AA/USAir non SLI?

[OHGOON]

Not angry at all. Funny how you west guys call us the angry FO club. I challenge you to go to the historic posts on this subject matter...clearly the west are very angry...and have alot of time on their hands posting endlessly here. I hear GL calling... he wants you to come back to bed.

Well, you do come across as pretty wound up. You are right that the West boys are angry. Seems to me, from a very outsider perspective who however has followed this poo-flinging contest very closely, that the West was and is a victim of mob rule. You would be angry too, if you were not the beneficiary of the outcome so far.

 

[MCDU]

Not being able to cash in on a windfall is making Mesa grande pilots very angry. I give east pilots all the credit in fighting an award that placed a new hire in front of someone that has 17 years. The Nic is dead. Count on it. The Alpa integration failed.

M

 

[Turtle21]

Well, you do come across as pretty wound up. You are right that the West boys are angry. Seems to me, from a very outsider perspective who however has followed this poo-flinging contest very closely, that the West was and is a victim of mob rule. You would be angry too, if you were not the beneficiary of the outcome so far.

The Nic was a wonderful win contingent on everyone voting to use it. That never happened. No one has any problem with them being mad about it, we all understand greed. Whats the big deal?

 

[OHGOON]

The Nic was a wonderful win contingent on everyone voting to use it. That never happened. No one has any problem with them being mad about it, we all understand greed. Whats the big deal?

Of course that applies to your position just as much or how else do you justify ignoring an integration arbitration decision that was signed by both sides?

 

[OHGOON]

Not being able to cash in on a windfall is making Mesa grande pilots very angry. I give east pilots all the credit in fighting an award that placed a new hire in front of someone that has 17 years. The Nic is dead. Count on it. The Alpa integration failed.

M

...but it came at a price... Except for the very senior pilots who would have lost a lot, most of you guys have not had a raise in 6+ yrs...how is that a win in anybody's book?

Not to mention the implications for the arbitration process as a whole...

 

[slaquer5]

You decided to post on this subject...you open yourself up when you do that.I really don't care what happens to you guys and your lists.

Thanks for answering my question (BTW you did not )


By your reply , I am guessing USAPA will go to the judge/arabratrator and yell squirrel and hope that distraction will work

I do not think your plan will work,as the judge will not be a 5 yr old or a Golden Retriever .

Go luck, as I think you are going to need it .




I am guessing you do not like to answer my questions, but here is another

How much money has been lost by the senior USAir pilots that are now ,or have just retired , without a pay raise and working with subpar wages?

 

[General Lee]

Hey dork... Get a life and get a girlfriend. You've posted more on OUR subject matter than anyone else. Wow, I really thought DAL had good hiring standards. You have obviously snuck a quick one on them.

Dork? Our merger went great because both sides followed the BINDING award. You guys are a complete joke! I'd comment more on our situation, but I don't have to, it went great, both sides have INTEGRITY. So, now I get to comment on your new "union's" unravelling, and it will be interesting to watch. I do think it funny that because I was hired somewhere, you think I can't point out OBVIOUS wrongs that your group did to another. Your group's action can affect us all. "Oh, I guess we don't like something we all signed up for, so we'll just dump the union and the award and start a new one....." What a bunch of jackholes.


Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Crzipilot]

Integrity, you see a lack of it in every corner of the US from the top all the way to the bottom.. But yet Pilots are to be these higher than thou integrity honorers.... Your merger went great because you guys saw the train wreck and the gaping hole ALPA left open that allowed an out to the arbitrated award. Did the DAL and NWA not negotiate a JCBA first and then the seniority list. No one could get out of the loop hole we found.

You show me one industry anywhere in this country that someone has not used a loop hole to further their cause?

 

[Bringupthebird]

Loopholes are legal, DFR's are not. Big difference.

 

[General Lee]

Integrity, you see a lack of it in every corner of the US from the top all the way to the bottom.. But yet Pilots are to be these higher than thou integrity honorers.... Your merger went great because you guys saw the train wreck and the gaping hole ALPA left open that allowed an out to the arbitrated award. Did the DAL and NWA not negotiate a JCBA first and then the seniority list. No one could get out of the loop hole we found.

