A Review of Avantair

[fivefootnuthin]

The more things change, the more they stay the same hahahaha I haven't been on here in quite a while, but I see some of the same players. Bashers on one fringe, kool-aid drinkers on the other. Anyone reading these posts to try to determine Avantair as a place to invest their time would be wise to seek the middle. I was at Avantair for 3 years and have since left for greener pastures, but before i go on regarding my time at Avantair Im wondering -- is it true that theyre no longer using Flight Safety and have returned to in-house training?

 

[brewerdog]

FO pay raise as of this month, more to come next year

good on ya mates

 

[jaxpilot]

Ha, I figured that was the general concensus on the guy. Seen him in TLH and RSW with that thing on...

 

[learflyer]

Nothing wrong with wearing a hat to protect from the sun......fbo? Take it off!

 

[BeenThereDoneIt]

The big conference call did occur, and the FO pay was discussed. I expect a press release soon!

1) From what I understand (please correct this if I am wrong), 2nd year FO pay will increase to a whopping $40,000 on the next pay cycle.

2) Captain upgrades are now forecast to be between 36-48 months, according to company projections.!

3) Avantair will implement a 2-tier payscale for FO's. The current employees will get the raise that is mentioned above. New hires will be placed into the older payscale where they will NOT get the raise.

On the company forum.....Glasspilot is raising HELL about the new A/B pay scale for FO's. He thinks the company is making a big mistake. I agree with Glasspilot. Glass....good job for speaking up against such a thing.

 

[corpflunkie]

The big conference call did occur, and the FO pay was discussed. I expect a press release soon!
Thought you didn't work here anymore, so you wouldn't be privy to the call

1) From what I understand (please correct this if I am wrong), 2nd year FO pay will increase to a whopping $40,000 on the next pay cycle.
Jan 9th, 2010 it increases another $2000

2) Captain upgrades are now forecast to be between 36-48 months, according to company projections.!
I personally never heard 36-48 months. I did hear up to 30 upgrades in the next 12 months possible if we follow our delivery schedule

3) Avantair will implement a 2-tier payscale for FO's. The current employees will get the raise that is mentioned above. New hires will be placed into the older payscale where they will NOT get the raise
It is far from a perfect situation, but the goal was to help the pilots already on the seniority list. Nothing has been finalized as to how we are going to set the payscale when we do start hiring again.


On the company forum.....Glasspilot is raising HELL about the new A/B pay scale for FO's. He thinks the company is making a big mistake. I agree with Glasspilot. Glass....good job for speaking up against such a thing.
Once again, if you no longer work here, how do you know what is being posted on the company's PRIVATE sight? If you are who we all think (pretty sure) you are, get a grip and move on.

the fact that in this economy, Avantair was able to increase the pay for a group of it's CURRENT employees when everyone else in the industry is either furloughing or damn near begging for people to take unpaid leave or early retirement, should speak volumes.

 

[BeenThereDoneIt]

Heck....as long as you are verifying that newhires will be making $37,000 as second-year FO's.....that's good enough. I'm sure that a lot of people will appreciate your honesty. I certainly do. Good luck!

 

[glasspilot]

I've been vocal that I greatly disagree with a disgruntled former employee lashing back on his previous employer. It speaks volumes that BTDI acknowledges he would have stayed at such a horrible place if only he had upgraded.

It seems he still has friends in Denver who share the company forum news with him (since BTDI no longer has access to the forum himself). It is true that I have been vocal on the company forum on the FO pay subject in that I do not like that new raises are aimed solely at current pilots.

Here is the difference: I POSTED ON A COMPANY FORUM!!! Not a public site behind a fake name. Now that it has been made public by our very own Benedict Arnold I have to say that I firmly believe that the company will rectify this. I think it unlikely that any new hire will actually be paid their 2nd year under the old pay scale. We are a public company with a board that must approve all expenditures. While we (alone) have posted a profit this past quarter, we are still appreciative of the difficult economic conditions out there.

