9e/xj/9l picketing 12/10 mem

[SEVEN]

[FONT=&quot]Mesaba and Colgan’s MECs requested for their pilots NOT to support 9E pilots. That’s huge and it changes things from now on. Even if we get the contract it’s a big deal and it will not be forgotten. It’s one thing to have a low level of support (we expected that) but to specifically request pilots not to support one another is unheard of. These pilot groups are going to have to work side by side and I can assure you they will remember this for a very long time. It’s just wrong.[/FONT]

If you or any Pinnacle pilot has a problem with the decision XJ MEC made, take it up with them. Don't be mad or angry at the Mesaba OR Colgan pilot groups, they didn't make the decision, the union leadership did.

 

[Top Gum]

If you or any Pinnacle pilot has a problem with the decision XJ MEC made, take it up with them. Don't be mad or angry at the Mesaba OR Colgan pilot groups, they didn't make the decision, the union leadership did.

I understand that and I agree with you. I’m sure they will even have memos printed saying just that. They’ll have to because it will indeed effect how the pilot groups feel about one another. It is what it is. You can’t say, “don’t support your fellow ALPA group” and expect it not to cause problems among the group not being supported.

It’s a bad time to pull something like this and the MEC’s should be ashamed.

 

[Flyer1015]

If you or any Pinnacle pilot has a problem with the decision XJ MEC made, take it up with them. Don't be mad or angry at the Mesaba OR Colgan pilot groups, they didn't make the decision, the union leadership did.

Then do the right thing. Show up anyway and support us.

 

[1.3XVso]

This whole thing is *************************ed up..

If this would've been a blood shed revolution we'd all be *************************ed.

 

[SEVEN]

Then do the right thing. Show up anyway and support us.

Who says this is the "right" thing to do? You? I think you're wrong and I disagree personally with the Pinnacle Pilot MEC decision to go against the grain at this point in the negotiations. With that being said, if a Mesaba or Colgan pilot wants to walk in circles with you....it's on them. Just so you know, walking in circles tends to be counter-productive.....especially in this situation.

 

[LanceAir]

Is Mesaba and Colgan MEC not afraid of the possible repercussions in the future for advising their pilots NOT to support another ALPA group?

I have no idea whats gonna happen at Pinnacle Corp. next year, but lets just say LOA 21 happens or frag policy (which I really dont know much about) takes affect. Whatever it may be, and metal starts moving. If Mesaba and/or Colgan thinks they are getting the shaft and decide to picket, will they expect Pinnacle, Delta, FedEx, United to be there to support?? I am not saying they won't but there is that possibility, isn't there? I heard one of the reasons why the NWA pilots didnt support the mechanic strike, was because the Mechanics told the pilots to pound sand back when they asked for help.

That's just it...9E didn't ask anything, they simply left the reservation and put out Comm about a picket. 9E ventured out on their own...XJ and 9L decided not to lemming off the cliff with them.

 

[SEVEN]

Scolding 9E MEC Email to its Pilots From "leader" S.E.

You guys obviously just don't get it do you. A very strong-worded email to throw gas on an already unstable fire. FYI....brotherhood DOES NOT equal blind support.


The issue is pinnacle's pilot group trying to make decisions for the rest of the pilot groups under the pinnacle holdings umbrella. Not gonna happen!
For the record, they already ruled the LOA unusable and that it's illegal to do any form of staple or ratio integration. The 9E MEC needs to work together and stop the dividing of an already volatile situation.


****SPECIAL EDITION****


12/9/10

• Joint Contract Negotiations

The past two days of contract negotiations have seen forward movement in open issues. On Wednesday, all remaining issues in Section 11 (Training) and Section 24 (Filling of Vacancies) were resolved and the sections were TA'd. On Thursday, succesorship and fragmentation provisions were settled in Section 1 (Scope) and the minor issues remaining in Section 26 (General) were also resolved leaving both of these sections TA'd. A plug-in number for the premium that the union reimburses the company for Union leave was also settled and Section 13 (Leaves of Absence) was closed as well.

The key issues that define pilot contracts have emerged from these negotiations and the JNC will continue to work through the rest of the week to try to find resolution. An update will be released on Friday night with the conclusion of this week's negotiations.