You show me one industry anywhere in this country that someone has not used a loop hole to further their cause?

You are giving excuses for not accepting something EVERYONE agreed upon prior to it starting. Everyone also agreed to Nicolau. The process on choosing an arbitrator has each side picking a few of them, and then among those you pick one. The East MEC chair initially stated that Nic was a good choice. Then, after the process started, Nic supposedly told the East to forget DOH and to negotiate more with the West, to which they refused! Even though a big hint was supposedly given by the arbitrator, it wasn't followed. Then, the award still gave the top 500 positions to the East due to the INTL flying. The refusal of the award has cost everyone money, I even make $25 more per hour as an FO than your 320 Capts! That means 6 years of lost wages that could have been used for retirement planning etc. What a complete flop for you Easties. Tell me where I am wrong. And who's choice was it to do the SLI first? Did your MEC have a voice in that matter? Ours did. Sounds like BOTH MECs of yours screwed that up. Also, both sides were given chances to explain in full their positions on why they deserved their version of the proposed SLI. Sounds like Nic didn't buy any of your side's argument. That happens everyday in different courts. Not often though, are awards just circumvented by one of the parties after the award is given. That sets a dangerous precedent, and as the last judge stated, puts USAPA on dangerous ground.



Bye Bye---General Lee

 

[Turtle21]

Of course that applies to your position just as much or how else do you justify ignoring an integration arbitration decision that was signed by both sides?

Of course greed applies to my position, whatever it is, and to yours too. That was the point. Everyone uses all the rules of the game to get the best outcome for them. You bid your best shot every month. Its part of being in a union. Its part of life.

The arbitration was contingent on both sides voting it into existence. That did not happen. It was the rule. It was what it was.

Now we have a new contingent seniority integration agreement that replaces the old one. If the POR is approved we all move forward as one big happy (whining) family. Life will go one. The sun may even come up!

 

[Turtle21]

Of course that applies to your position just as much or how else do you justify ignoring an integration arbitration decision that was signed by both sides?

Of course greed applies to my position, whatever it is, and to yours too. That was the point. Everyone uses all the rules of the game to get the best outcome for them. You bid your best shot every month. Its part of being in a union. Its part of life.

The arbitration was contingent on both sides voting it into existence. That did not happen. It was the rule. It was what it was.

Now we have a new contingent seniority integration agreement that replaces the old one. If the POR is approved we all move forward as one big happy (whining) family. Life will go one. The sun may even come up!

 

[Turtle21]

Of course that applies to your position just as much or how else do you justify ignoring an integration arbitration decision that was signed by both sides?

Of course greed applies to my position, whatever it is, and to yours too. That was the point. Everyone uses all the rules of the game to get the best outcome for them. You bid your best shot every month. Its part of being in a union. Its part of life.

The arbitration was contingent on both sides voting it into existence. That did not happen. It was the rule. It was what it was.

Now we have a new contingent seniority integration agreement that replaces the old one. If the POR is approved we all move forward as one big happy (whining) family. Life will go one. The sun may even come up!

 

[Turtle21]

Of course that applies to your position just as much or how else do you justify ignoring an integration arbitration decision that was signed by both sides?

Of course greed applies to my position, whatever it is, and to yours too. That was the point. Everyone uses all the rules of the game to get the best outcome for them. You bid your best shot every month. Its part of being in a union. Its part of life.

The arbitration was contingent on both sides voting it into existence. That did not happen. It was the rule. It was what it was.

Now we have a new contingent seniority integration agreement that replaces the old one. If the POR is approved we all move forward as one big happy (whining) family. Life will go one. The sun may even come up!

 

[Turtle21]

Of course that applies to your position just as much or how else do you justify ignoring an integration arbitration decision that was signed by both sides?

Of course it does. Greed applies to your position, my position, and everyone else's position. That is life. We all apply every rule available to us to get the best deal we can. You bid every month, maybe everyday. That is life.

We had a seniority agreement contingent on each side voting it into effect, into existence. That did not happen. Now we have a new seniority integration agreement that will replace the old agreement, also contingent... contingent on the POR approval. We will all move along as one big happy family according to the new agreement that we all voted for. The sun may even come up tomorrow!