The reason for this FO pay policy is simply to limit future liability so as to get the raise approved. The feeling was that it would not be approved if it was open ended. As time goes on, with luck, we will continue our success and the raises will be permanent for ALL pilots. This current raise buys us a little over a year to sort it out as it only applies to 2nd year pay anyway, meaning a pilot hired today would not be affected for another year.

In short, I wish the raises were done differently, but I do not believe any new hire will be affected negatively by this short sighted FO pay policy. The company takes care of it's pilots. I have seen this time and time again. Myself included.

In fact, it is proof that Avantair management is open to opposing viewpoints that I am still employed after "raising HELL" on the company forum.

BTDI, thanks for caring so much. We all take forks in the road. You made a turn...now go see what's down there. Good luck on your adventures.

 

[HazMat]

Just so there is no misinformation anyone who has been given am offer will be subject to the new second year FO pay. The pilot group was asked to discuss pay for new hires. No decision was made on that issue. The company mentality is always to protect current employees before worrying about those who have not been offered a job. A decision will be made before new offers are made. Before being critical let's wait and see what happens.

 

[HazMat]

Btdi and whatever other name you are using you are the captain of misinformation. Noone said upgrades are forcast to take 3 to 4 years in fact the company said they expected 30 upgrades over the next year and more than 30 the following year as we are captain heavy right now.

 

[BeenThereDoneIt]

You guys have given this thread so much life, it is almost funny. It was just a post about current policies/pay at Avantair (not one was disputed, but you did try to sugar-coat them)....and my particular experience there. CM is probably about to crap his pants because of you guys. Heck, I didn't even mention the 1-week vacation compared to other companies, etc. I just posted about current Avantair sick day policies, crew meal policies, "ya can't get another job flying a Piaggio for a year after quitting Avantair policies"...etc. All of those policies are in writing.

Some of you guys actually think that only 55% of your flights are passenger flights. Whose to argue with you? The BEST service you guys can do for your company is say, "he's right, but we are working on it." The best thing you can do for fellow aviators who read here is to tell the the truth about pay, upgrades, written policies, etc. They will appreciate it. Good luck to ALL pilots.

Oh, Hazmat.....if you guys are "hoping for" 30 captain upgrades over the next year, and 30 more after the second year, and so on......and you know how many FOs are already waiting...then you just showed everyone that the FO's at the bottom of the list are looking at 3+ years for upgrades. You just proved my point. Thanks.

 

[HazMat]

Btdi all we are asking is for you to be truthful about all aspects. Not outright lie and sprinkle in some truth and then use another username to support yourself. You posted as if you knew what was said on the conference call we just responded to the misinformation u posted. As long as you continue to put out untruthful information we will continue to correct your attempts to mislead. In the meantime enjoy your new job

 

[BeenThereDoneIt]

Hazmat...sounds like a great idea. Just tell me which one of these things I mentioned are NOT current Avantair written policy:

2nd year FO pay for new hires STILL = $37,000 per year.

1 week paid vacation for the first few years.

7 sick days, after using 2, you need a doctors excuse. After 3 in a row, they will NOT send you out on your tour and use must either use all 7, or do without pay.

No FO night take-off or landings.

No FO passenger legs until 225 hours in type.

Only 1/3 of the number of domiciles as the leading competitor has.

Pilots must pay for crew meals.

Blackberrys for captains only.

No-Compete clause in contract that says YOU can't fly another Piaggio for 1 year after leaving Avantair.

FO's required to do captain checkride and 6-month checks without actually upgrading.

Heck...that's just the WRITTEN policies. I didn't even mention the safety issues, accidents, etc. Just let the readers know......are any of those policies mentioned above NOT in the policy manuals?

 

[HazMat]

Hazmat...sounds like a great idea. Just tell me which one of these things I mentioned are NOT current Avantair written policy:
2nd year FO pay for new hires STILL = $37,000 per year.