• Memphis Picketing - Reminder

Picketing will be held at the Memphis airport on Friday, December 10th as scheduled.

• Initial staging at airport conference room 2A (near A concourse security checkpoint).
• Picketing begins at 12:30 on the commercial vehicle lane walkway (upper level). If you cannot make the staging just show up on the line.
• Hats are encouraged but not required.

As many of you have probably heard, the Mesaba and Colgan MECs have specifically instructed their pilots to not to join us in our planned picketing event this Friday. While the circumstances each of our pilot groups currently face is vastly different and the inclination to perform picketing right now only lies with your MEC, we were shocked to see the other MECs come out and instruct their pilots to NOT support us. We were not anticipating much involvement from the other MECs for our event but this outward rejection of support is unheard of Union circles and certainly not welcome.

Unity and brotherhood are the tenants of Unionism and the tools we use to persevere in the face of adversity. Apparently, the Mesaba and Colgan MECs only believe in these tenets when they agree with you.

 

[gojo]

[FONT=&quot]Mesaba and Colgan’s MECs requested for their pilots NOT to support 9E pilots. That’s huge and it changes things from now on. Even if we get the contract it’s a big deal and it will not be forgotten. It’s one thing to have a low level of support (we expected that) but to specifically request pilots not to support one another is unheard of. These pilot groups are going to have to work side by side and I can assure you they will remember this for a very long time. It’s just wrong.[/FONT]

You guys that say this stuff are simply amazing. There has been many good posts on here that explain the process and the fact that these are not section six negotiations anymore, but several people are so blinded by frustration and anger created by the falied attempts during the previous 6 years to even consider any other options. It has only been 69 days, and it is apparent progress is being made, and we are not at an impasse yet. With that said, no one said that we didn't support Pinnacle pilots. We do. What was not supported was picketing at this time. Now when 2 out of three MECs feel that the timing isn't right and the other MEC splits off and does their own thing, couldn't that also be viewed as a lack of support or a lack of working together. This is where the problem started. It's almost like one MEC is trying to coheres by creating an angry mob and that's what we got now. What I don't understand is why does it seem like it's MY WAY OR NOTHING. If the talks stall and everyone feels picketing would be good, I'll be right there with you. Then we'' have some beers afterwards

 

[SEVEN]

The truth is that because 2 of 3 MECs don't agree with Scott and his merry band of crybabies then we don't support traditional union behavior? We're making very good progress at the negotiating table but Scott wants us to help stick a finger in management's eye. Now is not the time and he should know better.

Mesaba pilots are beginning to get the picture of why Pinnacle pilots don't have a contract yet. Somebody needs to remove that guy before he does any more damage.

 

[AiRegency]

All the Mesaba and Colgan MEC's had to do was say nothing or maintain a neutral position. But instead they took up an aggressive stance against the 9E MEC. For that, they and their supporters will one day pay. Simple! Enjoy your Christmas with no contract and now... no brotherhood.

 

[gojo]

All the Mesaba and Colgan MEC's had to do was say nothing or maintain a neutral position. But instead they took up an aggressive stance against the 9E MEC. For that, they and their supporters will one day pay. Simple! Enjoy your Christmas with no contract and now... no brotherhood.

I think they tried that approach. We were all hearing about a picketing event, but nothing from our union regarding. Lots of people were asking, hey WTF what's going on? Yhey finally had to say something. I ask you how it would have looked if they didn't say anything. Isn't that kind of making a statement also? And the no brotherhood thing, that started when YOUR MEC decided to break away from the pack. I gaurantee you that Pinnacle management wasn't the only thing keeping you from a contract the last 6 years

 

[xjhawk]

Who says this is the "right" thing to do? You? I think you're wrong and I disagree personally with the Pinnacle Pilot MEC decision to go against the grain at this point in the negotiations. With that being said, if a Mesaba or Colgan pilot wants to walk in circles with you....it's on them. Just so you know, walking in circles tends to be counter-productive.....especially in this situation.

