing DHL Aero Express from a (I think) 4 airplane operation to something the size of Astar or ABX is not the way DHL has done business in the past. Being owned by DHL doesn't seem to have provided many growth opportunities for the carriers they've bought so far.

There's not much sympathy for foreign ownership in the U.S. right now, either. Europe may force something to happen by holding out open skies, but there's a lot of sentiment against it for the time being. I see status quo in ownership rules for a while.

 

[GoABX]

Rumor 1: Proffer for 6 DC-9 captains in Jan

Rumor 2: Recall and perhaps draining pool in Jan

My vote is for another 6 month mega proffer to give us and the company some visibility. Only downside is mgt. may be trying to increase morale as they enter talks on pay and retirement in hopes of getting off cheaper.

 

[penguin22]

Only downside is mgt. may be trying to increase morale as they enter talks on pay and retirement in hopes of getting off cheaper.

they must be dreaming :laugh:





like my new sig?

 

[penguin22]

like my new sig?

hmmm. 'No concessionary contracts' kinda sounds like a contract without a payraise would suffice.

Of course we need a payraise!!

I'll have to tweak that signature somehow.

 

[GoABX]

With upgrade expectations going from 5 to 15 years, we need to realign FO rates back to the percentages.

We need a B-Fund, even a small one to start, just so we can work on it in future contracts. Does it matter whether you get a 5%/yr pay raise or a B fund that increases 5%/yr? Can you imagine having a 25% B fund after 5 years?!!!!

UPS/FDX minus 15% will work for me and still give DHL a cost advantage.