Correct, 2nd year FO pay has not changed since January 2005 in part due to the fact that upgrade was likely in 12 months or less. Once it was identified that a slow down of upgrade time was occurring, an effort to revisit pay scales began between the Pilot Advisory Committee and management. To date, the company responded during a down economy to take care of current First Officers. We expect to see changes in the future.

1 week paid vacation for the first few years.
Correct, and if you are hired prior to April, you can get that vacation in the first 8 months of hire.

7 sick days, after using 2, you need a doctors excuse. After 3 in a row, they will NOT send you out on your tour and use must either use all 7, or do without pay.
Incorrect, they will send you out but you must commit to a minimum of 5 days out. If you can not commit to that you can either take an unpaid leave or collect sick time

No FO night take-off or landings.
Correct but an incomplete statement - due to turbo prop catagory night T/O and landings for the PIC are required every 90 days (different than turbo jet rules) to keep current with the number of night landings, since summer night time is so limited, it makes more sense to have the PIC complete them. In the summer time the night take offs are typically the issue.

Only 1/3 of the number of domiciles as the leading competitor has.
Incorrect statement - I count 46 domiciles, i think the NJ has 100 CS has 25 FJ has 5 FO has 18.

Pilots must pay for crew meals.
Incorrect - they pay only a portion, the amount is dependant on if it is breakfast, lunch or dinner. With no more than $15.00 being shelled out.

Blackberrys for captains only.
Incomplete - First Officers recieve $25.00 for use of their personal cell phones while on the line. Captains recieve trip sheets and coordinate with the FO prior to flight.

No-Compete clause in contract that says YOU can't fly another Piaggio for 1 year after leaving Avantair.
Incomplete statement - I believe this applies to the first year training contract period and the year following. I personally know of four friends that have left to fly very nice private/corporate piaggio jobs.

FO's required to do captain checkride and 6-month checks without actually upgrading.
Incorrect again - FO's after the completion of their first recurrent are required to complete all check rides to the same standards as a Captain.

Heck...that's just the WRITTEN policies. I didn't even mention the safety issues, accidents, etc. Just let the readers know......are any of those policies mentioned above NOT in the policy manuals?

It is clear you that you left over not getting an upgrade and I am happy that you were able to secure a ground instructor position with decent goverment pay. Given your background, that should be a very good fit for you.

 

[BeenThereDoneIt]

I'll let your post speak for me...LOL

 

[cherry20's]

I think BTDI has a point hazmat... He isn't speaking outright lies, just has a couple of fine details wrong. You guys are just feeding the fire here.

I wish the best for your company BTW. Have a couple friends there...

 

[myrealnameis]

I think BTDI has a point hazmat... He isn't speaking outright lies, just has a couple of fine details wrong. You guys are just feeding the fire here.

I wish the best for your company BTW. Have a couple friends there...

I agree, feeding the fire. This mr. bryant is a ****************************** bag troll.

 

[corpflunkie]

I agree, feeding the fire. This mr. bryant is a ****************************** bag troll.

Completely uncalled for

 

[wacoflyr]

Just let it die. He's happy to be gone, and we're happy to be here. I agree that names have no place in this. When we hire in this economy, our new pilots will certainly know what they are getting into, and I suspect they will get there information from far more reliable sources than can be found here. So good luck BTDT, I wish you the very best. I am happy here, and I wish you all the happiness that you can find.

Regards, Wacoflyr

 

[mushroom]

Hi all:

Reviving an older thread, which has made interesting reading to say the least! Filtering through everything, it does give some good info about the company and the lifestyles and etc. there though.

What's new at Avantair? One of my F/O's at my present company was there from the beginning and was very senior, but left for greener (at the time) pastures. I don't think he necessarily had any problems with the company and enjoyed working there. I just applied online and am wondering if you guys have any hiring planned in the future? I would ask my F/O but I think he's a little out of the loop with what's up there.

As far as the "bad" things about a company...don't complain until you have to be out of the U.S. in a third-world country for months at a time! There are LOTS of worse jobs out there, believe me. Even if they pay a lot more. Time at home is precious.

Anyone who has some good info, please chime in, or feel free to PM me. Thanks!