I agree. You want me to go to support your picketing when there is progress being made? That does not make sense. I have not read this entire post but have seen enough copies of it posted on other forums to know that you should not be mad at Mesaba's MEC or its pilot group for not supporting your picketing at a moment which does none of us any good. You might not know this but we at Mesaba wanted to see you guys at 9E get a great contract. We did not want this, we all know how you have been treated and in no way want to be placed in that situation. We have been treated badly ourselves but from what I hear your management has brought that aspect to management to a new level.

Lets get a number of things straight.

We have a good contract forced on us through bankruptcy so that should saw something about our union-they are smart in the way they conduct negotiations and have the backing of the mesaba pilots.

you might as well throw out the thought of any sort of staple, ratio or job offer if the jets we fly get transfered. We are all ALPA and that is how a proper SLI will be conducted.

trying to sabotage current contract negotiations will not do you any good. The contract they are making headway on right now is from what i can tell will be better than anything you can get by "going at it alone".

Pinnacle holdings owns three companys. Pinnacle Airlines, Colgan and Mesaba. Pinnacle Airlines does not own two airlines and its pilots cannot gain a windfall from any intergration.

Oh and think on this. How will we all know it was a successful intergration? When we all got screwed. So on that note, all we have to hope for is a good contract.

 

[xjhawk]

Express Jet is hiring..... skywest is hiring.......Air Wisconsin is hiring.......

 

[SEVEN]

I gaurantee you that Pinnacle management wasn't the only thing keeping you from a contract the last 6 years

I think the majority of clear thinking individuals already agree with that assessment. There are MAJOR problems with the 9E MEC that are surfacing before all our eyes. They couldn't negotiate their way out of a paper bag.

 

[Flyer1015]

Who says this is the "right" thing to do? You? I think you're wrong and I disagree personally with the Pinnacle Pilot MEC decision to go against the grain at this point in the negotiations. With that being said, if a Mesaba or Colgan pilot wants to walk in circles with you....it's on them. Just so you know, walking in circles tends to be counter-productive.....especially in this situation.

You know, regardless of my thoughts on YOUR personal matters, I walked with you several years ago. It's about unity.

It's one thing not to take a stand and say nothing about picketing attendance. It's completely a different monster to actively take a stand for a MEC and declare a no-support. Your MEC has only looked at its own interest, without the interest of the other two. If there was unity, at the very least, your MEC would take a "neutral" stance on our picketing. But no matter. From now on, I'm sure our MEC will put only our own interests first. Can't count how many Mesaba guys I've heard touting a 1-for-1 integration with Pinnacle. Good luck! With you guys turning your backs on us in this critical time, do not expect me to support you anymore like I did a few years ago.

 

[Flyer1015]

Express Jet is hiring..... skywest is hiring.......Air Wisconsin is hiring.......

And I would give up my sucky position at 9E to start all over at the bottom of another sucky position with no upgrade in sight? I'd rather hang on at Pinnacle, an upgrade isn't too far away. The latest vacancy is kinda close.

 

[RJLoser]

Amen. XJ guys made a mistake in doing this. Think about it. They only statement you have made is that you are anti 9E. Mgt does not care that you are their patsy's.

 

[SEVEN]

You know, regardless of my thoughts on YOUR personal matters, I walked with you several years ago. It's about unity.

It's one thing not to take a stand and say nothing about picketing attendance. It's completely a different monster to actively take a stand for a MEC and declare a no-support. Your MEC has only looked at its own interest, without the interest of the other two. If there was unity, at the very least, your MEC would take a "neutral" stance on our picketing. But no matter. From now on, I'm sure our MEC will put only our own interests first. Can't count how many Mesaba guys I've heard touting a 1-for-1 integration with Pinnacle. Good luck! With you guys turning your backs on us in this critical time, do not expect me to support you anymore like I did a few years ago.

The truth is Pinnacle does not support us, Colgan or the interests of the negotiations. We are in this together....I don't see the benefit in the 9E MEC wanting to open this can of worms during this time. It's not about you anymore, it's about us. If the wisdom of our MEC leadership decides that picketing would be counter-productive at this juncture, then we have to support the decision especially when all the facts are not on the table.
The statement made by the Mesaba MEC leadership was in a nutshell: stop being hotheads and reacting with shear emotion.

 

[SEVEN]

XJ guys made a mistake in doing this.

No we didn't.

 

[RJLoser]

Time will tell.